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Early minyan in school- from what age /grade?
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amother




OP
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 10:55 am
What is the norm?
My son's school starts requiring the boys come to early minyan from 6th grade.
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mha3484




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 10:57 am
6th grade in my sons yeshiva also. This year due to covid they are only allowing 7th and 8th grade and I am really hoping the change is permanent.
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amother




OP
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 10:59 am
mha3484 wrote:
6th grade in my sons yeshiva also. This year due to covid they are only allowing 7th and 8th grade and I am really hoping the change is permanent.


I feel like 6th grade is too young, especially now with slichos and all
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mha3484




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:00 am
I agree. I feel like 6th graders are still a year and a half to two years away from their bar mitzvah why do they need to be at school at 7:40am?
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amother




OP
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:02 am
mha3484 wrote:
I agree. I feel like 6th graders are still a year and a half to two years away from their bar mitzvah why do they need to be at school at 7:40am?

Exactly! My son just turned 11.
I honestly feel bad for the kid. He is becoming so resentful about davening
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keym




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:10 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
I feel like 6th grade is too young, especially now with slichos and all


Do they start minyan earlier with slichos?

My boys school starts in 6th grade. It's not mandatory in 6th grade, but that's the only time they can go on the bus. If I choose for my 6th grader to skip minyan, I'm responsible to get them to school on time.
My boys love minyan in school. They really give out the jobs to the students. 7th and 8th graders lain, are chazzan, gabbai, etc.
7th grade under bar mitzvah daven birchos hashachar. 6th grade does glila.
The Rebbeim really take a back seat. Literally all they do is supervise, and daven slichos.
I'm thrilled that my boys feel a participation and personal place in the minyan.
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amother




OP
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:17 am
keym wrote:
Do they start minyan earlier with slichos?

My boys school starts in 6th grade. It's not mandatory in 6th grade, but that's the only time they can go on the bus. If I choose for my 6th grader to skip minyan, I'm responsible to get them to school on time.
My boys love minyan in school. They really give out the jobs to the students. 7th and 8th graders lain, are chazzan, gabbai, etc.
7th grade under bar mitzvah daven birchos hashachar. 6th grade does glila.
The Rebbeim really take a back seat. Literally all they do is supervise, and daven slichos.
I'm thrilled that my boys feel a participation and personal place in the minyan.


They don't start earlier, but with slichos, the davening is much longer.
My son complains that it's soooo long. He also hates waking up extra early for the minyan.
He needs to be up by ,6:40. I feel like it's too much for an 11 year old. But maybe it's just my son that it's hard for. Sad
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amother




Goldenrod
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:20 am
My boys schools starts in 5th grade at 7:40 am!! It’s completely not age appropriate! The first stop in the bus route is at 6:35 am!! That’s way too early for a 5th grader.
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keym




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:27 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
They don't start earlier, but with slichos, the davening is much longer.
My son complains that it's soooo long. He also hates waking up extra early for the minyan.
He needs to be up by ,6:40. I feel like it's too much for an 11 year old. But maybe it's just my son that it's hard for. Sad


Is it mandatory?
When my son's were in 6th grade/11, I worked out a ride to get them to school by 9 (time class starts) for when he found it too hard to go.
I also rewarded him for going to minyan, but never pressured him.
Even now, my sons are 12 and 13, I will randomly give him treats (danish, individual container Shabbos cereal, or private trips for coffee and donuts just for the two of us) as a reward.
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sky




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:31 am
keym wrote:
Is it mandatory?
When my son's were in 6th grade/11, I worked out a ride to get them to school by 9 (time class starts) for when he found it too hard to go.
I also rewarded him for going to minyan, but never pressured him.
Even now, my sons are 12 and 13, I will randomly give him treats (danish, individual container Shabbos cereal, or private trips for coffee and donuts just for the two of us) as a reward.


