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Which party is anti Israel?
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Cheiny




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 3:13 pm
It’s clear. Not only does the democrat party contain unrepentant anti semites, and leaders who do nothing to stop their hate, they’re also unabashedly anti Israel.

Senate Democrats Warn Israel That Annexation Would ‘Fray’ Ties With Us
VINnews.com
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ora_43




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 3:16 pm
Because they oppose annexation? By that measure most Jewish Israelis are anti-Israel.
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Cheiny




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 3:24 pm
ora_43 wrote:
Because they oppose annexation? By that measure most Jewish Israelis are anti-Israel.


Oh it’s hardly “just” because they oppose annexation. But you know that.
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Rappel




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 3:24 pm
ora_43 wrote:
Because they oppose annexation? By that measure most Jewish Israelis are anti-Israel.

Ora, I think you'll appreciate this opinion piece
http://www.israelnationalnews......23514

Polls in Israel are famously biased. Ask any Israeli imma here, and she can probably list off a handful of jokes on the subject. It matters not what the numbers are, but who did the poll - because they're usually trying to influence public opinion with a slanted poll, and usually have written and put out their own press release to do just that.
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banana123




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 3:30 pm
Rappel wrote:
Ora, I think you'll appreciate this opinion piece
http://www.israelnationalnews......23514

Polls in Israel are famously biased. Ask any Israeli imma here, and she can probably list off a handful of jokes on the subject. It matters not what the numbers are, but who did the poll - because they're usually trying to influence public opinion with a slanted poll, and usually have written and put out their own press release to do just that.

This made me smile (and chuckle).
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banana123




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 3:31 pm
Maybe Biden should take Tlaib as his running mate...
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ora_43




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 3:43 pm
Rappel wrote:
Ora, I think you'll appreciate this opinion piece
http://www.israelnationalnews......23514

Polls in Israel are famously biased. Ask any Israeli imma here, and she can probably list off a handful of jokes on the subject. It matters not what the numbers are, but who did the poll - because they're usually trying to influence public opinion with a slanted poll, and usually have written and put out their own press release to do just that.

Lies, d*mn lies, and statistics Smile .

But the poll itself isn't the point. The point is that it's silly to call someone "anti-Israel" for not supporting something that's very controversial within Israel. (And it is controversial, whether the exact figures are 30-34 or 40-26 or... etc).
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Rappel




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 4:30 pm
ora_43 wrote:
Lies, d*mn lies, and statistics Smile .

But the poll itself isn't the point. The point is that it's silly to call someone "anti-Israel" for not supporting something that's very controversial within Israel. (And it is controversial, whether the exact figures are 30-34 or 40-26 or... etc).


Ah, but there's the rub.

It's controversial in Israel because people are arguing about the best way to keep Israelis safe. All land? Less land, but consequently fewer Arabs? Democracy Vs totalitarian security? These are the issues they're debating, with the goal of preserving Israel.

The discourse in the States is not about keeping Israel nor Israelis safe. It's about Israel's right to exist on the "Palestinian homeland". There's no comparison.
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ora_43




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 4:32 pm
Rappel wrote:
The discourse in the States is not about keeping Israel nor Israelis safe. It's about Israel's right to exist on the "Palestinian homeland". There's no comparison.

It's about America's inability to say, "Sure, go ahead, what do we care about a few barren hilltops in the Middle East" without torpedoing their relationship with the countries that make the oil Wink
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OBnursemom




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 4:34 pm
The last two republican presidents were no prize when it came to Israel. Bush Sr didn’t defend Israel at all during the gulf war. Bush Jr presided over the disengagement. He literally bullied Sharon to do it. I tend to think like the Mishpacha’s Eytan Kobre. We would be deluding ourselves if we thought any political party aligned itself with frum interests. We need to continue to court both parties so we don’t live in fear when one or another of them come into power. The balance shifts frequently and the parties change on the regular.
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OBnursemom




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 4:37 pm
Adding to my above comment, see how Menachem Begin related to Jimmy Carter. Carter obviously didn’t care much about Israel, and he disliked Begin intensely, but they got things done because of Begin’s attitude and his ability to work with others.
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naturalmom5




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 4:47 pm
OBnursemom wrote:
The last two republican presidents were no prize when it came to Israel. Bush Sr didn’t defend Israel at all during the gulf war. Bush Jr presided over the disengagement. He literally bullied Sharon to do it. I tend to think like the Mishpacha’s Eytan Kobre. We would be deluding ourselves if we thought any political party aligned itself with frum interests. We need to continue to court both parties so we don’t live in fear when one or another of them come into power. The balance shifts frequently and the parties change on the regular.


