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If you're jealous of poor people, go be poor!
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amother




OP
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 4:59 pm
Seriously. That option is open to everyone. Not everyone can get a well paid job, but anyone can lose one!
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amother




Amaryllis
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 5:02 pm
It's not so easy to become a welfare queen when you already have a good job.

Firstly they look at past income before allowing you to qualify.

Secondly you need to a career beggar to be familiar with who to turn to.
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amother




Snapdragon
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 5:04 pm
I'll gladly switch w anyone. Working my bottom off with a bunch of kids one after the other and still in the "poor boat". Let me tell you, the programs ain't fun . And when something goes wrong, we don't have the funds to hire someone to help us out. And when we lose something, it costs us a heck of a lot more than we can afford.
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amother




OP
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 5:10 pm
amother [ Amaryllis ] wrote:
It's not so easy to become a welfare queen when you already have a good job.

Firstly they look at past income before allowing you to qualify.

Secondly you need to a career beggar to be familiar with who to turn to.

People who are middle class should have planned better then. It's about financial savvy. Break out those bootstraps.

ETA: Apparently people don't get it. Oh well.
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Zehava




 
 
 
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 5:11 pm
That’s exactly why there’s a shortage of workers and prices on merchandise are going up. We should just let the robots take over.
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amother




OP
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 5:12 pm
The problem may be that the market value of labor is less than a living wage.
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amother




Amaryllis
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 5:14 pm
deleted
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amother




DarkKhaki
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 5:16 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
People who are middle class should have planned better then. It's about financial savvy. Break out those bootstraps.


Says the one who's living a high class luxury lifestyle on government programs......
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amother




DarkKhaki
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 5:18 pm
No one is jealous of the poor. But it is hard to watch people on government programs live a rich lifestyle. Many aren't even interested in getting better jobs because they're better off on programs.
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amother




DarkCyan
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 5:27 pm
Being poor ain't easy. I've been both poor and middle class.

Poor where I couldn't pay my low mortgage (lower than rent in the area) and was being sent to foreclosure. When food stamps and WIC ran out and there was no funds to buy food for Sukkot. We ate most meals at my parents, and without some help from them we wouldn't have had breakfast. My parents struggled themselves but they saw we were in a worse position. Clothes were hand me downs from their cousins or older siblings. If not for Medicaid I wouldn't have been able to pay for Dr visits and medicine. People think you get govt help like food stamps, WIC or Medicaid so you must be better off then the middle class. But it's not usually the case. We were poor and had not a penny extra. The local grocery was kind to extend credit. If not for heap we wouldn't have had gas or electric. And that is with all the government programs. With a large family kah we were really struggling. I work 9-3 and my husband 2 jobs. Hashem decides what you will earn. You can make the nicest vessel for Hashems blessings, but Hashem decides how much he will fill it.

Being middle class has been easier. I get a small amount of benefits to help me "break even". We can't save and we live pay check to paycheck. Tax refunds help us break even. But we BH can now pay our mortgage, utilities...we can breath a little easier.
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amother




Brown
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:13 pm
amother [ DarkKhaki ] wrote:
No one is jealous of the poor. But it is hard to watch people on government programs live a rich lifestyle. Many aren't even interested in getting better jobs because they're better off on programs.


That thread is driving me crazy. There are people on there saying that they refuse to pay full tuition, because then it's paying for someone else's kid. But then if no one pays for someone else's kid, there's no such thing as all these tuition rebates. It's all why should I work hard let someone else work hard. That's the problem, it's that no one wants to work and they all want to pay the bare minimum and also have bugaboos.
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amother




Daffodil
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:16 pm
amother [ Brown ] wrote:
That thread is driving me crazy. There are people on there saying that they refuse to pay full tuition, because then it's paying for someone else's kid. But then if no one pays for someone else's kid, there's no such thing as all these tuition rebates. It's all why should I work hard let someone else work hard. That's the problem, it's that no one wants to work and they all want to pay the bare minimum and also have bugaboos.


The problem is that just because you work hard, doesn't mean you will come out with more. You may end up with the same or even less than the person not working. This is why communism doesn't work. If people aren't motivated to work harder because they won't gain from it, then they won't.

And why people think they shouldn't have to work but should be able to have luxuries is beyond me.
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amother




Cappuccino
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:18 pm
amother [ DarkKhaki ] wrote:
No one is jealous of the poor. But it is hard to watch people on government programs live a rich lifestyle. Many aren't even interested in getting better jobs because they're better off on programs.

I guess this post make me understand OP better!!!
I know tons of ppl on government programs, I dk any living a "rich lifestyle"!
It is true that if you make just enough money to be thrown off medicaid but not enough to pay for health insurance you are better off not taking the extra job!
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amother




OP
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:22 pm
amother [ DarkKhaki ] wrote:
Says the one who's living a high class luxury lifestyle on government programs......

