Why would teacher do this?

SixOfWands

Fri, Jan 08 2021, 4:19 pm

amother [ Slateblue ] wrote:

An extra talent can't be compared to school work where the same girls get applauded again and again.

Well, according to people here, they should NEVER be applauded for academic achievement.

And of course the same athletes are always given credit. And the same musicians.

No one has EVER suggested "Chani, you work so hard and love to sing so much. We want to recognize your hard work by giving you the solo at he performance" (even though you can't hold a tune).

SixOfWands

Fri, Jan 08 2021, 4:22 pm

notshanarishona wrote:

Yes, students who work hard should get recognition. The problem is that kids should be recognized for effort and not for brain power . As someone else mentioned, many teachers nowadays reward based on progress and not just the letter grade.
The students who get good grades easily get plenty of recognition even without publicizing it. No reason to shame those who don’t do as well and add competitiveness to the classroom. Different people are capable of different things.

How is saying "Chani, great job on the exam. Chani got a 100%!" shaming anyone else?

And ob what other say, how is saying that making other kids work less hard? OTOH, if Chani is never acknowledged for her 100%, while the teacher is constantly praising those who don't work as hard, why should Chani try?

ValleyMom

Fri, Jan 08 2021, 7:04 pm

I am a teacher of young children but I will say this:
ANY teacher who deeply appreciates and values true productivity, collaboration and GROWTH would simply announce:

"I looked at all your work and I learned so much about what is happening in our room... I noticed that many of you are beginning to master _______ and that is terrific and I also noticed more and more of you are really processing _______ I also noticed that I have some extra work to do this weekend.... It looks like a few of you need me to explain _______ in a different way.... I will get to work on this over the next few days and on Monday we will attack ______ with a new pair of eyes..We all learn at different rates and I am happy to help you all... That is WHY I became a teacher."

In my classroom my children understand the value in raising their hands to say:
"I don't understand?"
"Can you explain the directions again?"
"I need you to sloooow down..."

Every Friday when my students get their packet of completed work for the week I give them a "word"that summarizes their week:
"Your word for this week is determination... you worked hard and you have some incredible work to show your family!"

amother

Royalblue

Sat, Jan 09 2021, 12:55 pm

amother [ Mustard ] wrote:

No, it's not irrelevant. Take a guided reading level for example. If you grow 5 levels but are still behind grade level you have still made more progress than a student who started the year at a high level but stayed stagnant or barely grew. It's about growth and challenging students at their level. Not letting high kids just stay where they are. It's about accountability.
Report cards chart this growth accordingly.

This makes no sense to me. If a student is always in the 90s, their percentrage may not grow but their level grows with the complexity level of the tasks. They obviously progress because the things they learn are more and more difficult

amother

Royalblue

Sat, Jan 09 2021, 1:00 pm

amother [ Slateblue ] wrote:

I have no problem with teachers praising good students. But teachers should also prasie students that put in lot's of effort and teachers shouldn't be praising the same students over and over again. This will cause the rest of the class not to do their best and not be interested in putting in effort. If the teacher keeps on acknowledging the same few girls, it shows that the teacher cares more about marks than effort and the class gets the message that the teacher only cares about the good students.

So how does the teacher know how much effort a student put? They may have also cheated...

amother

Green

Sat, Jan 09 2021, 6:36 pm

I cannot believe that teachers nowadays still do this[/b].
This was my nightmare growing up.
I was one of the 100s and I absolutely hated the return of tests.
I didn't have tremendous pressure to be called out because I b.h. Was gifted and always excelled.
I hated the looks of others, the jealousy and simply put the lack of privacy. I was used as a teacher's tool without my permission
I had great middos and it didn't make me more smug. On the contrary. I would often study with friends who were way weaker and I saw for myself how much effort they put in and felt how very wrong it was.
There was another gifted student who I suspect had to invest more than I did and was constantly jealous of me and pretty nasty. She spoiled things for me several times in incidents I'd prefer not to revisit.
I especially opted out of certain areas just so as not to always get this "honour" and do regret it later in life.
A nice compliment on the paper would have been just fine and personal. That would show that the school cares about ME and not just about my mark so that I could bring there average up...
I several times on purpose left out questions just so as not to receive this honour.
I beg those in power to really question their belief and see what is the purpose to this.

