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Why do some against the covid vacc believe debunkable ideas?
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 3:30 pm
S/O other thread.

Just curious. You're all up in arms trusting vaccine manufacturers as they push an agenda. That's fair.

Why do you blindly trust a bunch of blog articles that also push an agenda? How do you just swallow a bunch of myths and partial truths? Where is your cynicism then?

I really want to understand. This has been confusing me for a long time.
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 4:42 pm
Anyone?
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amother




Chartreuse
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 4:53 pm
I’ll bite but then I’m out.
I’m not swallowing any anti vaccine blog or conspiracy theories. I am just waiting for full fda approval. For years of actual research instead of rushed through trials. I don’t understand how people are so confident behind this vaccine. I feel like I’m living in a twilight zone.
Why are you taking something that they are saying we haven’t yet found evidence of harm so it’s ok. Don’t you want to wait until they know there is no evidence?
Don’t you want to see if babies born are reaching their milestones at appropriate age not say oh,I gave birth to a healthy baby.
There are close to 4000 deaths on the vaers website in around 6 months vs other vaccines in over 20 years.
Everything has side effects. It’s kind of suspicious that this is touted as miracle with no major side effects when it’s so new and unknown.
I would feel so much more confident if there was an iota of honesty involved
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 4:56 pm
amother [ Chartreuse ] wrote:
I’ll bite but then I’m out.
I’m not swallowing any anti vaccine blog or conspiracy theories. I am just waiting for full fda approval. For years of actual research instead of rushed through trials. I don’t understand how people are so confident behind this vaccine. I feel like I’m living in a twilight zone.
Why are you taking something that they are saying we haven’t yet found evidence of harm so it’s ok. Don’t you want to wait until they know there is no evidence?
Don’t you want to see if babies born are reaching their milestones at appropriate age not say oh,I gave birth to a healthy baby.
There are close to 4000 deaths on the vaers website in around 6 months vs other vaccines in over 20 years.
Everything has side effects. It’s kind of suspicious that this is touted as miracle with no major side effects when it’s so new and unknown.
I would feel so much more confident if there was an iota of honesty involved


Chartreuse again what you're saying is fair. I understand skepticism of the vaccine. What I don't understand is people who believe all kinds of illogical conspiracy theories, highly skewed graphs, etc. as long as it's against cdc/ big pharma/ general medical advice on covid.
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amother




Mistyrose
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 4:58 pm
I’m skeptical. It’s a new vaccine. I’m not ready for it to go into my body yet. Everything has side effects. Not sure if I’m ready for it.
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amother




Chartreuse
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:06 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Chartreuse again what you're saying is fair. I understand skepticism of the vaccine. What I don't understand is people who believe all kinds of illogical conspiracy theories, highly skewed graphs, etc. as long as it's against cdc/ big pharma/ general medical advice on covid.


Thank you for that!!! After what’s been going on on this site I was waiting to duck for cover.
The people who believe all these anti vaccine theories, usually live their life going natural remedies vs medical. It works for them. There are different paths to healing. They should all be respected.
Most though are not anti vaxxers. They are anti this vaccine FOR NOW.
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amother




Red
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:10 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
S/O other thread.

Just curious. You're all up in arms trusting vaccine manufacturers as they push an agenda. That's fair.

Why do you blindly trust a bunch of blog articles that also push an agenda? How do you just swallow a bunch of myths and partial truths? Where is your cynicism then?

I really want to understand. This has been confusing me for a long time.


While there are plenty of blogs, to assume this is the sole, main, or first source for someone's mistrust of the vaccine is a mistake.

Speaking only for myself, I am distrustful of big Pharma and standard western medicine for reasons that existed long before COVID was a thing. I had a bag reaction to a commonly prescribed drug that my doctor assured me was safe. (Later I read the insert and couldn't understand how my doctor didn't warn me of possible side effects, even if rare). I had a life-threatening medical condition made worse by treatment from top doctors; alternative practitioners saved my life. Finally, I have a vaccine injured child and I know others with vaccine injured children. I recognize that vaccines, in general, have done a lot of good for a lot of people, they are not 100% safe and I am angered by a system that makes believe they are, makes parents who know better feel crazy, and protects big Pharma from liability. Both my doctor and my rabbi have told me to avoid this experimental COVID vaccine, for myself and my family, at all costs.

