Can't get away from herd immunity?

imasoftov

Thu, Jun 04 2020, 10:59 am

CiCi wrote:

I did not mean the mods at all. I was not talking about the mods at all. You have taking my words out of context.

Did I mean it literally that imamother is a "police state"? The answer is no, I didnt think I'll be thrown in jail for expressing my opinion. I hope that clears it up.

I did not think you meant it literally, as the mods can't arrest anyone. I understood you were using it metaphorically, claiming things similar to those that happen in police states IRL happen here.

But what things? I suppose a parallel to arresting someone for expressing their opinion would be banning them from doing that. A police state might also punish speakers in other ways, say getting them fired from jobs or not allowing them to attend university, I can't really think of an online equivalent, maybe they could reduce the resolution on someone's avatar or make them post in an ugly font. Police states also engage in surveillance of private conversations, online that would be like reading PMs.

If IRL you stood in public and gave a speech and a crowd, not sent by the state, shouted over you, preventing anyone from hearing you, that would not resemble a police state. Even less so here, when it's not possible to shout down a poster.

amother

Azure

Thu, Jun 04 2020, 11:34 am

CiCi wrote:

Thank you!! People made it seem like I want people to die. I just stated my opinion regarding herd immunity which I believed happened in NY. It's my belief that a virus cannot be contained longterm and if they would care about life here like they do in Israel with hospital care they provide in Israel the death rate would be half.

People have a right to disagree in a respectful manner.

..I'm thinking now that maybe thse who responded rudely fear death if I say that I believe the virus will spread. I never had that fear even before and while I had it, so I didn't think of people getting scared but maybe that's a reason why they responded like this.

I completely agree with you.
I have not read all the comments but goodness people have zero respect for different opinions.
I’ll start by saying that I’m in Australia. The virus here is pretty much no existent..
We did not go into lockdown. Most business & stores could stay open (many closed because they couldn’t afford to open) . Schools shut but most have now reopened Australia wide.
Our borders have closed to non citizens/residents.
Anyone coming now is in hotel quarantine.
We do not wear masks.
We wash our hands.
We keep 1.5m (not 2m or 6 foot or any other unscientific number) but that’s not really realistic as stores are full & life is returning to normal.
There has been no deaths for 12 days.
Yesterday new infections were 8, 6 in quarantine travellers & one living with a quarantined traveller.
So one infection. No spread in schools.
We are in winter now too.
In contrast our neighbor New Zealand went into complete lockdown for over a month.
Lo & behold their spread statistics were worse that ours.
Some sobering statistics ... the cancer hospital in melbourne has reported a 50% drop in referrals.
Suicide is up. People not going to emergency rooms with heart or stroke symptoms .
Domestic violence . Alcohol and drug abuse.
We will be reeling from these covid-19 consequences for years to come. I haven’t even touched on the economic collapse.
What will happen now? As a country we have almost no immunity. Less that 8k people were infected (highest testing rate in the world), population 25M.
Main industries here are tourism & raw materials to China. The first is no existent, the second badly crippled . We will have no choice but open borders (tourism bubble talks happening now) , once that happens the virus will be back & as a country we’re very vulnerable.
My opinion is that we would have achieved nothing by our restrictions. Closed borders & quarantine were the only necessary measures & only short term. The estimates based on the now debunked prof Ferguson which caused our restrictions in the first place, we completely wrong.
We cannot afford lockdowns & a vaccine is still a pipe dream.
Yes the virus is dangerous to a small percentage but we know who’s most at risk.
We need to balance the danger with deaths from neglected cancer, heart attacks & substance abuse etc. We must consider the very real danger of a global economic depression which may kill many many more.
There’s not going to be a win win situation. There’s a price humanity pays for living.

silverlining3

Thu, Jun 04 2020, 11:49 am

imasoftov wrote:

Even less so here, when it's not possible to shout down a poster.

When one repeats herself countless times, that's shouting down a poster!!
Go count how many times she said she's talking about a long term lockdown.

Maybe that's not your opinion, but it's mine- so ya, it doesn't make it a fact, just an opinion

Last edited by silverlining3 on Thu, Jun 04 2020, 11:54 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

Cyan

Thu, Jun 04 2020, 11:54 am

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

I work in place where they test, and the numbers are way more than single digits.

We dont know clearly what that means anyway.

Yes, its very sad that people died. But there really isn't a way we could have prevented it. It seems that people care more for those that died from covid than cancer or anything else..

Last I checked, cancer wasn't infectious.

And do you really believe that the deaths couldn't have been prevented? Of course many deaths would have been prevented if the lockdown would have been institued earlier and better quarantine or bans for people entering from abroad. I'm still baffled how people keep trying to dispute these clear facts.