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Forum
-> Pregnancy & Childbirth
-> Baby Names
Ema of 5
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 Tue, Jul 13 2021, 9:46 am
| amother [ DarkOrange ] wrote: | | Christians that name their child Maria are not doing so with miriam in mind. |
No, they’re naming after Yoshke’ mother, who was Miriam/Mary/Maria.
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amother
Cantaloupe
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 9:55 am
| amother [ DarkOrange ] wrote: | Esperanza is the same as Sprintze not Masha
Right , miriam —> Maria —> masha, but thr nickname is from Russian nonjews.
Also it’s not a fair comparison to use Sam, because when non jews use the name Sam it’s connected to the biblical Shmuel. When non jews use Maria or Mary it’s from Yushkes mother, not from Miriam HaNavia.
There are two separate names , miriam and Maria , in non jewish world. But Samuel is only Samuel, Esther only Esther, Isaac only Isaac. |
You absolutely didn't get the parallel with Esperanza. Maria is derived from a Hebrew word and Sprintze is derived from a Latin word period.
Yes there is a mention of Yoshke in Jewish sources and his mother's name in Jewish sources is Miriam.
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amother
Cantaloupe
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 9:58 am
| amother [ DarkOrange ] wrote: | | Christians that name their child Maria are not doing so with miriam in mind. |
You have no clue what any Christian has in mind and it is not relevant for this thread.
The thread is about names equivalents in different languages.
Some Jews naming for Isaac may have Isaac Newton in mind, and not what you would expect.
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amother
Blonde
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 10:11 am
| amother [ Cantaloupe ] wrote: | Well the Russian name does have a Hebrew origin. Absolutely different from Esperanza which stems from Latin.
Masha from Maria is like Sam from Samuel, but you won't claim that Samuel has a non-Jewish origin just because it is a bit different from Shmuel. |
Masha is not at all the same as Samuel and Shmuel. I'm no expert on the new testament but afaik there's nobody important in there named Shmuel. The mother in their story was named Maryam or Miryam which translated to Mary. Even though we have our own Miriam Haneviah the sister of Moshe Rabbeinu, lehavdil X 1,000 that name appears prominently in their bible.
There are a lot of of Yiddish names that mean something, Shayna- beautiful, Fraida- happy, Faiga- bird, Hinda- deer, Bluma- flower, Shterna- star, Zissel- sweet... There are other Yiddish names that come from names in the language of the country Jews lived in- Ettel, Mattel, Mindel, Breindel, Bella, Yenta. Masha is one of those. It's possible there are Masha's named after Moshe, but Masha is a Russian name adopted by Jews who lived in Russia just like Ella is a German name adopted by German Jews. I also know a Mariasha which definitely comes from Russian, Rasha, same as above and two women whose Jewish given name is Mary, though they don't pronounce it like Mary Poppins.
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amother
Cantaloupe
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 10:33 am
| amother [ Blonde ] wrote: | Masha is not at all the same as Samuel and Shmuel. I'm no expert on the new testament but afaik there's nobody important in there named Shmuel. The mother in their story was named Maryam or Miryam which translated to Mary. Even though we have our own Miriam Haneviah the sister of Moshe Rabbeinu, lehavdil X 1,000 that name appears prominently in their bible.
There are a lot of of Yiddish names that mean something, Shayna- beautiful, Fraida- happy, Faiga- bird, Hinda- deer, Bluma- flower, Shterna- star, Zissel- sweet... There are other Yiddish names that come from names in the language of the country Jews lived in- Ettel, Mattel, Mindel, Breindel, Bella, Yenta. Masha is one of those. It's possible there are Masha's named after Moshe, but Masha is a Russian name adopted by Jews who lived in Russia just like Ella is a German name adopted by German Jews. I also know a Mariasha which definitely comes from Russian, Rasha, same as above and two women whose Jewish given name is Mary, though they don't pronounce it like Mary Poppins. |
There is no Russian name Rasha.
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Ema of 5
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 10:39 am
| amother [ Cantaloupe ] wrote: | | There is no Russian name Rasha. |
so where does Rasha come from?
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amother
Cantaloupe
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 11:04 am
| Ema of 4 wrote: | | so where does Rasha come from? |
I have no clue.
But noone in Russia is called Rasha.
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amother
Violet
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 11:06 am
| amother [ Cantaloupe ] wrote: | I have no clue.
But noone in Russia is called Rasha. |
My grandmothers parents were Russian, and she was names Rasha. Her English name was Rose. The name had to have come from somewhere.
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amother
Dimgray
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 11:45 am
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Rasha is an Arabic girls name.
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amother
Holly
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 11:53 am
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Masha is from Moshe, at least the Masha that I know (not russian). Not every Masha is Russian.