Do I follow some of the so-called conspiracy blogs? Sure. But it's mainly because when you are on the fringe it feels lonely and it's comforting to hear others who share your view. But I've not been sold by or shaped by these blogs. I read a lot of books, I speak a lot with doctors I trust. I use my brain; I reflect deeply on matter. I daven for clarity.

You can all call me a crazy quack if you like. I feel I've made good choices for my family and I stand behind them 100%. And I'm tired of being painted as some vulnerable twit in a tinfoil hat.
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:23 pm
amother [ Red ] wrote:
Do I follow some of the so-called conspiracy blogs? Sure. But it's mainly because when you are on the fringe it feels lonely and it's comforting to hear others who share your view. But I've not been sold by or shaped by these blogs. I read a lot of books, I speak a lot with doctors I trust. I use my brain; I reflect deeply on matter. I daven for clarity.

You can all call me a crazy quack if you like. I feel I've made good choices for my family and I stand behind them 100%. And I'm tired of being painted as some vulnerable twit in a tinfoil hat.


Amother red I feel your pain and anger and I want to acknowledge that. Thank you for your post.

I still don't understand why anyone would believe the content out there and spread it to more people. You see things on this site like vaccinated people are a danger to the unvaccinated!? Can you help me understand why people would swallow this kind of idea?
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challahchallah




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:23 pm
Pfizer submitted an application for full approval a few days ago. It will likely be granted in a couple months or so. Hopefully that will increase people’s comfort level.
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:24 pm
challahchallah wrote:
Pfizer submitted an application for full approval a few days ago. It will likely be granted in a couple months or so. Hopefully that will increase people’s comfort level.


That's great news!
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amother




Red
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:36 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Amother red I feel your pain and anger and I want to acknowledge that. Thank you for your post.

I still don't understand why anyone would believe the content out there and spread it to more people. You see things on this site like vaccinated people are a danger to the unvaccinated!? Can you help me understand why people would swallow this kind of idea?


MRNA vaccine is unlike any vaccine given before and works in a totally different way and we don't know so much about it. Clearly it doesn't shed in the traditional sense of live vaccine shed. But people are speculating that perhaps being in contact with vaccinated people who are creating these spike proteins can cause symptoms or illness. Frankly, I don't have enough of a science background to fully understand this. My reaction is that it seems far-fetched, but also shouldn't be instantly dismissed either. I did worry about it for a few days. Spoke to my doctor about it and his advice: take your vitamins, continue to eat healthfully and take good care of yourself, and live your life. Worrying about this can only cause stress and make you sick and unless you intend to live under a rock you can't do anything about it anyhow. I haven't thought about it or worried about it again since.

Being skeptical, I can't judge those who are concerned about it. Being pragmatic, I can't lose myself in worrying about it.
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amother




Purple
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:45 pm
challahchallah wrote:
Pfizer submitted an application for full approval a few days ago. It will likely be granted in a couple months or so. Hopefully that will increase people’s comfort level.

How can it be approved without any long term studies? And why are they dismissing all the reports of adverse reactions and deaths?
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:47 pm
amother [ Red ] wrote:
MRNA vaccine is unlike any vaccine given before and works in a totally different way and we don't know so much about it. Clearly it doesn't shed in the traditional sense of live vaccine shed. But people are speculating that perhaps being in contact with vaccinated people who are creating these spike proteins can cause symptoms or illness. Frankly, I don't have enough of a science background to fully understand this. My reaction is that it seems far-fetched, but also shouldn't be instantly dismissed either. I did worry about it for a few days. Spoke to my doctor about it and his advice: take your vitamins, continue to eat healthfully and take good care of yourself, and live your life. Worrying about this can only cause stress and make you sick and unless you intend to live under a rock you can't do anything about it anyhow. I haven't thought about it or worried about it again since.

Being skeptical, I can't judge those who are concerned about it. Being pragmatic, I can't lose myself in worrying about it.


I do have some science background and a claim like this really makes no sense.
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amother




Purple
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:50 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
I do have some science background and a claim like this really makes no sense.

I would answer your question but you opened your thread to attack people who have a different view than you so I dont bother. Feel free to read the other threads on this topic to understand why people are hesitant to take the covid vaccine.
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amother




Chartreuse
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:52 pm
amother [ Purple ] wrote:
I would answer your question but you opened your thread to attack people who have a different view than you so I dont bother. Feel free to read the other threads on this topic to understand why people are hesitant to take the covid vaccine.

