What are the guidelines when others don’t keep guidelines?!

SuperWify

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:18 am

My4Jewels wrote:

But why have you stopped social distancing? I don’t get it? Where are the guidelines that say we should do this?

Honestly, why should we listen to guidelines anymore?

3 months ago- civilians should not wear masks. Leave it for the hospitals only. It won’t protect you anyway.

Today- don’t leave your house without a mask.

Oh really? I though they don’t protect me anyway!

Last edited by SuperWify on Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:32 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

Peach

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:30 am

amother [ Emerald ] wrote:

This, exactly! Why should every person over 60 and every person with a health condition or immunocompromised (which combined is quite a significant percentage of the population), not to mention all the people who live with someone in one of those categories, have to stay isolated indefinitely just because other people can't be bothered to follow the guidelines regarding wearing masks and social distancing?

I’m confused. How will socially distancing allow 60 yr olds to leave their house.
The expectation was never for it fo away. Just to flatten the curve.
If someone is over 60 they can still wear a mask and stand 6 fit away.

fleetwood

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:36 am

SuperWify wrote:

3 months ago we new nothing about this virus. We know better now! Wear the stupid mask!!

amother

Peach

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:37 am

I too was the last to stop to social distance in our community. The only thing we retained is kids not going into pppls houses (which I think will end soon) and wearing masks in shops.
This is why:

Daycares - my child is with 10 other 4 yr olds. They legally do not have to wear masks. They play in each other’s faces and ‘mouths’. My dr says this is okay.

Camp - kids will start traveling by bus in 2 weeks to camp. Somehow this is okay. Kids in camp will not sd because they are kids.

Shul - my s DH kept every minyan guideline. But at this point he can legally daven with his minyan where everyone is close together.

Work - DH is at back at work in office with co workers.

School - dr says it safe and legal to send to school with current setup.

So if it kids are on top of each other.
And everyone is sharing bathrooms
And dr says that is okay but must still sd it doesn’t make sense.

(I have a family member who is a dr who was very strict with SD but is now saying if someone were to get it now is a good time. Why wait till hospitals are full again. And because it isn’t rampant now it is a good time to live before it starts up again)

LovesHashem

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:38 am

amother [ Peach ] wrote:

They are more at risk when others don't wear a mask. If others don't SD than they can't. They can't walk into any store, or take public transportation.

amother

Peach

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:41 am

LovesHashem wrote:

They are more at risk when others don't wear a mask. If others don't SD than they can't. They can't walk into any store, or take public transportation.

In stores and transportation I believe everyone should wear a mask. Sd on public transportation is impossible.

What confuses me is the poster who said ppl not Sd with neighbors are being selfish to 60 yr olds. I don’t see how keeping my kids chained up inside helps.

Most situations it was always difficult to shop with SD. Seriously. Stand 6 ft apart in lines miles long while ppl push carts between you. It is physically impossible.
My mother is over 60 and realizes this. She shops very early and walks on deserted streets. Where else should she go that others SD would help.
She is a teachers. She realizes it is impossible to return to teach now because ‘kids are kids’ She can’t change that.

amother

Amber

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:44 am

amother [ Mustard ] wrote:

It’s nice that your immune systems can handle the risks (although I don’t know how you can be certain of that) - but what about people you may encounter, whose immune systems can’t handle the risks? The purpose of social distancing is for everyone - not just ourselves!

Well, I can't be certain. That's why I said it's a risk. Just like I don't know each time I get in a car that I won't be in a crash, G-d forbid. It's a risk. One of many I've decided is worth taking.

amother

Denim

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:52 am

amother [ Peach ] wrote:

This exactly.

We were also that family on the block who kept SD waaaay after everyone else was done with it, but once my kids started going to school and daycare and my husband to Shul, (under doctors’ approval) we gave it all up. I will still try to be careful in public for other people’s sake, especially around older ppl, but there is literally no point in refusing to let my kids play with friends or in talking to neighbors from across the street when my family is near people every single day.

amother

Peach

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:55 am

amother [ Denim ] wrote:

Of course older ppl.
I visit ppl over 60 daily and sit over 15 ft away outdoors so we can talk without needing masks.
No one is going to ppl over 60 and taking into their faces and purposely not SDing.

amother

Amber

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 7:57 am

LovesHashem wrote:

They are more at risk when others don't wear a mask. If others don't SD than they can't. They can't walk into any store, or take public transportation.

Before Corona, there were still other viruses out there. People who were more fragile died from flu too. Why was nobody concerned about public transportation or stores then?

