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Would you be happy if
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amother
OP


 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 12:42 pm
the money you gave as tzedoko was given to a kollel family?

With 2 little ones. The husband learns all day, morning, afternoon and evening seder, plus shabbos kollel. Wife works part time, yet struggling to make ends meet. No financial support from either families. They live frugally, eat out rarely (maybe once in a few months), wife spends less than $400 on clothing throughout a year, no car. Small 2 bedroom apartment that is not new.

Would you consider your tzedoko money well spent? Or would you rather spend on other causes?
Thanks for your responses Smile
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ShishKabob




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 12:43 pm
If the husband really learns, then yes of course I would consider it well spent! Supporting Torah learning is #1 as it says Vtalmud Torah Kneged Kulam!
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Teomima




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 12:48 pm
Personally I prefer to give tzadaka to medical organizations. I think supporting Torah learning is wonderful but I'd rather my money go to people who are in desperate need for it (lifesaving circumstances) before giving to people who are perfectly capable of supporting themselves need be. But I'm also in a position where finances are really tight so I'm very careful with what little I can give. I might feel differently if I had more to give.
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MommyM




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 12:51 pm
Yes.
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lamplighter




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:00 pm
I do support Torah learning but I would give my tzedaka money to emergency unavoidable circumstances before a lifestyle choice. Maybe if I had lots of money my answer would be different.
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miami85




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:02 pm
Bnei Yisroel once had a built-in system, it was known as the "Yissochar-Zevulun" partnership. Yissochar was the working shevet and they supported Torah learning of Zevulun. Once upon a time the only shevatim who learned regularly were Zevulun and Levi. In other words, 2/12 or 1/6th. The other shevatim were involved in some sort of business--merchants, daily wares, teachers, or farmers.

The modern-day kollel system was an attempt to push boys with aptitude for learning towards kollel because SO many were headed for college and business. It became SO popular with such an enticing spiritual sales-pitch that we now have MORE than 1/6th of Jews that want to sit and learn--at least for a few years. Many more perhaps SHOULD go out and get a profession. My husband learned for a number of years, got smicha and while he'd like to be doing something along the lines of klei kodesh, he's working a 9-5 job and making a reasonable wage. But for those who can't learn, they should be eager to support those in learning and not see it as "not earning a living" but being part of the 1/6th that is sustaining the world.
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amother
Olive


 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:04 pm
I might be ok since I can probably use torah learning zchusim but my husband would probably not so we wouldn't give. He has had bad experience with people who are supposedly very "learned". He purposely took off his black hat in order not be associated with "yesheivish people". We used to donate to kollels but not anymore Sad


also as lamplighter wrote "I do support Torah learning but I would give my tzedaka money to emergency unavoidable circumstances before a lifestyle choice. Maybe if I had lots of money my answer would be different." that's also how we usually try to do it.
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allthingsblue




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:06 pm
Sure. Why not
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ShishKabob




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:06 pm
amother [ Olive ] wrote:
I personally would probably be ok since I can probably use my torah learning zchusim but my husband would probably not so we wouldn't give. He has had bad experience with people who are supposedly very "learned". He purposely took off his black hat in order not be associated with "yesheivish people". We used to donate to kollels but not anymore Sad
Hugs! Sorry about what you went through and also to your dh that was disappointed. However, you don't have to give to a "kollel", you can find a Talmud chochom that actually learns and that your dh respects and give directly to them, not to the institution called Kollel, if that's what makes you more comfortable! Good luck and hatzlocha!
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Kiwi13




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:07 pm
Yes.
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amother
Ginger


 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:09 pm
I love the idea of supporting real Torah learning, but I don't love supporting bench warmers who just show up because that's what their community expects them to do.

There needs to be less shame around working an actual job if you don't have the kop to sit all day and learn.

I think that given the choice, I'd rather support a widow with 10 kids, who's husband suddenly died. That's definitely something that is really unexpected and a total emergency.
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Crookshanks




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:13 pm
Yes.
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amother
Olive


 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:15 pm
ShishKabob wrote:
Hugs! Sorry about what you went through and also to your dh that was disappointed. However, you don't have to give to a "kollel", you can find a Talmud chochom that actually learns and that your dh respects and give directly to them, not to the institution called Kollel, if that's what makes you more comfortable! Good luck and hatzlocha!



not so simple but really an old rabbi of his recently mentioned in conversation that he needed money to publish a sefer and we quickly gave him the whole sum he needed. so yeah if he likes the person he'll give but I think he also felt more comfortable because this wasn't a I can't afford my life because of decisions I make but an extra thing that his rabbi wanted to do that my husband was happy to make happen . but I think op was talking more about if we don't know the person, they are just a "random" kollel family living frugally and to that I said my dh probably wouldn't want to give. I'm just being honest since I figuere that's what the op wants Wink
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amother
Cerulean


 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:16 pm
I really enjoy giving to people rather than to orgs. Gives me personal satisfaction seeing my money helps someone have an easier life.
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amother
Sienna


 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:18 pm
No. Kollel life is a choice. A worthy one, but a choice nonetheless. Like others have said, I’d rather give my money to people or organizations who are facing or help people who are facing serious, life-altering situations.
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amother
Slategray


 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:19 pm
Absolutely
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moonstone




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:31 pm
Absolutely not.
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small bean




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:33 pm
I would be okay with it but I would ask about the families future plans if they are not making it with 2 kids
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cbsp




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:40 pm
miami85 wrote:
Bnei Yisroel once had a built-in system, it was known as the "Yissochar-Zevulun" partnership. Yissochar was the working shevet and they supported Torah learning of Zevulun. Once upon a time the only shevatim who learned regularly were Zevulun and Levi. In other words, 2/12 or 1/6th. The other shevatim were involved in some sort of business--merchants, daily wares, teachers, or farmers.

The modern-day kollel system was an attempt to push boys with aptitude for learning towards kollel because SO many were headed for college and business. It became SO popular with such an enticing spiritual sales-pitch that we now have MORE than 1/6th of Jews that want to sit and learn--at least for a few years. Many more perhaps SHOULD go out and get a profession. My husband learned for a number of years, got smicha and while he'd like to be doing something along the lines of klei kodesh, he's working a 9-5 job and making a reasonable wage. But for those who can't learn, they should be eager to support those in learning and not see it as "not earning a living" but being part of the 1/6th that is sustaining the world.


I've seen it stipulated that you need to include all yidden when doing such a calculation...

Those who classify themselves as secular are not exactly learning Torah - can you do the math now?
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amother
cornflower


 

Post Mon, May 24 2021, 1:46 pm
there is an order in judiasm as to where to give tzedakah. talk to LOR
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