Responsibility to notify of covid exposure

amother

Tan

Sun, Nov 22 2020, 12:58 pm

amother [ Orange ] wrote:

This. In very small communities, I think it's practically very difficult to keep the school from finding out because everyone is so socially enmeshed. But the community being discussed is not such a small one.

Small enough that it is socially enmeshed Very Happy

yeah, we are

The joke is You don't need to use your blinkers bc everyone knows which way you're turning

FranticFrummie

Sun, Nov 22 2020, 1:53 pm

The schools don't WANT to know. They want to go on like everything is just fine.

Remember the underground, illegal classes? Rabbonim saying that schools so be open come hell or high water, the heck with public health officials? Parents begging for day cares to open again?

If the parents want the schools open, and the rabbonim want the schools open, then no amount of reporting is going to make one bit of difference.

Face it - as long as people are unwilling to guard the health of the community at large, there will be NO END to this virus.

amother

Blush

Sun, Nov 22 2020, 1:55 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

Well according to the latest research, it's safer to be in school than in the grocery store during a pandemic. So yes, I will push and push and push for my kids to be in school.

amother

Navy

Sun, Nov 22 2020, 2:29 pm

amother [ Tan ] wrote:

There aren't so many families that have kids in both schools... Sad

I

Can think of two in UH offhand. Hope it isn't them Sad

There are more families than that. At this point I would assume that anyone in UH was probably exposed at some point over the last 2 weeks. I've heard of other people (secondhand info) who didnt quarantine after showing symptoms and/or being exposed. I hope that schools will stay open but at the rate we're going it's more likely than not that they will be forced to close. And of course chanukah is around the corner and there are many families who will be traveling...

amother

Babyblue

Sun, Nov 22 2020, 9:11 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

How do you think this virus will end? By everyone staying home for two weeks? We’ve all done that a long time ago and it didn’t help anything!

amother

Teal

Sun, Nov 22 2020, 9:12 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

About 10 days ago I went to have a manicure at a friend's house. This is her business and I have been going for years. Fyi she is married with teenage kids.

That night she came down with Covid, and was pretty sick. I only found out because I texted her, that I wanted to drop something off at her house. She then mentioned she was in bed with fever (no mention of Covid). I asked a day later(full week after my manicure) whether she has covid, and then she told me she tested positive. I had planned to visit my elderly father and needed to know as any exposure for him is dangerous.

In the past week I have been to work, shopping and all around town, when I should have quarantined. I am quarantining now for the remaining time.

I am sending this out to let everyone know how urgent it is to notify everyone immediately if you have covid as there could be serious ramifications to many people. To date I do not have symptoms and hopefully won't but I am quite upset as remaining silent is highly irresponsible.

I would like to respond to the original post. I want to point out that if you have an elderly parent, it is your responsibility to ensure you are interacting with others safely. If you had gone to a salon for a manicure, would you expect the manicurist to track down everyone who came in? By going for a manicure, you are putting yourself at risk, and your elderly father at risk as well. I also have elderly parents and I am exceedingly careful if I know I will be seeing them within two weeks of my exposure. I also test before seeing them. If I am out and about in the supermarket or mall even with a mask, I do not feel comfortable coming in close contact with my parents. This is the unfortunate reality right now and it is up to YOU to take responsibility for your exposures. If you want to go about daily life, that's okay, but you can't have it both ways without risks.

southernbubby

Sun, Nov 22 2020, 10:58 pm

amother [ Teal ] wrote:

I agree with you 💯%
Many people who are infected don't test, stay home, or tell anyone anything. The disease is primarily spread by people who look healthy. By now, everyone knows this.
People often assume that people who are out in public are already taking risks and they don't feel the need to inform them of exposure. I know people who don't go anywhere or let anyone into their house and they have made it clear to the world that they do care about the risks. In their case, they may be missing out on important medical screening exams but nobody is painting their nails.

amother

Hotpink

Sun, Nov 22 2020, 11:17 pm

amother [ Teal ] wrote:

Good point.
Yes, the manicurist had a responsibility to notify people.
But it doesn't take away from the reality that each person needs to take responsibility for their own situation and minimize risks as needed. What if you had gone to visit your parents right after getting your nails done? It wouldn't have helped if she had called you the next day to notify you.
I am in daily contact with my parents. So, I go to the grocery store, post office, bank or similar places as needed, only places where masks and social distancing is strictly enforced. But I haven't gone to a nail salon, gotten my hair cut, or a waxing etc since back prior to March. Nothing that involves me getting close to someone's face or them breathing over me even if we both have masks on.

Teomima

Mon, Nov 23 2020, 1:00 am

amother [ Teal ] wrote:

I agree with you, to an extent.

Obviously if you're going to knowingly be around people at high risk, you need to take every precaution. That said, there is a difference between the people you pass at the supermarket, and a manicure.

In Israel, there is a legal distinction between close and distant contact. But if you are within two meters of someone for more than fifteen minutes or without a mask, that falls under the category of high risk. Meaning anyone who fits that definition has a moral, if not legal, obligation to report a positive test status to the other person.

So yes, whether it was a manicure at a friend's or at a salon (it's not like tracking would be that hard, they should have payment information), if the person I was sitting across the table from then tested positive, I would fully expect them to report a positive test status. Anything else would be immoral.

Needless to say, these days I don't step foot in a salon.

amother

Oak

Mon, Nov 23 2020, 3:33 am

amother [ Hotpink ] wrote:

Nails is done fully siting down. I went last week to someone I know sanitizers everything between clients, had a window open, wore a mask and had a thick plastic partition between us with a hole at the bottom to stick hands through. I also wore a mask.

The plastic partition and sanitizing made me feel safe enough to go.

chanchy123

Mon, Nov 23 2020, 5:15 am

I agree that OP is responsible for the safety of her visits with her elderly father, but it doesn’t obsolve the manicurist of her responsibility. In Israel service providers are required to have a list of patrons so they can contact them in case of exposure. In the summer, when restaurants were open they were supposed to gather contact info (but realistically I’d only encountered it in one restaurant and I was at quite a few).
I think it’s basic decency to inform anyone who was exposed, it is also halachicly required, even if not legally necessary.

southernbubby

Mon, Nov 23 2020, 7:52 am

princessleah wrote:

You don't have to contact everyone personally. That's what the contact tracers are for. Just pick up the phone when they call! And don't be paranoid about giving them your information.

I think that many people will not even talk to contact tracers because:
a) whatever they were doing was or is illegal
b) their contacts and possibly the contact's family members will be forced to quarantine and even though they should, it will mean possibly loss of income, school, or other inconveniences.
People who went to big social events don't want to cause legal problems for the host.

chanchy123

Mon, Nov 23 2020, 8:19 am

southernbubby wrote:

I understand why people would want to avoid any official record that that are sick and since I don’t live in the U.S. it’s hard for me to judge this, but just because you don’t want to officially report your illness doesn’t mean you are not responsible to make sure everyone you may have contacted is informed. I have heard many accounts of inefficient contact tracing in Israel, I don’t think it’s my job to wait for a contact tracer to inform your contacts, you have to be proactive about it. I do understand how one or two contacts could fall between the cracks of you’re really sick and not thinking straight.