S/o What is wrong with WhatsApp?

amother

Honeydew

Mon, May 31 2021, 5:28 pm

amother [ Floralwhite ] wrote:

Do these bosses provide phones that are capable of WhatsApp to their employees and pay data fees.
What if it’s on employee computer?
Are employees required to respond when not working?

To me WhatsApp is extremely unprofessional to use. Email or teams or slack is more appropriate for a work environment.

Lots of business adopt a casual style of professionalism.

Some workplaces, depending on the nature of their work, do expect employees to respond when not working.

The majority of businesses today utilize internet as a structural foundation for their setup. Excluding the ones sitting in the center of the yiddishe hotspots, it is expected that all adults have the basic access to it. So just like the workplaces leave you to figure out your transportation to and from, they leave you to figure out how you will connect via the cyberworld to them.

If someone cannot figure out a method of commute to a business, then he can't sign up for the position - unless of course he is so valuable that the business will provide him the means of transport.
Similarly, if someone can't have the necessary tools to communicate in an internet based world of business, he can't accept the job - unless of course he is so valuable that the business is willing to supply him with workarounds.

But waltzing into a business, (especially without being upfront about your communication expectations), and expecting co-workers to make up for personal choices, is disrespectful to everyone around you.

amother

Goldenrod

Mon, May 31 2021, 5:30 pm

amother [ Floralwhite ] wrote:

No, the bosses usually do not provide phones, though there are exceptions. No, the employers do not pay data fees, just like they do not pay your hairdresser, or pay for your purse, shoes, clothing.
It is simply expected that you have a smartphone.
Imagine I started complaining that I am a SAHM and I wear sweatpants all day but I want to work in a proper professional setting. Would I be right to say it's their responsibility to buy me professional clothes? Why not?

Since when does a work place cover all work expenses?

Your second question - I guess it can be on an employee computer if they have. Why not? You still need a phone though to have whatsapp, or it won't connect to a computer.

Are employees required to respond when not working? Unfortunately, usually, yes. Unfortunately many places of work today expect some sort of response even after hours. That's one of the disadvantages of the modern working world. Of course this will vary by place and profession.

And again - unprofessional is a matter of opinion and culture. Email is far less professional for group work, it's awkward and less straightforward. It gets very messy when multiple people are responding. What's professional about that? I can't respond regarding slack or teams, I have no idea what those are, but if my boss required them, I would.

amother

Honeydew

Mon, May 31 2021, 5:30 pm

amother [ Floralwhite ] wrote:

Who sends WhatsApp to reschedule appts. I’ve never heard of that.
You send meeting invites over email. Update if needed. Add to employee calendars.
This sounds so unprofessional.

What you and I call unprofessional, can be someone else's professional. Besides, there's a host of small businesses who don't have setups as employee calendars, etc. That is the beauty of being a business owner, you get to decide how professional or unprofessional you want your setup to be. And that's the downside of being an employee - you don't get to delegate the mode of operations at your workplace.

singleagain

Mon, May 31 2021, 5:31 pm

amother [ Floralwhite ] wrote:

Who sends WhatsApp to reschedule appts. I’ve never heard of that.
You send meeting invites over email. Update if needed. Add to employee calendars.
This sounds so unprofessional.

Voice to text

Not every person in every business is at a desk all day.

Most of my managers have email on their phone as well as WhatsApp but they communicate with the sales people on WhatsApp or text or email because it's on their phone your sales people are running around from store to store to store to store They don't have time to sit and look at an email they're all doing it by WhatsApp. Especially as it's easier on WhatsApp to send things like new items or here I need you to look at the circular or the blast and make sure your items are correct or else the sales going to go out wrong and then the customers are going to come in and expect a different sale and get mad at us.

So yeah I'll continue to use WhatsApp

Notsobusy

Mon, May 31 2021, 5:58 pm

Crookshanks wrote:

In my company anyone who needs a smartphone for work is given one. It's common courtesy to allow people to keep their work and personal lives separate.

You're living and working in a bubble. Most people in the U.S. have smart phones. And outside of the heimish companies in the tristate area, companies are not giving phones to employees who don't have one.