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amother
Violet
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 11:56 am
| amother [ Dimgray ] wrote: | | Rasha is an Arabic girls name. |
I’m thinking that my great grandparents probably didn’t give my grandmother an Arabic name….
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SixOfWands
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 12:16 pm
| amother [ Cobalt ] wrote: | | You never heard that because she's 100% wrong! |
I knew a Masha (a"h) who was absolutely 100% Miriam.
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chanchy123
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 12:18 pm
| Ema of 4 wrote: | | so where does Rasha come from? |
Maybe Risha/Resha I have a relative with that name.
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chanchy123
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 12:26 pm
| amother [ Blonde ] wrote: | Masha is not at all the same as Samuel and Shmuel. I'm no expert on the new testament but afaik there's nobody important in there named Shmuel. The mother in their story was named Maryam or Miryam which translated to Mary. Even though we have our own Miriam Haneviah the sister of Moshe Rabbeinu, lehavdil X 1,000 that name appears prominently in their bible.
There are a lot of of Yiddish names that mean something, Shayna- beautiful, Fraida- happy, Faiga- bird, Hinda- deer, Bluma- flower, Shterna- star, Zissel- sweet... There are other Yiddish names that come from names in the language of the country Jews lived in- Ettel, Mattel, Mindel, Breindel, Bella, Yenta. Masha is one of those. It's possible there are Masha's named after Moshe, but Masha is a Russian name adopted by Jews who lived in Russia just like Ella is a German name adopted by German Jews. I also know a Mariasha which definitely comes from Russian, Rasha, same as above and two women whose Jewish given name is Mary, though they don't pronounce it like Mary Poppins. |
According to the NT Marry/Maria's mother's name was Anna I.e. Hannah/Chana - she plays a very important part in the story and is considered a X-tian saint (ever heard of St. Anne or Santa Anna?) is that a reason we shouldn't name our girls Anna, Hannah, or Anne? Of course not. J-sus's father was Joseph (besides the obvious contradiction in the NT story) should we not call our children Yoseph? John is Yochanon, Paul is Shaul, Mathew is Matityah (or Matityahu) - they are all Latin versions of commonly given Jewish names. So when a X-tian uses them they might very well mean the NT character - but when we use them, they represent great Jews of the past - not the ones from the NT.
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amother
Blonde
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 12:36 pm
We happily use the names Chana, Yoseph and others you mentioned. What we were saying about Masha is that it's derived from the non-Jewish version of the name, it comes from Mary or Maria. That doesn't mean btw that we don't name after our great-grandma Masha. Once Jewish people started using the name it became accepted.
(Don't get me started on that because people are offended when newer names they invent and give their kids aren't accepted. I'm not naming names.  The answer I got was that we're not on the level of previous generations, but that's not going to go over well.)
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amother
Cantaloupe
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 12:39 pm
| amother [ Violet ] wrote: | | My grandmothers parents were Russian, and she was names Rasha. Her English name was Rose. The name had to have come from somewhere. |
This is up to you to find out. Could have been a made up nickname or a regional version of Rose.
Anyway OP has her answers: her equivalents are either Masha or Miriam.
If she wants another similar sounding name then Moria is nice. Both dh and I have relatives that were named different variations of Maria and I am considering Moria as an option.
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Ema of 5
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 12:43 pm
| chanchy123 wrote: | | Maybe Risha/Resha I have a relative with that name. |
And where do THOSE names come from?
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amother
Cantaloupe
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 12:44 pm
| Ema of 4 wrote: | | And where do THOSE names come from? |
Are you trying to say that whenever you have no clue where a name is coming from, it must be Russian?! Is that the only optiion?
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Ema of 5
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 12:45 pm
| amother [ Cantaloupe ] wrote: | | Are you trying to say that whenever you have no clue where a name is coming from, it must be Russian?! Is that the only optiion? |
Huh???? I just asked a question, not trying to say anything.
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sequoia
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Tue, Jul 13 2021, 1:10 pm
You all are completely insane.
I happen to go by Masha, because I’m used to it. But most Jewish Marias go by Manya! It was much more prevalent in Russian Jewish culture for Maria to be nicknamed Manya than Masha or any other nickname.
For example, Manya Feigel from Alexandra Brushtein’s “The Road Runs Into the Distance” or the eponymous Manya Schatz from Narineh Abgaryan’s “Manyunya.”
Yes, Maria is derived from Miriam (obviously, because the New Testament is a Greek text *about* Jews). But that doesn’t mean that every Maria is named after a Miriam. I’m named after my great-grandma Malka Tauba. Indeed I think Malka was more common in the shtetl than Miriam.
As for the idea that Masha is somehow connected to Moshe... yeah, ok. Whoever came up with that had no idea what they were talking about. Masha is one of the many possible nicknames for Maria, just like Katherine could go by Kathy, Kate, or Kat.
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