Is there any kosher excuse for this? (Whatsapp related)

amother

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 2:17 am

I do care about this person, and therefore I would rather know if they have a problem such as whatsapp addiction instead of either MYOB or just not sending good Shabbos texts so that I would never have any way of knowing. I don't know what kind of support they might need but avoiding the problem isn't it.

amother

Beige

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 2:30 am

Speaking for myself only:
I find it's not good for my mental health to put my attention on these things. I want a calm inner life, inner peace, inner harmony. Focusing on another person's Whatsapp activity disturbs my inner peace, so I don't look, don't see. Stay in my lane. Yes, even when it's my child or dh.
My inner peace is very important to me and I guard it like a boss Thumbs Up

If the person is old enough to have a phone, they're old enough to tell me if they want my help with anything. If they're not asking for my help, it's not for me to insert myself into their lane, even if it's my child or dh.

DrMom

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 2:31 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Just wondering... do you think this person wants help?

Will he be annoyed about how you found out he was not shomer Shabbat?

Teomima

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 2:46 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

That's no excuse. This is THEIR issue, THEIR business. Unless they have asked you for help, MYOB!!!

For what it's worth, there are a million valid reasons why someone might check a text on shabbat. But there could also been no valid reason, at least not valid in your opinion. But that's a totally moot point because this is THEIR issue, a choice THEY made. It's NONE of your business. And frankly I don't know why you're peeking at what time someone checked your message.

amother

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 2:56 am

Thanks for the judgment. It's inspiring how many people have truly achieved success in not letting other people's life choices bother you, no matter how close to home and what consequences those actions might have to you, to the extent that you would have zero interest in even knowing what those choices are. Your bubble must be so comfortable.

I posted this question here in technology because to me it is not moot and I want to know more about what this could mean. If you are into relationship counseling, head over to "relationships" "emotional health" and "shalom bayis issues" there are people there who desperately need you.

amother

Topaz

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 3:11 am

From your post, I understand that it is an immediate family member. A child or spouse or sibling. You should ask a therapist and rav for guidance on how and if to do or say anything. You care and want to help, but saying the wrong thing can cause harm rather than help.

Just a thought/ I am now in israel but my phone is still on american time. I don’t like to change the time
My dd laptop stays on American time.

amother

Outerspace

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 3:18 am

OP, posters here gave you a variety of technical explanations. That doesn't seem to satisfy you for some reason. If it is so important to you that you can't just ignore it, go on and speak to the person in question. Find out what they have to say for themselves. That's all.

Personally, I avoid sending messages or emails close to Shabbat to avoid glitches and to avoid lifnei Iver...

amother

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 3:25 am

amother [ Topaz ] wrote:

I would definitely seek guidance before doing or saying anything. I just wanted to know as much as possible about what I'm dealing with first.

A couple of people said they had experiences where whatsapp time stamps were incorrect. That's a comforting thought. It's a complicated situation.

Teomima

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 3:30 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Talk about being judgemental. Thanks. And if you want to talk to me about shalom bayis issues, feel free to read any of my posts (under my screen name) in the husbands with mental illness forum.

You've gotten reasonable explanations. You don't accept them. You've been told by many people it's none of your business. You don't like that answer. Like you yourself said, it's about not letting other people's life choices bother you. I'm sorry you're struggling with this. But sticking your nose in other people's business isn't going to help anything.

Last edited by Teomima on Sun, Jun 20 2021, 3:31 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

Beige

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 3:31 am

When I was a kallah I was taught to not look at the toilet p.
I took a lesson from that to not look at other people's phones.
Technology, time stamps, are so not reliable, it's better to not look cuz it starts to play tricks on our brains. Who needs that drama.

amother

Opal

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 8:41 am

DrMom wrote:

Perhaps a small child got hold of the phone and opened your message?

I had this once where my daughter opened up my phone and clicked on the group with my in laws (parents in law and all my siblings in law). I debated saying something after shabbos but didn't, should I have said something?

amother

Bronze

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 10:47 am

Honestly, this is how I realized that my brother wasn't shomer shabbos anymore.

If you are in the same time zone and sent the text before shabbos, there are glitches that can look like it was read on shabbos.

However in my case, I'm in a different country and I posted something on the family chat after shabbos ended in my country, but it was still shabbos in his country. I thought my family would read it when shabbos ended for them but I saw that he had read it right away.

amother

Opal

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 10:51 am

amother [ Bronze ] wrote:

Jeez I hope this isn't what his family thinks.

amother

Seagreen

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 11:20 am

amother [ Khaki ] wrote:

Unless it's your dh messaging another woman... Seriously how is it your business.
My sil doesn't keep shabbos, I know bc of the time stamp thing too. Not my business.

I had the same thing and wondered if it's still allowed to eat at her for Shabbos.
I totally get op, yes myob, but hello such a discovery is so disorienting. (Of course need to give benefit of doubt and could have just been tech glitch) but sometimes...

amother

Khaki

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 11:22 am

amother [ Seagreen ] wrote:

She's single and a lost soul, if it was a matter of kashrus then yes it would become my business. But that's a q for a rav not for the relationship.

amother

Tiffanyblue

Sun, Jun 20 2021, 11:28 am

If someone's computer is open on WhatsApp web and their phone is not, it can show up that they read the text even if they were not active on the computer.

Its also happened to me that my internet goes out on whatsapp web, then I use my wifi on my computer, and then hours later when my internet goes back on, the computer sends the message from whatsapp web.

Even if she IS breaking shabbos, there is nothing you can do about it and she didn't ask for help or judgement. Learn to let go, read up on codependence, your life will be freer and you can be present and worry about yourself and nurture your own children.