4 year old defiant and so HARD

amother

Tue, Aug 25 2020, 9:38 pm

My 4 year old DD is very defiant/ difficult. I am looking for recommendations for books and approaches to discipline and how to manage.
She is my only child and since she was born I have gotten compliments on how Im a "great mother." (Ironic because lately I feel like anything but) I have a babysitting group and I always loved kids so I would spend hours and hours playing with her, reading to her and teaching her when she was a baby. I truly enjoyed it. Did I maybe give her too much stimulation?? Now she constantly needs stimulation. Thats the first issue................. She follows me around the house all day, every day. I cant get dressed, make dinner, tend to the house or do anything without her on top of me, asking me to play with her, tell a story etc. The only time I am free to do anything is when she is having screen time or playing with a friend/aunt/ etc. (She hates toys. Prefers imaginative play, books, stories... basically someone completely has to be entertaining her). I often play pretend with her while I'm getting dressed and stuff but its exhausting.
-The even bigger issue is the behavior. She has a major attitude and just doesn't listen. This has been getting much worse in the past few months She sounds like a teenager sometimes. She is always telling her dad to go away and leave her alone. Hell tell her to do something and shell say flat out no I only listen to mommy. We both try telling her that Daddy makes rules too and she cant talk like that... to no avail..... We will be painting and she will start painting the wall or something that is not allowed. I warn her that we will not be able to paint anymore if she continues. She continues with a smile to see my reaction. I say thats it, we are not painting anymore. (I do try to first give warnings but if she continues I always try to follow through) I take away the paint , she throws a tantrum and eventually we make up and she calms down, (obviously I dont bring back the paint) But a second later she purposely knocks down a lamp. Etc etc. It goes on all day and all night. She purposely misbehaves. We try time outs, taking away privileges (screen time etc), rewards / sticker charts... complimenting the positive.... nothing works. Every night I tell her she is such a good girl and I love her....
Im exhausted. I have no energy left. But she only wants me. Im terrified shell become a defiant older child because it seems like more than the typical 4 year old defiance. but maybe it is??? Is it, please??

Oh the other issue is that my husband does not have patience or empathy is always criticizing her and telling me how badly she behaves (in private.... hopefully....)I try telling him all day to be more positive and loving towards her but he juts doesnt get why she is the way she is

Please please please, help needed!!!

Odelyah

Wed, Aug 26 2020, 12:55 am

amother [ Taupe ] wrote:

Does she have a busy schedule? It sounds like she might be bored.

OP does she have grandparents she can call on the phone?

can she listen to recordings of stories or books?

I know she's only 4 but there are some simple household tasks she can learn to do that would be helpful and she could feel like she was a contributing useful person and get lots of positive attention for that

she's really young; she needs lots of love. it's important to anticipate areas of conflict and avoid them whenever possible, before she gets defiant and has to stand her ground due to her strong-willed personality that Hashem gave her. Because once you take a stand with her or make an ultimatum it's bad for her chinuch if you don't follow through, but it's also bad to have a combative relationship with your child. Since she has this personality it's really really important to try to avoid conflict before it happens and try to identify the underlying issues (boredom? insecurity? lack of experience entertaining herself?) and needs (positive attention and love from her parents? stimulation? more sleep? a snack?) that she has, and try to focus on addressing those, rather than always reacting to her defiance. (Sometimes you do need to react of course, when you can't avoid it, but keep it brief and unexciting. That's not how we speak to Daddy, and shift to the next thing. Or if she says something rude like give it to me now! you can revise and model for her on the spot and say "mommy may I please have the cupcake?" and you can also answer yourself and say "yes as soon as we finish putting away the toys", or whatever..)

Odelyah

Sun, Aug 30 2020, 11:25 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Thank you all for the amazing replies.

Especially Odelyah. Do you do this professionally? I am going to read that out loud to my husband and try to internalize it myself.

Im going to check for strep too.

No, she is not bored all day. She is actually in camp until 3:30 all day, crazy as it seems, until this week when she did day trips with my DH's siblings

Im praying she doesnt have ODD or something that that G-d forbid.

Sorry I didn't check back until now. I'm so glad you found my thoughts helpful. No I don't do this professionally; unless you count being a professional mom of 8 ka"h Smile

who has hopefully acquired some knowledge over the years about raising some very strong-willed children BH, so I am happy to share what I've learned.

A couple of my children were extremely ~~stubborn~~ strong-willed, including my first, and I am very loving by nature but was sure I needed to focus on rules and consequences etc. because of course I couldn't just let it go if he refused to listen, because what kind of parenting is that? and I wanted to be a Good Parent who was consistent. So if my child was told to do something, and he refused, of course I had to insist, and enforce whatever rule, give whatever consequence I had threatened him with, etc. But there were always these battles of will that would escalate absurdly and that ended with my son taking a stand and not backing down, to his own detriment. Like it was totally not worth it for him, but he could not allow himself to give in and go to a 5 minute time out or whatever so we would have to up the stakes (we assumed) and physically move him to his room/ take away stuff/ increase the consequence over something that started off small and relatively insignificant.

