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Forum
-> Chinuch, Education & Schooling
Do you value caution or pugnacity?
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| I prefer my children to be cautious and not to interfere |
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10% |
[ 7 ] |
| I try to teach my children to stand up against injustice |
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90% |
[ 63 ] |
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| Total Votes : 70 |
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Ora in town
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 Tue, Jun 23 2020, 7:03 am
Do you think it is important in chinuch to teach children that they should stand up for their peers when they see injustice done?
Or would you rather teach that it is preferable, to hold back, be cautious and not expose yourself?
Do you teach your children that the majority is not always right and that it might not always be the right thing to do to go with the majority?
Would you be proud of your child if they stood up for a peer that gets ostracised or mocked by a peergroup? Or would you prefer your child to stay silent and not expose themselves?
Would you be ashamed of your child if they were a cheerleader in mocking or ostracising one of their peers? Or would you be happy if they are popular, even if it is at the expense of other children?
How do you teach those values?
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PinkFridge
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 7:44 am
Could I say no to any of them?
And understand, I'm not abdicating my responsibilities, but schools need to have anti-bullying curricula.
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paperflowers
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:03 am
I generally value standing up for what’s important. How to teach that? Model it.
Specifically in regards to anti-bullying, it is especially important to stand up for others. One of most effective ways to stop bullying is for bystanders to step in. Anti-bullying programs actually teach this and the kids I work with a much more familiar with this concept than I was growing up.
But I really don’t understand some of your questions. I guess I can understand teaching your kid to stay away from trouble, but why would anyone encourage their child to ostracize peers? Look the other way, it happens all the time. But promote? Are you asking in regards to something specific?
ETA: the other important skill to prevent bullying is to teach kids to stay “stop”.
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Ora in town
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:15 am
| paperflowers wrote: | I generally value standing up for what’s important. How to teach that? Model it.
Specifically in regards to anti-bullying, it is especially important to stand up for others. One of most effective ways to stop bullying is for bystanders to step in. Anti-bullying programs actually teach this and the kids I work with a much more familiar with this concept than I was growing up.
But I really don’t understand some of your questions. I guess I can understand teaching your kid to stay away from trouble, but why would anyone encourage their child to ostracize peers? Look the other way, it happens all the time. But promote? Are you asking in regards to something specific?
ETA: the other important skill to prevent bullying is to teach kids to stay “stop”. |
Well, I think a big part of the ostracising dynamic is that the ostracisers or their parents are not really aware that they are doing it, or not really aware that they should not do it when they are doing it...
So the parents of the class queens who bully their peers might just perceive them as very popular girls, as leaders, and might not see the perspective of those kids who get bullied...
also, when my child tells me "xy is stupid" "xy is boring" "xy smells" "xy is nerdy" "xy is a neb"... the first reflex would be to go with the child, and not to see xy's perspective...
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PinkFridge
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:22 am
| paperflowers wrote: | I generally value standing up for what’s important. How to teach that? Model it.
Specifically in regards to anti-bullying, it is especially important to stand up for others. One of most effective ways to stop bullying is for bystanders to step in. Anti-bullying programs actually teach this and the kids I work with a much more familiar with this concept than I was growing up.
But I really don’t understand some of your questions. I guess I can understand teaching your kid to stay away from trouble, but why would anyone encourage their child to ostracize peers? Look the other way, it happens all the time. But promote? Are you asking in regards to something specific?
ETA: the other important skill to prevent bullying is to teach kids to stay “stop”. |
A big part of the anti bullying is to teach all kids what to say before anything even happens.
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crust
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:30 am
Well, hopefully, you don't send your child to a school that has a mix of established yeshivish chassidish MO and JPF girls.
Especially if she comes from the boondocks without any previous exposure to that kind of life.
She won't know the language or understand their slang.
That's setting her up to be bullied. Almost like bullying her yourself.
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paperflowers
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:34 am
| Ora in town wrote: | Well, I think a big part of the ostracising dynamic is that the ostracisers or their parents are not really aware that they are doing it, or not really aware that they should not do it when they are doing it...