You are mostly right , with the exception that Obama was in a class all by himself

He was the most evil anti Israel president in my lifetime, going back to Eisenhower
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OBnursemom




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 5:02 pm
naturalmom5 wrote:
You are mostly right , with the exception that Obama was in a class all by himself

He was the most evil anti Israel president in my lifetime, going back to Eisenhower


I’m pretty sure Carter is up there. Have you heard him talk recently. He is evil. Also if you think about it, there aren’t really pro-Israel presidents. Reagan had a fit when Israel bombed Iraq. Nixon was an anti-Semite who helped Israel because it suited his image. Even Truman voted for Israel at the UN because his business partner was Jewish and begged him to. FDR was an unspeakable word. And so on

Any president who listens to the State Department is going to be anti-Israel. They simply have no use for it. Or Jews either.
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Reality




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 5:35 pm
OBnursemom wrote:
I’m pretty sure Carter is up there. Have you heard him talk recently. He is evil. Also if you think about it, there aren’t really pro-Israel presidents. Reagan had a fit when Israel bombed Iraq. Nixon was an anti-Semite who helped Israel because it suited his image. Even Truman voted for Israel at the UN because his business partner was Jewish and begged him to. FDR was an unspeakable word. And so on

Any president who listens to the State Department is going to be anti-Israel. They simply have no use for it. Or Jews either.


All true. Yet President Trump has shown amazing support for the State of Israel both with words and his actions. Yet he gets no credit. I don't understand.
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OBnursemom




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 5:55 pm
Reality wrote:
All true. Yet President Trump has shown amazing support for the State of Israel both with words and his actions. Yet he gets no credit. I don't understand.


Sometimes you have a good president who is also anti-Israel. It’s unfortunate. Right now (in my opinion, don’t everyone jump on me at once) we have a president who acts like a child, calls other lawmakers names, and even his own party groans when he’s tweeting in the middle of the night who is pro-Israel. I like the pro-Israel part, I don’t love him. My point is that I want a pro-Israel president who is also good for domestic things. And we don’t have that.
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Jeanette




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 6:15 pm
OBnursemom wrote:
Sometimes you have a good president who is also anti-Israel. It’s unfortunate. Right now (in my opinion, don’t everyone jump on me at once) we have a president who acts like a child, calls other lawmakers names, and even his own party groans when he’s tweeting in the middle of the night who is pro-Israel. I like the pro-Israel part, I don’t love him. My point is that I want a pro-Israel president who is also good for domestic things. And we don’t have that.


I choose an American president based on who's good for America.

Fortunately, Jews in Israel also have a right to vote and they can choose politicians who will act in their best interests.

Middle east policy is a very small part of what a US president is focused on. If the rest of his domestic and foreign policy stink, that has much more of an impact on Jewish lives than if he says some nice words about Israel once in a while.
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Reality




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 6:16 pm
OBnursemom wrote:
Sometimes you have a good president who is also anti-Israel. It’s unfortunate. Right now (in my opinion, don’t everyone jump on me at once) we have a president who acts like a child, calls other lawmakers names, and even his own party groans when he’s tweeting in the middle of the night who is pro-Israel. I like the pro-Israel part, I don’t love him. My point is that I want a pro-Israel president who is also good for domestic things. And we don’t have that.


Thank you for explaining. I like a lot of President Trump's domestic policy yet I wish he would filter his tweets.
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Reality




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 6:18 pm
Jeanette wrote:
I choose an American president based on who's good for America.

Fortunately, Jews in Israel also have a right to vote and they can choose politicians who will act in their best interests.

Middle east policy is a very small part of what a US president is focused on. If the rest of his domestic and foreign policy stink, that has much more of an impact on Jewish lives than if he says some nice words about Israel once in a while.


President Trump has done a lot more than just say a few nice words about Israel.
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naturalmom5




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 6:21 pm
OBnursemom wrote:
Sometimes you have a good president who is also anti-Israel. It’s unfortunate. Right now (in my opinion, don’t everyone jump on me at once) we have a president who acts like a child, calls other lawmakers names, and even his own party groans when he’s tweeting in the middle of the night who is pro-Israel. I like the pro-Israel part, I don’t love him. My point is that I want a pro-Israel president who is also good for domestic things. And we don’t have that.


Before Corona we had the best economy and lowest unemployment in decades
You would prefer someone who talks nice and does nothing for you
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OBnursemom




 
 
 
 

Post  Sun, May 24 2020, 6:24 pm
Reality wrote:
Thank you for explaining. I like a lot of President Trump's domestic policy yet I wish he would filter his tweets.


No problem. In addition, because so many people hate Trump, they are critical regarding all his decisions, including the pro-Israel ones. Thus we have people I usually consider reasonable hating on Israel, because Trump focused on them. Such high profile decisions are in danger of being reversed and never repeated. I don’t know what I want, but having people (voters) hostile toward Israel is not a happy position.
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