She’s | Imamother

amother

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 3:15 am

Some background-
I come from a family who was traditional (just keeping Shabbat and some of the halachot). Over the years every one of the family members (aunts uncles and cousins) became Baal teshuva.
Some are now chassidish, some are MO, some are plain orthodox , and some are yeshivish.
Bh it’s a big zechut that all of us are frum now.
My husband and I are Yeshivish.

Most of the time it’s nice to spend time with all our family members, but I have a problem with one of my nieces. She was totally secular, and became very frum over the years. She’s now chasidish.
Since she became a Baal teshuva, she started treating me like I’m not frum enough. She doesn’t come over to eat at our house (even though we’re very machmir with kashrut). In general- she’s the typical person who flipped and thinks “she’s better than everyone else”.
Obviously, it’s a good thing she’s now frum, and I’m so happy for her, but she took it to a place of Gaava, and it’s very chaval.

Back to the story-
We had a family event last week and I sat next to my niece. A Rav came in, and she asked me who he is. I told her in a few sentences about how important of a Rav he is and how him and his wife are such tzadikim, but at some point my niece just looked away and stopped listening.

It’s clear that she felt like I’m saying something that’s LH.
She wasn’t dreaming and she didn’t look away by accident. It was on purpose.

I think it’s so ridiculous that she can’t even have a conversation. I understand that she’s trying to stay away from LH, but I wasn’t saying anything that’s LH. I’m sure it wasn’t LH. I study the halachot almost every day and am very aware of what counts as LH and what doesn’t.

It’s so annoying that she takes the fact that she’s religious, and makes it so unpleasant to be around her. I know that in some cases you need to act differently or keep distance from family members who aren’t frum for whatever reasons, but I’m frum!
I’m a frum yeshivish woman who values halacha and Torah learning.

I guess I just needed to vent, bc I won’t be speaking to anyone in my fam about this (LH).

Anyways, Thanks for reading.. I know this was long.. Smile

)

abound

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 4:03 am

Can you have a frank conversation with her? Remind her that being nice to people, Dan Lekaf Zechus, treating people well, Not being a Baal Gaavah, are all part of the mitzvos and keeping frum?

naomi2

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 5:04 am

That is a sad post. You kind of lost a connection that you had with your niece. I'm sure you feel confident enough in your yiddishkeit that she doesn't really make you feel bad about yourself but it's a bad feeling to be put down in general. I think you will figure out how much interaction you want to have with her as time goes on so you feel you are putting your emotional health first.

ora_43

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 5:13 am

Most people who 'flip out' do come back to some kind of balance, so hopefully that will happen for her too.

I wouldn't confront her about the overall issue. Accusing her of gaava is unlikely to go well even if it's true.

OTOH I would be direct about specific incidents, in the moment. Eg she freezes you out mid-conversation. "Niece? Is everything OK?... You seemed to totally disconnect for a minute there, did I say something that upset you?"

Or if she won't eat at your house. "I really would love it if we could do a family meal together. I understand that you hold by different kashrut now, what can I do that will allow you to eat here?"

The basic idea is to get the message across: 'hey niece, that thing you're doing? we notice it.'

And if you weren't looking for advice, just confirmation that she's being rude and it stinks - sounds like she's being rude, and it stinks. I really hope she chills out. And good for you for staying close with her anyway and avoiding LH.

amother

Maple

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 5:28 am

I find that chassidish people do think that their Yiddishkeit is better than others. They consider themselves frummer

It's true that it's often more intense in some areas but it's definitely not the best. There is no best.

Before you go about accusing me of bashing chassdim for no reason, I grew up in 2 different schools, one chassidish with girls from all different chassidus and one neutral school.

Chassidish think they're better. I've heard this time and again as an adult too.

So don't take it to heart, it's the culture and it influenced her.

judyjew

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 6:11 am

Please don't go there, op came on here to vent and AVOID LH...

amother

Maple

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 6:19 am

judyjew wrote:

Please don't go there, op came on here to vent and AVOID LH...

Many want us to view them this way.

DrMom

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 6:25 am

People gave you such nice suggestions. To be truthful, I'd probably just ignore her.

Rappel

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 6:39 am

I have no advice for you OP, but I want to say WOW! That's incredible that all your relatives and you were mitchazek! I've never seen that in my life, and it's absolutely wonderful to me.

amother

Pearl

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 6:55 am

Maybe she is my sil. She ignores me too & I am Chassidish. I am not frum enough for her.
Grew up in Flatbush home. Turned over to extreme Chassidish lifestyle with many idiosyncrasies that even reg Chassidish people don't do. Don't take it personally. Think to yourself that it is her issue not yours. It used to bother me too.

amother

Burntblack

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 7:46 am

understand your pain
I would look to connect with her at what you have in common which is you know how it feels to become frum while those around you may not have chosen that journey
and you can best understand how it may feel to not know certain cultural niceties and how best to navigate them especially toward the beginning of such a journey
her intentions may be naive and/or good while her behavior is not necessarily expressing what she hopefully will be able to want and implement as time goes on
you can connect and understand in your heart
you do not have to sit by her when you have the chance or have that much to do with her
it is about her not you even though yes it impacts the relationship
let her find her way as we all wish others do for ourselves
you can model mutual respect and hopefully she will join if not, then not
it is a reflection of her not you
hatzlocha

vintagebknyc

Fri, Jul 09 2021, 8:03 am

Before I became BT I had a BT relative who behaved this way. We got glatt food for her, she wouldn’t eat in the dining room with us. If we spoke about things she thought were LH or not frum enough, she would turn her back to us mid sentence.

It’s her, not you. And her choice whether or not she wants to act in this less than refined manner.