So BH around 20 years ago, when my oldest was young, I spoke with an isha gedola, my morah, Rebbetzin Chaya Ausband a"h who was a great Telzer rebbetzin from the previous generation-- her father was Rav Avrohom Yitzchok Bloch ztzl, the Rosh Yeshiva of Telz who was murdered by the Lithuanian nazis. I'm telling you who she was so you understand that she was true daas Torah on chinuch for me. And she was the one who told me that since this is his nature, that I must be very careful to avoid conflict with him. Because if I give him an ultimatum ("Beryl, I said you need to do x. I'm going to count to 10 and if you don't do X right away you will have Y consequence, etc." so I count to 10 and Beryl doesn't budge and just gets really upset and more defiant) then I am oveir lifnei iver because I am putting him in a situation where I am basically causing him to be oveir the mitzva of respecting his parents.

This was eye-opening and life-changing for me because I heard much more rigid sounding advice from younger more American rebbeim/teachers that didn't sit well with me, and I would have perhaps expected a more disciplinarian approach from the older generation, but my experience was the opposite on more than one occasion. Which confirmed my feeling that some of the parenting advice that was being given by choshuv people who were in the younger generation (who are now in their 60's) was influenced by some of the secular parenting philosophy of their time, and not completely emes. BH I had access to the previous generation of gedolim, now in their 80's and 90's who have a true mesorah that BH confirmed my gut feeling about my child. I actually think that some of the advice now being given by younger rebbeim and also some secular parenting experts is more emesdik, because they emphasize the importance, above all, of the parent-child relationship. That it is absolutely essential for it to be very close and loving, and the most effort should be focused on this.

And again I feel a need to repeat one more time. She is so young!! 4 is barely past babyhood. Even if she acts like a little boss! She is very young and just needs love and more love. Basic structure and the security that comes with that, yes. But mainly lots of affection and positive, affirming unconditional love. That is the constant that never changes. You are the solid loving rock that is not so easily fazed by her childish behavior. don't react to her words at all-- yes a quick comment about chutzpah if necessary with zero drama, and then address the actual issue or need. (Not necessarily mid-tantrum though. Often you have to walk away and talk later-- especially with teens Smile

with little ones sometimes you have to just hold them /feed them/put them them to bed gently with soothing songs/back rubs and maybe talk later or not depending on the child/situation).

You are the parents and she is the child and when she sees that you don't react at the same childish level and engage and escalate, but rather show true parental love and concern by focusing on really "reading" her and understanding her and giving her what she needs, without drama, she will feel much more secure. And as a result her behavior is very likely to improve.

Because right now you are giving her way too much power and control in this unhealthy dynamic when she sees you reacting to her with so much emotion. That's really scary for a little child. She needs her parents to give her unwavering stability and take care of her. And as she gets older, her genuine respect for you (because you don't take her childish tantrums personally--you are the calm adult above all that turmoil), and her underlying bond of love, will naturally grow b'ezH, because she will know implicitly that you genuinely care about her, and trust that you always act with her best interests in mind, (even if sometimes it's not what she wants, and she's not happy about it, and yes even if she reacts in the moment with extreme chutzpah) because you have shown her consistently that it's not about you. Hatzlacha!! Hug

Last edited by Odelyah on Mon, Aug 31 2020, 12:18 am; edited 1 time in total

FranticFrummie

Mon, Aug 31 2020, 5:38 am

My DD was a delightful baby and toddler, super easy and sweet. Then she turned 4.

Oh. My. Gosh. It's a miracle we both survived. It was SO hard! I swear it was the longest year of my life. Being 4 is halfway between a toddler and a kid - and you never know which one you are going to get. One minute your child will say something very wise, and the next minute she will be throwing herself on the floor because the cookie she got isn't as big as the one she wanted. It goes on and on.

My personal theory, is that you have to go through this stage, so that when your child becomes a teen, you can look back and say "At least she isn't as bad as she was when she was 4!" It really puts things into perspective. I'm telling you, puberty and mood swings are NOTHING compared to what you are dealing with right now.

I think that a big part of the problem is that your DH is being so hard on her. She's hearing messages that she's a bad child, so why not have fun and live up to it?

She needs to be more involved in your life, not less. Pull a chair up to the counter and let her dump ingredients into the mixing bowl. Give her a spoon, and have her start mixing. Give her baby wipes, and have her clean the baseboards and the front of the lower cupboards. Tape a small square on the floor, and see if she can sweep all of the crumbs into the square. Have her fold washcloths and dish towels while you are folding laundry. Give her tons of praise the whole time.

The next time she comes to you and says she's bored, give her a choice of doing chores, or paper and crayons. She'll either agree to help you, or she'll eventually figure out what to do with herself. Kids cannot stay bored for more than 5 to 10 minutes. Their brains won't let them, and they will think of something to do.

Learning how to step back and let your child experience boredom is one of the best gifts you can do for them. It teaches them emotional regulation, and helps develop impulse control. If a child is constantly rewarded with an activity at the first sign of boredom, they will never develop these crucial life skills.

Tantrums will happen. This does not mean that you are a failure as a mother, that she is being neglected, or that you need to fix what is wrong in her little world. Dealing with disappointment is another life skill that kids desperately need these days. You can empathize, but don't give in!

~Mom of an extremely spirited DD, only child, who is now an awesome young lady with amazing middos. Very Happy