I feel like this thread is the first respectful thread we had. I don’t think op is attacking. Can we keep this open minded. There are so many other threads to let your anger out.
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:52 pm
amother [ Purple ] wrote:
I would answer your question but you opened your thread to attack people who have a different view than you so I dont bother. Feel free to read the other threads on this topic to understand why people are hesitant to take the covid vaccine.


I don't want to attack. I'm trying to understand from a psychological or emotional perspective why people turn to these alternative theories which don't sound at all rational to me.
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amother




Fuchsia
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:52 pm
amother [ Chartreuse ] wrote:
I’ll bite but then I’m out.
I’m not swallowing any anti vaccine blog or conspiracy theories. I am just waiting for full fda approval. For years of actual research instead of rushed through trials. I don’t understand how people are so confident behind this vaccine. I feel like I’m living in a twilight zone.
Why are you taking something that they are saying we haven’t yet found evidence of harm so it’s ok. Don’t you want to wait until they know there is no evidence?
Don’t you want to see if babies born are reaching their milestones at appropriate age not say oh,I gave birth to a healthy baby.
There are close to 4000 deaths on the vaers website in around 6 months vs other vaccines in over 20 years.
Everything has side effects. It’s kind of suspicious that this is touted as miracle with no major side effects when it’s so new and unknown.
I would feel so much more confident if there was an iota of honesty involved


I agree with this. I am also perplexed and kind of horrified as to why people would run to vaccinate children when COVID barely affects them. And CDC retracted their claim that children are superspreaders. So why inject something into our children with so little data to back it up. I know they aren't getting the shots yet, but it definitely will happen soon.
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amother




Purple
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:55 pm
amother [ Chartreuse ] wrote:
I feel like this thread is the first respectful thread we had. I don’t think op is attacking. Can we keep this open minded. There are so many other threads to let your anger out.

The title alone is antagonistic and meant to attack people with a different view than op. Why say "anti-vaxer" and "swallowing propaganda" when people (most of whom are pro-vax) have legitimate concerns about an experimental vaccine with no long term studies?
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 5:56 pm
amother [ Purple ] wrote:
The title alone is antagonistic and meant to attack people with a different view than op. Why say "anti-vaxer" and "swallowing propaganda" when people (most of whom are pro-vax) have legitimate concerns about an experimental vaccine with no long term studies?


I am open to changing the title. What do you think would be an appropriate one instead?
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Kiwi13




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, May 10 2021, 6:00 pm
I’m not into conspiracy theories. BUT some things are blatant. Don’t tell me you’ve “debunked” claims of fertility issues or anything else based on insufficient evidence. Insufficient evidence means you don’t have enough to prove it one way OR THE OTHER. I agree with the posters who are skeptical over lack of honesty. This disease AND its cure have been weaponized as a tool of compliance. That’s an issue for another million threads. We’ve been down that road already.

I’m pro vaccines. I’m anti shoving a NEW vaccine on people with claims that the “benefits outweigh the risks.” The government is not everybody’s doctor. Nowhere else in medicine do you see blanket claims like this, especially not with a newly developed, experimental treatment.

One day I might get the vaccine if there’s enough evidence. Until then, it says a lot to be that the doctor I trust most told me she had to get the vaccine to keep her job but she recommended that I and my family hold off. It was clear she didn’t want to be quoted as saying such. In my case it’s an easy reason to say no: I have known immune issues with platelets and the vaccines have a known potential side effect that, if I get it, will throw me into a fight for my life that I’ll probably lose within hours. Meanwhile, my chances of surviving COVID are over 99%. I’m tired of having to explain that to people who buy into every word the CDC says (for now, because it keeps changing. That’s how well we really understand COVID and the vaccines). She didn’t say don’t EVER get the vaccine, but she cautioned us to wait until more is known about long term effects and effectiveness.

Concerning statistics, you can tell any story you want by including this, not including that, defining terms ever so slightly differently... and that applies to the “anti-vaxxers” too (but that label in this instance is highly offensive and presumptive). I’m not blindly drinking anybody’s Koolaid. I have retained the lost art of critical thinking.
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