Mommyg8

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:14 pm

Notsobusy wrote:

My husband does not work for a heimish company at all, actually not even any Jewish coworkers. He was given a smartphone to use for business as he only has a flip phone. And communication is still via email, which is actually way more professional (you can't delete email the way you can delete a whatsapp comment).

amother

Honeydew

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:17 pm

Mommyg8 wrote:

Again - email is only good for one on one communication style. You can't have a group chat via email. If your business doesn't need the structure of a group chat, then this discussion is not relevant.

Also - email is very dysfunctional for time-sensitive communication. If your business doesn't need time-sensitive communication, then this discussion doesn't apply either.

Mommyg8

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:20 pm

amother [ Honeydew ] wrote:

But waltzing into a business, (especially without being upfront about your communication expectations), and expecting co-workers to make up for personal choices, is disrespectful to everyone around you.

This is something that should be clarified before hiring a new employee. It seems like the HR in these companies are really not doing their job if they hire someone for a position that requires WhatsApp without checking that the potential employee has those capabilities. It's just ridiculous to assume that the employee has that.

And yes, if a potential position requires a specific uniform that should definitely be clarified before hiring someone.

There seems to be a lot of unprofessionalism all around.

amother

Seafoam

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:20 pm

I understand people don't have whatsapp (I use it solely for work.)

But, I don't get this talk of the company having to provide the smartphone for you. That's nothing to do with principles, only about money. If you're willing to have it for work, why can't you just buy it yourself if it's needed?

You can keep your personal and work life separate if you wish. But, not sure why you're expecting the company hiring you to finance it. (If they offer, great. But, some of you are making it sound like you expect it to be a given.)

Mommyg8

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:22 pm

amother [ Honeydew ] wrote:

My point is that my husband does not live in a bubble. He works for a huge corporation with thousands of employees. Not every job requires WhatsApp and instant group communication. And like I said, if this specific job requires that, make sure to clarify this before hiring.

ETA: communication is a two way street. If the potential employee is aware that this job might require a smartphone, she should clarify before taking the job.

Last edited by Mommyg8 on Mon, May 31 2021, 6:51 pm; edited 1 time in total

amother

Amber

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:28 pm

amother [ Seafoam ] wrote:

Actually, I disagree about this one. If it's for work purposes, it's a form of office supplies.

amother

Honeydew

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:28 pm

Mommyg8 wrote:

Being that almost every adult in today's society has a smartphone, and most people have no reserves about downloading apps for workplace functions, it's not given much thought at all. It's an automatic assumption that if you have any difficulties or need specific accommodations you'll be forthcoming from the start.

Most employers don't run through their workplace platforms and application processes with prospective hires. In the working world, it is the norm for the employees to work with the employers requirements. If someone has issues with a commonplace resource, it is incumbent upon the employee to bring the matter to the boss's attention & not the other way around.

amother

Seafoam

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:31 pm

amother [ Amber ] wrote:

Actually, I disagree about this one. If it's for work purposes, it's a form of office supplies.

In the big wide world, everyone has smartphones. So no, it's generally not considered an office supply if you're expected to also use it for work communication.

(I myself don't use a smartphone, and only use whatsapp for work, on my computer. But, making as if this is the norm in the secular world is ridiculous. No, they don't need to check with you if you have a smartphone before hiring for a professional position, unless it's a heimish firm.)

amother

Honeydew

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:32 pm

Mommyg8 wrote:

In 2021, the idea that someone won't want to download an app for the workplace is not commonplace. Communication is a key essence to any job, and it's the workers job to check in with his own limitations, and not expect the boss to run a checklist through all possible limitations.

Mommyg8

Mon, May 31 2021, 6:36 pm

amother [ Honeydew ] wrote:

I'm sure all my husband's coworkers have smartphones. They were provided company smartphones presumably because many preferred to keep their personal lives and their working lives private. (Actually the real reason is, probably, that they are able to track their employees locations, plus the phone is heavily filtered to encourage their employees to actually WORK, I'm sure there are more reasons that I can't think of right off the bat).

In any case, if you are hiring from the ultra chareidi sector, you would have to be a fool to assume any such thing. It's not about being RIGHT, it's about being SMART.