Even when people wear masks, they are largely wearing cloth masks which maybe filter 50%. They aren't fitted well either. So why a person at risk would be comfortable going on crowded public transportation even with everyone in a mask is beyond me.

LovesHashem

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:04 am

amother [ Amber ] wrote:

This is worse than the flu. It has killed young healthy people or left them with health conditions for life. Why can't others SD - if they were rules and regulations OF course you can SD on public transportation. On a bus you can limit the number of passengers.

In a store - limit the number of customers and request masks be worn.

LovesHashem

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:07 am

amother [ Amber ] wrote:

amother

Peach

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:10 am

LovesHashem wrote:

Based on images I’ve seen public transportation in NY was never really SD. Bus drivers aren’t leaving ppl on the side of the road bec the bus is too full. Imagine the uproars that would start.

When ppl say they stopped to SD it means with family friends and neighbors that are in a safe category.
Most ppl are still wearing masks to stores.

LovesHashem

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:21 am

amother [ Peach ] wrote:

Not where I live. It means weddings of 300 people no masks and SD.
Send out more busses then.

tryinghard

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:26 am

fleetwood wrote:

3 months ago we new nothing about this virus. We know better now! Wear the stupid mask!!

Nope. They specifically said not to wear masks. But not because “we knew nothing”. It was because they were worried that dumb selfish Americans would run out and hoard masks and there would be none for healthcare workers. So they told us all not to wear masks. Political decision, not medical.

As for SD - the whole idea of “flattening the curve” was to prevent the hospitals from being overwhelmed. And giving us time to beef up our healthcare infrastructure if necessary. Nobody making decisions or recommendations in government or healthcare thinks that if we all SD perfectly we will eradicate this thing. It’s not possible at this stage. It’s about SLOWING it. Most politicians and doctors think nearly all of us will get it at one point or another.

amother

Emerald

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:30 am

amother [ Peach ] wrote:

I was that poster (re: bolded). Do your kids go near your mother? I am really struggling with this.

We are trying to minimize our exposure so our kids can see their grandparents, and honestly I have no problem with people letting their kids play with some neighbors. I guess my issue is more that my kids have been invited to numerous parties in backyards for the end of the school year and social distancing is not maintained and no one wears masks. It's very hard to tell kids they can't join their class and teachers. I understand the necessity of kids playing with neighbors, and each family can make their own decision (hopefully with their doctor's guidance), but these parties are not necessary and people do not seem to consider the fact that some families still wish to maintain SD.

Another issue I have is that people do not necessarily wear masks in stores even though it is required.

amother

Maroon

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:31 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

To be honest, I’m tired of gauging how comfortable or not comfortable I am and triple doubting myself because I’m not a healthcare professional to make an informed decision. Additionally, if I go by my comfort it’s somewhat difficult to impose my decisions on kids of a certain age, when they see what’s going on around. I prefer to have some confidence based on facts and professionals’ recommendations rather than my who knows what based on feelings.

Therefore, Id love to get professional guidelines which correspond to real life situation; as of now I have only « dream world » guidelines that are detachedfrom reality, or discomfort of guessing based on unknowns...

Hugs. A friend's husband couldn't daven in his shul yesterday because of the shouting match between the maskers, which the shul requests, and the anti maskers.

PinkFridge

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:33 am

southernbubby wrote:

I think that everyone needs to be on top of the infection rate in the area where they live and be ready to enforce the guidelines if there are chas v'sholem cases. Until then, there is nothing you can do other than declining to participate in non-compliant camps and schools.
If people still act like ninnies where the infection rate is going up, run from them like you run from fire.

The problem is according to an epidemiologist quoted in Hamodia, we're not seeing a second wave, we're seeing a first wave that's come back because of people not behaving properly. At least the adults should make a token attempt at masks and SD.

That said, bH there are fewer hospitalizations. Maybe as it mutates it's getting weaker.

PinkFridge

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:38 am

amother [ Peach ] wrote:

Should they be close together? And what about masks? This seems to be a big problem.
At least they should wear masks. Shul is NOT the same as a crowded store, unless you spend the whole time in the store talking in each other's faces. And spend upwards of an hour doing so.

PinkFridge

Sun, Jun 21 2020, 8:39 am

amother [ Peach ] wrote:

My mother is over 60 and realizes this. She shops very early and walks on deserted streets. Where else should she go that others SD would help.
She is a teachers. She realizes it is impossible to return to teach now because ‘kids are kids’ She can’t change that.

Stores need to keep the special hours.
And there needs to be some disability for people like her who can't work. Or a LOT of accommodation at work.