So are most people wearing fakes?

amother

Cornsilk

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 9:22 am

amother [ Fern ] wrote:

Does this thread open the eyes of all the people judging people who "wear designer stuff"? Just curious

Definitely. It shows how far people will go to conform - even if it gives off the wrong impression, or there may be halachic concerns.

amother

Tan

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 9:46 am

amother [ Cornsilk ] wrote:

Definitely. It shows how far people will go to conform - even if it gives off the wrong impression, or there may be halachic concerns.

It shows me the disgust of some towards other people.

doodlesmom

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 9:51 am

amother [ Tan ] wrote:

It shows me the disgust of some towards other people.

Curious what answer you wanted to hear when you asked the question?

“Oh, now that I know it’s fake I respect them for not going over their budget”
“ oh I can also get myself fake stuff and look the look”
“ Oh my rich neighbor is a fool for paying full price”

Crookshanks

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 10:15 am

amother [ Midnight ] wrote:

No one said spending money is a problem. Spending money conspicuously is לא תתארו.

And counterfeits are a halachic problem.

I must not understand what לא תתארו is, as in my understanding spending money has nothing to do with it. What do you mean by that?

amother

Snowflake

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 10:22 am

happyone wrote:

outlet malls have great deals on designer items during holiday season . most of my friends shop there. I believe alot you are seeing is real. you can tell a fake bag from a mile away.

The outlets will sell lower end designer basically.
The real high end stuff, most people are getting on Ali. They don’t even realize how expensive the original item is, so how silly they look wearing it.

amother

Midnight

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 10:35 am

Crookshanks wrote:

I must not understand what לא תתארו is, as in my understanding spending money has nothing to do with it. What do you mean by that?

Not תתורו (from shema). תתארו, from when Yaakov castigated the shevatim for displaying their wealth and arousing envy.

amother

Fern

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 10:40 am

amother [ Fern ] wrote:

Does this thread open the eyes of all the people judging people who "wear designer stuff"? Just curious

Now it shows me that "those" people are NOT spending "thousands" of dollars buying stuff they "cannot" afford ( with subtle references "while being on govt programs).

They are using a questionable way to buy things they like. You can object to them buying replicas. That's a whole separate discussion.

But that was not what the outrage was about, was it!?!

amother

Fern

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 10:44 am

And, btw, the majority of my friends and family and neighbors in bp, look very well put together. They shop mostly at target, walmart, childrens place and sales at gap and macys. Were not spending money on designer wear but we look very well put together.

Are there some that are stuck on designer stuff? Sure! Is nobody in your community guilty of that?

Looking put together, while spending your own money, is not a sin.

Crookshanks

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 10:47 am

amother [ Midnight ] wrote:

Not תתורו (from shema). תתארו, from when Yaakov castigated the shevatim for displaying their wealth and arousing envy.

That may be so, but maybe someone's 1,000 dollar stroller is proportionate to their wealth as your 200 stroller is. Just like you don't need to use a $20 umbrella stroller that someone else can afford, doesn't mean that a wealthy person needs to use a $200 stroller. You don't need to buy all your clothes in walmart or from Goodwill, and someone who makes a high salary doesn't need to buy clothes in zara and h and m. Fancy things are relative, as your City Mini is expensive for someone who can only afford an umbrella stroller.

amother

Candycane

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 10:50 am

amother [ Fern ] wrote:

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me it's just sad that people spend so much of their time and energy on something so meaningless. I feel the same way about men who are into watches and cars and Scotch. It's a statement of priorities.

Buy clothes you like, at whatever price point is appropriate for you, and move on. When shopping is your life and a bargain is your greatest achievement, you aren't necessarily living as a religious Jew ought to.

Just my two cents.

doodlesmom

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 11:01 am

amother [ Tan ] wrote:

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me it's just sad that people spend so much of their time and energy on scrutinizing and analyzing others to this extent.

Just my two cents.

I’m sorry you’re taking this so personally.
It’s a valid discussion.

amother

Midnight

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 11:20 am

Crookshanks wrote:

I'm sorry. I didn't explain it well.

The inyan isn't about one individual arousing envy in another yid.

The rebuke is to all the shevatim together, a communal rebuke. And it is not about envy in a yid, it is about arousing envy in bnei Eisav and Bnei Yishmael.

The meforshim tell us it is a communal lesson. As a community we shouldn't act in ways that flaunt wealth amongst the nations.

When there is a large Jewish community living within a non Jewish community לא תתארו is the injunction against acting in ways that flaunt wealth. So it is not about one person with a $1000 stroller, it is about that being a norm, when that is not the norm in the greater population.

Crookshanks

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 11:35 am

amother [ Candycane ] wrote:

Whoa. Some people (like me) enjoy shopping and finding sales. It's an outlet and a hobby. Just because you don't understand it, doesn't mean it's not valid. I don't understand your judgement either. Don't worry about me, I don't feel sad.

Crookshanks

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 11:36 am

amother [ Midnight ] wrote:

Non Jews spend money on different things. Where I live everyone has dump phones, but all the cleaning ladies have the latest phones and the fanciest cars. They spend on that, we spend on clothing and home decor.

amother

Cherry

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 11:39 am

Crookshanks wrote:

Hm, and tuition and kosher food. It doesn’t equal out. We are spending a lot more.

amother

Candycane

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 11:46 am

Crookshanks wrote:

It's one thing to have a hobby. It's another to be obsessed. I am pleased to know you're enjoying yourself, and it doesn't sound like you're the kind of person being addressed here. I assume you have other interests too.

amother

Midnight

Thu, Jun 10 2021, 11:49 am

Crookshanks wrote:

We don't excuse our behavior because of others.

You may not care about this inyan. But it is real.

מעשה אבות סימן לבנים.

You may not think counterfeit goods are not a big deal and community flaunting of wealth is not so bad.

But there are genuine halachic and hashkafic issues with them.

I understand that learning that one is not acting according to Torah is hard. But one can choose to grow or not.