What gave you that impression?
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amother




Green
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:25 pm
[quote="amother [ Cappuccino ]"]I guess this post make me understand OP better!!!
I know tons of ppl on government programs, I dk any living a "rich lifestyle"!
It is true that if you make just enough money to be thrown off medicaid but not enough to pay for health insurance you are better off not taking the extra job![/quote
There are people who post here constantly who refuse to work. They say they have little kids at home, and want to be a stay at home mom.
They want to have a baby every year, not work and live off every one who is working.
That’s what ticks all the rest of us off
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amother




OP
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:29 pm
Most middle class people I know work very hard and still struggle somewhat financially. Most low income people I know work just as hard or harder but at lower paying jobs, and their financial struggles are more pronounced despite government assistance. I know of very few people who live luxurious lifestyles, and those I do know are solidly upper middle class or moderately wealthy. They have generational wealth or assets such as paid off houses to fall back on.
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amother




OP
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:31 pm
Quote:

There are people who post here constantly who refuse to work. They say they have little kids at home, and want to be a stay at home mom.
They want to have a baby every year, not work and live off every one who is working.
That’s what ticks all the rest of us off

Some SAHMS, even if poor, are in a position where it doesn't make sense for them to work. They'd get minimum wage, which would then go to pay a babysitter and/or cleaning help with little to nothing left over.

Also, it's a completely different discussion, but like it or not there are some who hold that BC is not to be used for financial reasons unless it's starvation level poverty.
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amother




RosePink
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:33 pm
The worst parts of being poor:

1 - Ironically, it's expensive. I have poor credit (ex left me with debt) and I can't get any of the perks that come with credit card points or money back on purchases or discounts for being a cardmember at the store. Big items might need to be paid with a payment plan, that may or may not cost interest, or I might go for the cheapest version, which inevitably breaks and costs more in repairs over its lifespan than the more expensive product would have cost in the first place. I can't afford to buy kids' clothes on sale "for next year" because the money in my account is for current expenses, plus I can't take the risk that my kids won't fit in those clothes in 2 seasons from now because of growth spurts, etc. And of course, paying rent because I can't afford down payments or be trusted with a mortgage means flushing a huge percentage of my pay away for rent with no asset to show for it.

2 - The "programs" take time, effort, and paperwork that make me wonder how anyone ever gets to the end of the bureaucratic red tape. Of course some programs are simpler than others, but the ones that provide the benefits that are most helpful subject us to the kind of scrutiny and limitations that no one would find acceptable if they weren't desperate.

3 - The constant fear of being one tiny disaster away from complete catastrophe. The fact that the landlord may decide to send us packing any day for whatever reason, which could be expensive and destabilizing. Obviously, people make decisions to move all the time, but the fact that it is not something we can decide gives us that unsettling feeling of impermanence and lack of control that others can't understand unless they've experienced it themselves.

4 - The toll it takes on physical and mental health to be dependent on others or dehumanized for our poverty, forced to beg for discounts and extensions, keeping our kids from feeling deprived in a world gone crazy with materialism, or not being able to afford the time or money that it takes to eat healthy and work out, etc. Many in the middle class struggle with some of these, too, each at their own level.
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amother




RosePink
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:37 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Most middle class people I know work very hard and still struggle somewhat financially. Most low income people I know work just as hard or harder but at lower paying jobs, and their financial struggles are more pronounced despite government assistance. I know of very few people who live luxurious lifestyles, and those I do know are solidly upper middle class or moderately wealthy. They have generational wealth or assets such as paid off houses to fall back on.


This is true. I hear a lot about the financial struggles of the middle class, but they're working hard to buy their kids the latest shenanigans and pay off their two mortgages (summer home, of course); they're not struggling to afford the class trip fee and therapy for their kids.
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amother




RosePink
 

Post Fri, Jul 16 2021, 6:41 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Quote:

There are people who post here constantly who refuse to work. They say they have little kids at home, and want to be a stay at home mom.
They want to have a baby every year, not work and live off every one who is working.
That’s what ticks all the rest of us off

Some SAHMS, even if poor, are in a position where it doesn't make sense for them to work. They'd get minimum wage, which would then go to pay a babysitter and/or cleaning help with little to nothing left over.

Also, it's a completely different discussion, but like it or not there are some who hold that BC is not to be used for financial reasons unless it's starvation level poverty.


This is a huge issue for so many women. Even in the most frum circles, there is little support in place for working women. Childcare is expensive, and doesn't exist at all in certain situations, like finding someone willing to take a child off a preschool bus or pick them up from a playgroup with no transportation. And how much can you earn in those hours between 10 (when the last bus is finally off) and 3 when the first bus returns?

Not to mention that such reasonably flexible jobs are hard to come by and/or don't pay well enough unless you are in a specialized field,
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