notshanarishona

Sat, Jan 09 2021, 7:05 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

First of all,
I have no problem with praising Chani in private. I don’t think it’s anyone else’s business what anyone gets on a test. As a teacher I frequently write notes or put stickers on students tests. They know if they do well.
Teacher could publicly praise students for class participation / work done in public. Their is plenty of space to publicly show approval without bringing grades into it.

amother

Chocolate

Sat, Jan 09 2021, 7:09 pm

I will give you an example of old school teachers. As a student, I was very bored and unchallenged. I used to get a 100 on every test without paying attention at all. I had a teacher who would publicly ask for each person’s notes and then announce she was taking 20 points off from my grade because I hadn’t put in effort. I was stubborn and refused to bother participating in copying notes off the board for what was to me common sense. This continued all year with my parents baffled at my one B-.
A teacher in 2020 would (I hope) challenge such a student instead of berating them for not trying.

shaynala

Sat, Jan 09 2021, 7:28 pm

I'm horrified for a teacher to do this....
marks is a combination of so many things, to mention a few:
1) effort
2) cognitive level (from Hashem)
3) other skills (focusing ability, organization)
4) home environment (are the parents creating and enforcing homework routine/bedtimes/breakfast)

for a teacher to humiliate girls like this is so counter-productive!! I would bring this to the administration if you feel the teacher isn't taking you seriously.

amother

Maroon

Sat, Jan 09 2021, 10:17 pm

amother [ Lavender ] wrote:

I'm just amazed how most Imas here do not believe that if the students study enough, they'll get high marks!

Even if you are a genius, you don't learn the material by osmosis!

Seriously, regardless of the teachers comments, do you really have so little faith in your children's intelligence that none of you believe that if they study hard they'll get good marks???

The lowest grade I ever scored through all my years in school was a 94, I typically got 98-100+, and was placed in advanced classes wherever they were separated by level. I often studied with weaker students, because I had a "save the world" attitude and sincerely believed that if I helped them study, and study more, and study better, then I could help them bring up their scores. I would spend hours reteaching material, creating sample tests, reviewing, reviewing, reviewing.

It rarely helped them more than a couple of points, even when they assured me that they now knew and understood the material better.

Because some people have weaker memories, and some people don't do well with written exams, and some people freeze under pressure, and some people don't do well with questions asked backwards (there was always that one teacher out to get you by phrasing the questions weirdly on the test).

Studying harder is not always the answer. And some imas here refuse to accept that.

amother

Lavender

Sat, Jan 09 2021, 10:29 pm

amother [ Maroon ] wrote:

Yes but I'm not even talking about students who are weaker or need extra help, I'm talking about the average student. The average student can study and get a better grade but most here think that people are born genius, average or weak and there is no way of moving up and down, and that is totally not true!!

amother

cornflower

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 10:57 am

Why are we so afraid to acknowledge academic achievement?
I was the kid who put in tons of work. I tried, studied and succeeded BH. Not 100s but 90s. But academics were not celebrated at my school. All the more so- if you were good at schoolwork then you were less likely to get a "good Job". Because "you didn't need it, you succeed in school".
So much that when they gave out jobs and I didn't get one I asked why not. They couldn't give me a straight answer but then said "we wanted to give you job X but then realized it wasn't going to happen this year". Fine. Until they ended up doing X and I still didn't get the job. I went back to the teacher who then couldn't give me a straight answer. I told them I knew why they gave it to those girls but that it wasn't fair I couldn't be seen for any achievement outside my schoolwork- which was private anyways! They admitted they gave the jobs to the weaker students even though I was told that job would have been mine. (Some of the weaker students had learning issues but there were also the kids who didn't try and admitted they didn't even open the book/Sefer but wanted my answers...both got the jobs. But never me.)
I got zero acknowledgement for anything. I suffered a lot from this. I was seen only as a nerd and bookworm because I was never given a way to show any other talent I might have had. I never got a job or large role and I resent those teachers. I felt "why try so hard at school if it only hurts me and stops me from getting jobs? I still worked hard because I wanted to achieve but really hurt my motivation and drive to work.

We have come a true 180- from only seeing academics to almost bending backwards to help those who can't achieve in the classroom to help them shine. But we will hurt other kids in the process. I get not giving the same girl every award and every "big job". but stop focusing on just the weakest. I had stuff going on at home and while I got good grades I really could have used the boost. Don't give the kids who can't carry a tune a solo because they want it. But don't prevent the honors student from getting it too.

SixOfWands

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 11:03 am

notshanarishona wrote:

So why not praise the student for class participation or other things in private?

Why is the only thing that isn't acceptable to acknowledge doing well in school?