So the parents of the class queens who bully their peers might just perceive them as very popular girls, as leaders, and might not see the perspective of those kids who get bullied...
also, when my child tells me "xy is stupid" "xy is boring" "xy smells" "xy is nerdy" "xy is a neb"... the first reflex would be to go with the child, and not to see xy's perspective... |
As I said, people look the other way the other time. Your child is allowed to have negative thoughts about her classmates and she can even express them to you and you will likely understand her point of view. The parent still has the responsibility to teach their child to be nice to others. And the best way to teach that is to model it.
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paperflowers
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:36 am
| PinkFridge wrote: | | A big part of the anti bullying is to teach all kids what to say before anything even happens. |
What do you mean? Like teaching social skills? Saying stop before things escalate? Or something else?
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crust
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:39 am
| paperflowers wrote: | | What do you mean? Like teaching social skills? Saying stop before things escalate? Or something else? |
If a child keeps on asking out-of-touch, silly, dumb, aggravating or obnoxious questions most children don't have such great middos to stomach it.
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sequoia
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:41 am
ALL OF EUROPE is the boondocks?!
Crust, do you really think Jews only live in America?
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amother
White
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:43 am
| crust wrote: | | If a child keeps on asking out-of-touch, silly, dumb, aggravating or obnoxious questions most children don't have such great middos to stomach it. |
It's not an excuse to be mean. And name-calling is never a good look.
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crust
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:45 am
| sequoia wrote: | ALL OF EUROPE is the boondocks?!
Crust, do you really think Jews only live in America? |
Did you really not understand what I was trying to say?
Yes, if you're from Europe and you send your child to a school that has a mix of girls and youre expecting your child to figure it out by herself then yes you're setting her up for failure.
Why not send her to a school that has her style?
Especially if you live oot in Europe.
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Ora in town
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:46 am
| sequoia wrote: | ALL OF EUROPE is the boondocks?!
Crust, do you really think Jews only live in America? |
Everything out of Lakewood, Borough Park, Williamsburg is the boondocks! Even Queens, NY!!!
Read up in the thread about what "out of town" means...
Lakewood, BP, WB is the navel of the world... and all the rest revolves around it.. or is a quantité négligeable...
Last edited by Ora in town on Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:47 am; edited 2 times in total
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crust
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:46 am
| amother [ White ] wrote: | | It's not an excuse to be mean. And name-calling is never a good look. |
Where did I say it's an excuse?
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Ora in town
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:50 am
| crust wrote: | Did you really not understand what I was trying to say?
Yes, if you're from Europe and you send your child to a school that has a mix of girls and youre expecting your child to figure it out by herself then yes you're setting her up for failure.
Why not send her to a school that has her style?
Especially if you live oot in Europe. |
OK. I will not send my children to school in any of those places...
Yet, I am a bit taken aback that you would have such a bad opinion on all those schools?
Are they really full of bullies, as you describe?
And what is JPF, while you are at it?
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amother
White
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:51 am
| crust wrote: | | Where did I say it's an excuse? |
It's pretty obvious that this entire thread has an underlying, personal meaning.
You defend the bullying by blaming the victim for being out of touch and causing the bullying because of her cultural differences. You basically call her a list of derogatory terms.
I am surprised, it's not like you at all.
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Ora in town
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:53 am
| PinkFridge wrote: | | A big part of the anti bullying is to teach all kids what to say before anything even happens. |
Teach who?
The one who will get bullied?
the bystanders?
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sequoia
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:56 am
| crust wrote: | | Did you really not understand what I was trying to say? . |
I did understand, and I thought it abominable.
You ought to apologize.
Ora, you belong on this forum as much as anyone!
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crust
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:57 am
| Ora in town wrote: | OK. I will not send my children to school in any of those places...
Yet, I am a bit taken aback that you would have such a bad opinion on all those schools?
Are they really full of bullies, as you describe?
And what is JPF, while you are at it? |
No. Such a school does not exist. But had it existed the onus would be on the parent not to send there.
And then you wont have this whole situation so...
You have to come up with a better mashal.
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imasoftov
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Tue, Jun 23 2020, 8:58 am
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I'm wondering if I've missed an episode of this soap opera.
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