Singing and chanting in shul is banned

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imorethanamother

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 2:56 am

https://www.sacbee.com/news/co.....dnext

This is not a joke.

amother

Beige

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 3:59 am

Sounds logical to me.

imorethanamother

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 4:07 am

I hope you're joking. This is ridiculous. Notice Newsom didn't ban protests or outdoor gatherings, but specifically you can't sing in your shul while wearing a mask.

And then, this happened. Thousands of people protested just hours after he announced new closings. Did he come out and say you're not allowed to gather and protest? Not allowed to be shoulder to shoulder and yell about things? No. That's a constitutional right. Unlike my other constitutional right, which is to practice my religion.

https://www.nationalreview.com.....ings/

amother

Beige

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 4:14 am

I'm not joking. I'm in Israel, so I may see things differently.

I think the protests should also have social distancing rules - but it seems like America has lost control there, so I don't know what can be done.

RuralIma

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 4:18 am

Are there shuls opening in California already?

ETA: if singing is going to potentially spread the virus then this makes sense. He's not saying that people have to give up their rights, but adjust just like with countless other things that are changing in our post-covid world.
And yes, it would be nice if the same standard was required across the board, including protests, but it's California Can't Believe It

amother

Cyan

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 4:30 am

RuralIma wrote:

Are there shuls opening in California already?

Of course. Since shavuos. Officially with masks and Sd. But some are enforcing it, and some are not.

RuralIma

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 4:32 am

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

Of course. Since shavuos. Officially with masks and Sd. But some are enforcing it, and some are not.

Southern California?

amother

Cyan

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 4:34 am

RuralIma wrote:

Southern California?

Los Angeles

RuralIma

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 4:39 am

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

Los Angeles

That makes sense. Northern California and I think most of the Bay Area is still closed. But I haven't talked to anyone in the Bay Area recently so I could be wrong.

amother

Cyan

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 4:44 am

Does this mean no baal tefillos, or baal koros? I doubt any shul will go along with that.

imorethanamother

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 5:15 am

While New York was getting hammered, California shut down everything and if you look at the graphs, it kept infection to the minimum. Barely anyone got it. Once the protests started happening, that started the whole process. And yet government officials kept insisting that protests wouldn't likely increase covid, and that any spike in covid is probably due to other things than protesting (and looting, and rioting).

In fact, Newsom said that the spike is mainly due to restaurants, wineries, and bars, so he ordered them all closed. Except for his own, of course. That should stay open.
https://kmph.com/news/local/ce.....-open

He tweeted open support for BLM protests, nary a word about covid concerns. He insists that masks must be worn by everyone, inside and outside, yet never wears his. He doesn't wear them at press conferences, and doesn't wear them at protests.
https://twitter.com/AngelaToft.....49217

If wearing masks are so crucial, then what's the concern with singing? If it's so dire that people wear masks and that will stop the spread, what's the scientific difference between singing through a mask and talking through a mask? Or protesting through a mask? Or shouting through a mask?

Now, California is finally going through the surge that New York went through, only with far less deaths. So everyone is panicked. The data shows, however, that it's mostly the young people who are getting it now, and they're not dying the same way people were in March and April.

Like the injunction against Cuomo and De Blasio for openly supporting one gathering and openly condeming another type of gathering, the mixed message is the problem.

amother

Beige

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 5:16 am

I think people realize that it's very hard to sing through a mask, and that anyone singing will likely lower their mask.

shabbatiscoming

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 5:47 am

amother [ Beige ] wrote:

I dont think this will ever happen happen in israel. If shils are open, with 50 people max, they are not going to ban singing and chanting. It will never happen here.

DrMom

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 6:17 am

How on earth would this be enforced?

ora_43

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 6:43 am

Singing is traditional, but it isn't a critical part of the religious service, at least not for Jews or Christians. So I'm not sure this would be a violation of constitutional rights. Maybe someone will make a lawsuit out of it, and then we'll see.

Banning protest would be hugely problematic, although if there aren't guidelines about virus safety for protesters, there should be. Just like the right to practice religion doesn't necessarily mean the right to sing, the right to assemble doesn't necessarily mean the right to assemble without distancing or masks.

ora_43

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 6:43 am

amother [ Beige ] wrote:

I think people realize that it's very hard to sing through a mask, and that anyone singing will likely lower their mask.

Also, singing is known to be a risk for spreading the virus, because people who are singing inhale and exhale more deeply.

Scientists say group singing can spread coronavirus.

amother

Amber

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 6:47 am

imorethanamother wrote:

https://www.sacbee.com/news/coronavirus/article243973397.html#storylink=readnext

This is not a joke.

It’s the same in the U.K. Makes sense to me although I personally think we are opening Shuls too early.

DrMom

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 7:02 am

ora_43 wrote:

You can talk but you can't sing? How is it not a violation of freedom of speech?

What about rap music? That's somewhere in between. Can we rap tefillah?

thriver

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 7:07 am

imorethanamother wrote:

https://www.sacbee.com/news/coronavirus/article243973397.html#storylink=readnext

This is not a joke.

A pandemic is not a joke either.

amother

Amber

Fri, Jul 03 2020, 7:12 am

thriver wrote:

A pandemic is not a joke either.

Finally, a voice of reason who gets it. Thank you.

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