Please help plan Kiwi13's Aliyah!

LovesHashem

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 4:28 pm

amother [ Mayflower ] wrote:

I have no idea if one can buy an apartment with 30k, but you can ask a mortgage broker if it's relevant and feasible before you even hire them. They know best. Go to someone recommended.

Pretty sure it's 30% minimum. So unless I'm buying machsan not sure where apartments cost 100,000 shekels.

amother

Mayflower

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 4:29 pm

ora_43 wrote:

Monthly financial assistance for kids with autism. It's something like 2,000 shekels a month.

It's even more now I think, around 2600 nis. You need to open a file with bituach leumi.

Info about financial assistance

I would only go this route though if the kid truly is not a mainstream kid.

Kiwi13

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 4:37 pm

amother [ Chestnut ] wrote:

Israeli court gives Haifa Chemicals 10 days to empty ammonia tank

Haifa Bay area residents suffer excess of diseases, says Health Ministry

Public sensitivity reached a peak about three months ago when the Health Ministry released a position paper on the incidence of morbidity and illness in the region. The ministry’s paper stated unequivocally that Haifa has an increased rate of morbidity: Cancer rates are about 15% higher than in the rest of Israel; it leads the country in asthma and breathing problems; and the city also has the highest rate of heart disease. Given all these findings, the ministry vehemently opposes expanding operations of the petrochemical industries in the Haifa Bay area.

Because of the public’s concerns about pollution in the area, the Health Ministry’s position once again fueled the activities of social and environmental groups against heavy industry in and around Haifa.

The environmental organizations have a large number and a wide range of demands. The most extreme is a call for the entire petrochemical industry to be relocated away from the region – a demand whose price tag starts in the billions of shekels. It’s not clear if this is even possible, due to the need for close ties to the port area and oil refineries there, which the petrochemical industries depend on.

In any case, what the environmental groups fail to highlight in their anti-industry campaign are the data from the ministry directly responsible for the matter: the Environmental Protection Ministry. This is because these data are much more low-key than those of the Health Ministry and environmental groups.

The Environmental Protection Ministry data show that it’s far from clear the industrial plants in the area are the cause of the air pollution in the Haifa Bay region – or, at the very least, show they are not the chief culprit.

60% of the problem

The Environmental Protection Ministry’s most recent report, from June 2016, details the complex picture of air pollution in Haifa – which is definitely worse than in other parts of Israel – highlighting a number of factors: the topography of the bay area, which traps the air pollution inside (and about which nothing can be done); the combination of polluting petrochemical industries and a polluting seaport; the large number of polluting trucks traveling between the port and plants; a large number of gas stations; and the residents’ contribution to pollution through their use of cars and other pollutants from their homes.

Within this complex picture, the part played by industry itself is not the main problem. The most dangerous source of pollution is volatile organic compounds (VOCs), which are suspected of being carcinogenic. In the Haifa area today, factories emit only 27% of such organic compounds. The rest enter the air from gas stations (11%), households (23%) and, the largest source, transportation (37%).

It can be seen that household causes and transportation together create 60% of the pollutants. Yet still the criticism is directed almost solely at the industrial plants and not the public itself or transportation (both private and public).

The enormous campaign against industry in Haifa has shown signs of success. Since 2009, the Environmental Protection Ministry has been running a national plan to reduce pollution in the bay area. The first ran from 2010 through 2015, and the second plan, through 2018, is now underway.

(The Haaretz article)

Ouch. That sounds awful.

Kiwi13

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 4:41 pm

amother [ Mayflower ] wrote:

I think you need to put downpayment of 30% down for a primary house if I'm not mistaken.

Is your house in the States fully owned, or are you paying a mortgage there?

If you have 150K, that's 490,000 nis. Almost half a million nis. There are definitely lots of apartments you can buy if you have that kind of downpayment.

Maybe there are also special mortgage rates for olim, I don't know, but take a mortgage broker and research it.

We pay a mortgage, and we only purchased 3 years ago. We don't have that kind of equity yet. Plus we moved backwards on it during the pandemic "relief" phase. (Don't get me started on the predatory practices masquerading as "relief!") So now we actually owe more than we borrowed, but the house went up in value, so we're still ahead. Not ahead enough to buy in Israel, though. Confused

Kiwi13

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 4:41 pm

How much are closing costs in Israel?

Rappel

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 4:50 pm

Kiwi, you're making Aliyah???? That's amazing!!!!!