In the Lakewood cheder 6th grade is optional. But most of the other schools have made it mandatory. But in 6th grade typically they won’t say anything if kids don’t come.
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mha3484




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:31 am
Minyan is mandatory for us after sukkos vacation for 6th-8th graders. Its a long school day 7:40-4:45 for a kid that is still a year or two away from his bar mitzvah. I think they would benefit from one extra year of being able to sleep.
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keym




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:36 am
sky wrote:
In the Lakewood cheder 6th grade is optional. But most of the other schools have made it mandatory. But in 6th grade typically they won’t say anything if kids don’t come.


In my boys school (and many others), the boys may not go on the later bus, only the minyan bus.
But as long as they're at their desk by 9/9:15 when class starts, they won't say anything or hold it against the student in anyway.
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SivanMom




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:43 am
My sons' school starts in 7th. I think it's perfect. For me 6th would be too young because I wouldn't let a 6th grader wait for a bus alone and I don't think a mother should have to be out waiting for buses 7 in the morning with other kids in the home. By 7th I was ok with my son waiting with a neighbor (8th grader).
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amother




Oak
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:46 am
Some 6th graders are just about a year from bar mitzvah. A 6th grade boy who has been kept back one year may have his bar mitzvah that year.
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keym




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:49 am
amother [ Oak ] wrote:
Some 6th graders are just about a year from bar mitzvah. A 6th grade boy who has been kept back one year may have his bar mitzvah that year.


True. I was thinking that. With the current trend of keeping deadline kids back, more and more Sep, oct, Nov, kids are the older in the class. Which means that at the beginning of 6th grade, there are many boys turning 12.
My son is in 7th grade and there are 6 boys turning bar mitzvah within the next 5 weeks.
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amother




Copper
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:53 am
sky wrote:
In the Lakewood cheder 6th grade is optional. But most of the other schools have made it mandatory. But in 6th grade typically they won’t say anything if kids don’t come.

In my son’s school in Lakewood, boys were supposed to go to minyan starting in 6th grade but it did not have to be at school. So they were allowed to go to a shul in their neighborhood and then go on the regular bus. Of course there were those who skipped it altogether, but that was their parents’ business. My son always went to shacharis with my husband and then my husband drove him to school.
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mha3484




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 11:57 am
amother [ Oak ] wrote:
Some 6th graders are just about a year from bar mitzvah. A 6th grade boy who has been kept back one year may have his bar mitzvah that year.


I think this depends on your school deadline. My son will have the second bar mitzvah of the class in the winter of 7th grade. There is one boy who has a summer birthday before him I assume due to repeating but I think in many communities being bar mitzvah in 6th grade is not super common.
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keym




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 12:02 pm
mha3484 wrote:
I think this depends on your school deadline. My son will have the second bar mitzvah of the class in the winter of 7th grade. There is one boy who has a summer birthday before him I assume due to repeating but I think in many communities being bar mitzvah in 6th grade is not super common.


But bar mitzvas the first 3 months of 7th grade is becoming way more common.
Meaning fall/sukkos bar mitzvas
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TwinsMommy




 
 
 
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 5:58 pm
but if minyan in school isn't mandatory, do you have problems getting them to daven the full matbeah at home in the morning or in shul? If I had a typical boy in a typical Jewish school (my only boy has intense special needs and goes to a non Jewish special ed school) I'd be grateful for school minyan so as not to have to figure out how the heck to get him to go to shul or daven at home because that's also not so simple!
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amother




Blonde
 

Post  Tue, Sep 22 2020, 6:08 pm
keym wrote:
But bar mitzvas the first 3 months of 7th grade is becoming way more common.
Meaning fall/sukkos bar mitzvas

Holding back has become really popular where I live. In my younger sons grade there are boys who will have their bar mitzvahs as early as April in 6th grade. Holding back an April kid is still pretty unusual but once you get to July it starts becoming more common.
Our school starts minyan after Succos of 6th grade. The boys eat breakfast in school after davening so my son doesn't have to get up that much earlier than before.
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