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Will the lockdown happen in Israel for the Chagim?
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banana123




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 5:50 am
Success10 wrote:
They should have very limited seating for indoors prayer, for elderly people who need A/C and such. But otherwise, it should be outdoors, or not at all. As others have said, if you're doing it already, do it right. And hopefully, not have to do it again.

Hopefully, but really, that depends on whether people follow the rules when we leave the lockdown.
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Success10




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 5:52 am
banana123 wrote:
Hopefully, but really, that depends on whether people follow the rules when we leave the lockdown.


The police need to enforce. Not just enforce, but inspect all the shuls ahead of the chag. There is definitely going to be violence.
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banana123




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 5:52 am
etky wrote:
This. Exactly.
This closure is beginning to look like Swiss cheese with a million holes in it and one of the biggest holes is allowing davening inside.
It's insanity and will defeat the entire purpose and sacrifice involved in the closure.

Mind you, and this is AFTER Edelstein said he would not allow any changes to his plan, because if it looks like Swiss cheese then it's worthless.

But he gave in anyways, on one of the most crucial points.

Edelstein. Please. Go back to your position as Knesset Speaker. Thanks in advance.
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banana123




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 5:53 am
Success10 wrote:
The police need to enforce. Not just enforce, but inspect all the shuls ahead of the chag. There is definitely going to be violence.

Agreed.

But, there would be violence anyways, unless we let everyone do what they want.
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DrMom




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 5:53 am
banana123 wrote:
Now you understand why I'm so frustrated??

Capped, but do you believe in enforcement? I no longer do.

I think, particularly in certain communities, people do what they want and they know nobody will stop them.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:01 am
banana123 wrote:
Now you understand why I'm so frustrated??

Capped, but do you believe in enforcement? I no longer do.
In our yishuv the gabbaim have been enforcing the number of people in shul every week. And mask wearing. I hope that is done in MOSt places. I know,it wont be all over, but we can hope that many shuls will keep to what they should.
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etky




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:03 am
DrMom wrote:
INDOORS?? Davka now that cases are exploding?
That is way too stupid for words.

Sorry for misreading. Indoors?? Srsly?

At least it is capped according to capacity. So 25 people in the big Belz shul that holds 10,000 people is okay; 25 in a neighborhood shteibel not so much.

Problem is, I don't trust some communities to follow rules, and it is hard to enforce unless police start going into shuls for surprise inspections. Not great optics, so they won't do that.


If I understand the (very intricate) formula correctly, a regular sized shul that normally seats like 250 people (men and women) during normal times will be allowed to seat about 90 -100 people for the chagim in separated capsules of 25 people, as long as there are two entrances and 4 meters of floor space per person. So the huge Belz shul should probably be allowed to have several hundred.
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DrMom




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:03 am
Success10 wrote:
The police need to enforce. Not just enforce, but inspect all the shuls ahead of the chag. There is definitely going to be violence.

Police should inspect shuls and put up huge clear notices ahead of time:

MAXIMUM CAPACITY = 34 people
(or whatever)


That way it is clear and not up to each shul to calculate on their own.
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DrMom




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:25 am
shabbatiscoming wrote:
In our yishuv the gabbaim have been enforcing the number of people in shul every week. And mask wearing. I hope that is done in MOSt places. I know,it wont be all over, but we can hope that many shuls will keep to what they should.

Same here.

But there have been enough reports in the news about shul that obviously don't give a d@mn that it makes me worry.

Not sure what else can be done, though. We don't live in a police state (B"H).
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banana123




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:26 am
DrMom wrote:
I think, particularly in certain communities, people do what they want and they know nobody will stop them.

I just want to say that the vast majority of people in my area are masorti. Just for the sake of popping your anti-charedi, anti-whatever bubble.

They are masorti (in the Israeli sense of the word, not as in Conservative). They go to shul, yes, every Shabbat. And almost none keep the regulations. (We also have some DL, some chareidi, etc. But the vast majority are not religious, or are masorti.)
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amother




Violet
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:31 am
DrMom wrote:


Not sure how voting for Litzman, of all people, will correct any of these problems. Perhaps because Litzman would be against enforcement of any rules whatsoever?


Exactly, the death toll is going to be the same or higher with these restrictions than if they were just recommendations or even silence; they are just ruining the economy and people's mental health and children's childhoods in the process.
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banana123




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:33 am
amother [ Violet ] wrote:
Exactly, the death toll is going to be the same or higher with these restrictions than if they were just recommendations or even silence; they are just ruining the economy and people's mental health and children's childhoods in the process.

That's not what Dr. Mom said, so I don't know why you think you're agreeing with her.
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amother




Babyblue
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:33 am
Sending everyone everywhere warm wishes hugs and heartfelt davening that Hashem Bless us all with a Sweet Healthy New Year for revealed good b'gashmius and b'ruchnius. Moshiach Now!!!
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DrMom




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:45 am
banana123 wrote:
That's not what Dr. Mom said, so I don't know why you think you're agreeing with her.

THIS
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DrMom




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 6:48 am
banana123 wrote:
I just want to say that the vast majority of people in my area are masorti. Just for the sake of popping your anti-charedi, anti-whatever bubble.

They are masorti (in the Israeli sense of the word, not as in Conservative). They go to shul, yes, every Shabbat. And almost none keep the regulations. (We also have some DL, some chareidi, etc. But the vast majority are not religious, or are masorti.)

No bubbles here. Smile

But there are communities in which the community leaders openly defy corona orders, and openly tell the press about it. I don't expect enforcement in those communities without external enforcement.

There are mayors of Arab towns who just a week or two ago attended weddings with 5000 guests. The mayor of Nazareth said last week he will not close down because he wants tourists (I am wondering: who?) to come to Nazareth.

Do we expect compliance with rules there? I don't.

Same for Jewish communities whose leaders exhibit the same attitudes.
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DrMom




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 8:46 am
https://www.timesofisrael.com/.....k6p4w

Things are going swimmingly in Bnei Brak.

Bodes well for the upcoming weeks.
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Mama Bear




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 9:45 am
I'm thinking about the large chasidishe shuls. I can't imagine that belz and ger and toldos aharon etc are gonna have 25 ppl indoors.
based on the videos I saw around pesach time of arrests, violence, clashes and protests happening in the chasidishe areas around shuls, I'm terrified of a repeat during the holiest of days. Not happy,
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etky




 
 
 
 

Post  Mon, Sep 14 2020, 10:16 am
Mama Bear wrote:
I'm thinking about the large chasidishe shuls. I can't imagine that belz and ger and toldos aharon etc are gonna have 25 ppl indoors.
based on the videos I saw around pesach time of arrests, violence, clashes and protests happening in the chasidishe areas around shuls, I'm terrified of a repeat during the holiest of days. Not happy,


See my post above.
They are allowed to have far more than 25 people indoors.
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DrMom




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 15 2020, 1:58 am
Now it turns out that the MAYORS of two red cities flew to Uman. Mind-boggling. Surprised

No hope of law enforcement in cities which have mayors with zero common sense.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/.....mi8me
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essie14




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 15 2020, 2:03 am
DrMom wrote:
Now it turns out that the MAYORS of two red cities flew to Uman. Mind-boggling. Surprised

No hope of law enforcement in cities which have mayors with zero common sense.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/.....mi8me

Literally no words.
Surprised Surprised
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