Haifa is unique, and has some great things about it, but I wouldn't send an oleh family to land there. I really, really wouldn't. It's not built to help new olim succeed, even if you completely ignore the known pollution problems. NBN likes to push go north or go south, but it doesn't mean that that is the best idea for you.

The are many great areas around Yerushalayim, though. You might want to take a look at Maaleh Adumim in addition to RBS -- it's a beautiful, well-planned city, and it has all the services you require. It's also really accessible to Yerushalayim - a quick bus takes you straight to the light rail near the Maalot Dafna area, and a car would be even quicker.

I'm not an expert on special needs schools or services, but Yerushalayim has everything that can be had in that arena. You should also be able to get some percentage of disability qualification (higher percentage = higher payout) through Bituah Leumi, which would help you balance yourself financially while you get yourself back on your feet emotionally.

Health insurance -- we pay premium for gold-standard Leumit, and I think we pay around 150 shekels a month for a 5-person family. There are copays for some medicines, but they're low. I don't think we've ever paid more than 350 during one very bad winter month. We also pay for private insurance (not necessary, but it covers us in case we ever face severe disease or disability) + work accident insurance + life insurance. I don't know the exact break down, but it works out to a few hundred shekels a month.

Purchases -- you do need to put down 30%. If you buy on a yishuv, you can get a house and garden for 1.5 million shekels. In a city, things are more expensive.

Food bills - we pay around 3000 shekels a month in groceries/household items for a young family of 5. You might see a higher food bill when you first move here, until you get used to the brands and learning what's cheap here.

Car -- there's basic insurance (doesn't cover much), and all-encompassing (covers theft, crash, tow, etc.) The age, experience, and accidents of the household drivers obviously affects the cost. DH has been driving a decade, I'm a new driver. Our records are clean, and we pay a little over 5k once a year for insurance. Make sure you use an insurance which operates well in your area -- local recommendations go a long way.

And welcome! I hope you come for Shabbat soon!

amother

Mayflower

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 4:51 pm

Kiwi13 wrote:

How much are closing costs in Israel?

What do you mean by closing costs?
You don't need to go through an agent (I never have, I've always found them to be a huge waste of money. And to provide minimal service. I can find the same apartment online myself, in most cases, unless you are looking at certain cities where people only use agents).

Not sure how much the lawyer costs are. I believe around 1% of the cost of the house.

And then there is מס רכישה. You don't pay any of that tax if it's your first house and it costs under 1.7 million. Between 1.7-2 million you pay 3.5%, and so on, it goes up as the house price goes up.

There are no other major closing costs that I know of. Sometimes if you buy an old house where new building rights have been expanded, then someone will need to pay מס שבח, appreciation tax. But it's usually on the seller.

amother

Mayflower

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 4:57 pm

I would save any documentation you have regarding diagnosis for yourself or your child. It will be very useful when dealing with bituach leumi to get a monthly stipend. They will probably want you to see local specialists too, but the local specialists will have something to go by.

Maybe others here know better than I do, but I'm not sure what the ramifications are if you do end up working and getting a stipend (for your own disability). The stipend may decrease if you earn above a certain sum. Again, not sure, needs to be checked out.

Your child's stipend is in no way connected to how much you earn.

blessedflower

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 5:08 pm

There is a very lovely neighborhood in ramat beit shemesh, called Sheinfeld. Very calm and quiet. Mostly chutznikim. You hear the kids speaking English between themselves. It's mostly village's and houses and some apartments. Not really yeshivish though. You might love it there.

blessedflower

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 5:10 pm

Kupat cholim depends where you live. In beit shemesh meuhedet is the most popular. They have their own urgent care. I can give you more info tomorrow

Kiwi13

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 5:14 pm

amother [ Mayflower ] wrote:

In the US, when you buy a home, you need a certain amount of cash to close (closing costs). Aside from your down payment, you also need a portion of city/town and school taxes paid upfront for escrow, a full year of homeowner's insurance paid upfront, attorney fees, title search and title insurance, appraisal, inspection, survey, transfer taxes, recording fees, realtor commission, etc. etc. etc. It can easily end up being upwards of $20k.

I'm asking how it works in Israel.

amother

Chestnut

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 5:17 pm

Kiwi13 wrote:

Ouch. That sounds awful.

FWIW, I think very highly of you (and love your songs) - and it seems like you have plenty of stuff to deal with - I just wanted to save you from adding pollution to the mix.

Kiwi13

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 5:18 pm

amother [ Mayflower ] wrote:

Are there any experts I can consult on this (especially the part about me)? I have paperwork a mile long backing everything up, so hopefully that won't be an issue. If they want me to see their specialist, that should be fine too. Unless they're in the business of telling obvious cases "you're fine," the diagnosis is extremely obvious. (I feel so nebach talking about this, ugh...)

Kiwi13

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 5:18 pm

amother [ Chestnut ] wrote:

FWIW, I think very highly of you (and love your songs) - and it seems like you have plenty of stuff to deal with - I just wanted to save you from adding pollution to the mix.

You're sweet. I didn't realize they had such a problem with pollution.

Kiwi13

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 5:20 pm

amother [ Mayflower ] wrote:

Ooh that's awesome!

amother

Mayflower

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 5:23 pm

Kiwi13 wrote:

Wow. No, you don't need to pay any taxes upfront. BTW you pay the same taxes in Israel whether you rent or buy. I have heard that in America you don't pay city taxes if you rent. In Israel you do.

AFAIK you certainly don't pay insurance when you buy a house (I believe you get automatic insurance with your mortgage?).

Appraisal - you might need to pay for that. Could be a couple of thousand nis I think. You might need the house appraised to get a mortgage. Not sure you always need it though.

Inspector- that's up to you. Most Israelis I know don't get the house inspected first, it's not really a 'thing' here, but you can if you want. Maybe in anglo areas it's more common.
Survey- I have no idea what that is.
Transfer taxes - if they exist I assume they are very small. I don't even remember paying them.
Recording fees?
Realtor commission - usually 2% - I always avoided that. Whenever I tried going through a realtor I got really burnt. Try to avoid if possible. IF not, 2%.

Kiwi13

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 5:37 pm

Rappel wrote:

We're working on it. My husband is more on board with the idea these days, but he doesn't love it. Aliyah needs both spouses to be fully on board and invested. We can't go until we reach that point. He wants to get there, but just isn't there yet. I'm doing my best not to push, but it's clearly time to get going. Every time I mention I could just put the process on hold for now, he tells me I should keep going, he knows it's necessary. I know he'll be happier with an Anglo crowd. Gotta plan for that.

He's never even visited Israel, so it's a big unknown for him.

The last time I was in Israel was 2007 and I rushed home for treatment for anorexia. I was sick the whole of Shana bet in seminary, and ended up teetering into heart failure at the end (B"H in recovery for 14 years now). I was manic the majority of Shana alef. I didn't have normal experiences in Israel. I was, truthfully, mentally ill. My friends went to Ben Yehuda street and traveled, and I mainly kept to myself, staying up all hours of the night, writing pages and pages and pages of ramblings and following ants through the classroom building and being just generally a whirlwind of desperation and chaos. I was constantly trying to keep control over myself and stop talking and sit still in class and stop having sensory freak outs if my socks were slightly different heights or the AC made a different noise. Anorexia ended up being the self-medicating solution. I starved myself out of bipolar mania.

I think back to my experience in Israel as an extremely "alive" time, but I know the memory is filtered through the lens of mental illness. I don't know how much of what I remember was actually how things were. I'll be honest, it worries me to think about how even just being back in Israel will affect me. During manic episodes in the US I've gone off the wire and defaulted all my computer settings to Jerusalem because I was convinced we were making Aliyah right then and there, come what may. Israel has a sort of spiritual magnetism. As my husband so delicately puts it, "Israel attracts a lot of nuts." It could be said nicer... but he's not wrong. For all I know, I'll step off the plane and once again float away into the madness. I need my ducks in a row before I board that plane.

Anyway, thanks for listening to all that.

Food and brands... I'm not picky. We buy the cheapest generic stuff as it is. My husband likes a specific mayo. That can be a splurge item if it must. Smile

boysrus

Mon, Jul 05 2021, 7:05 pm

blessedflower wrote:

Kiryat sheinfeld is not Ramat Beit Shemesh. It is Beit Shemesh proper. It is much more modern and not at all yeshivish or charedi there.

amother

Bluebonnet

Tue, Jul 06 2021, 12:09 am

Do you think your sn child will be able to learn Hebrew? If not, Beit Shemesh/RBS is really your only option to get the services you need.

Rappel

Tue, Jul 06 2021, 12:24 am

amother [ Bluebonnet ] wrote:

Do you think your sn child will be able to learn Hebrew? If not, Beit Shemesh/RBS is really your only option to get the services you need.

Not really true. When I worked in a school for children with significant autism, many of the children did not speak Hebrew at home. we used many different methods of communication -- which we needed anyway, since most of the kids were nonverbal.