Parenting without obedience: safe haven?

amother

Brown

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 3:46 pm

I would be interested. But I really hope people will educate and share kindly even if someone is completely clueless about the method. I don’t like the harsh way some people interact. It should be supportive and people should be educated nicely.

mha3484

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 3:59 pm

English3 wrote:

I am confused here what is the difference between obedience and boundaries?
Genuinely asking, does this approach work with giving children security?
Do they ever feel that in our house we do xyz with pride?
Do they have routine in the home?
Do they lead the house or is there some kind of authority?

Yes to the first 3 and no to the last question.

My kids feel secure because they know their parents are in their corner. We are their ally not their adversary. My kids know when they are struggling in a situation we will work it out like a team. My reflex is to not immediately dish out consequences but to really talk to them about what caused the behavior to begin with. When you tackle that, you solve a lot of issues. Not all but many. We have routines. At the end of the day the adults are the final authority and I say no plenty but I do it in a way that I feel mechanechs them not just no because I said so.

mha3484

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 4:16 pm

Also OP don't assume its not so mainstream to parent collaboratively. My boys yeshiva and its associated bais yaakov have really embraced this form of discipline. Pre corona I went to a great parenting group at our school that was organized because the menaheles felt so strongly about Collaborative Problem Solving she wanted mothers to learn it and use it too.

Zehava

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 4:16 pm

amother [ Sunflower ] wrote:

Hard to explain, but it often attempts to normalize certain behaviors that are clearly not normal. Also makes assumptions about motives for behaviors that don’t hold true for all kids.

I’m guessing those behaviors exist on a spectrum and maybe not everyone is aware of how extreme it can go, based off their own experiences.

Zehava

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 4:18 pm

English3 wrote:

Boundaries are on the parent to uphold, obedience is expected of kids. That is the key difference.

Shabbosiscoming

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 5:30 pm

amother [ Sunflower ] wrote:

My kids are similar to yours based on your posts and I often feel gaslighted when I read about gentle/respectful parenting. And I’m far, far from an obedience driven parent.

Bigsis and another sunflower, I heard a great mashal that I think of when I read your posts:

A group of people came to get kittens. Each participant was given a book on raising kittens, sent home, and told to come back in a month. At the next meeting, most of the owners had house trained kittens. A few people had some difficulties. Then there were a couple of people with scratches on the arms and faces. The last 2 groups were sent home and told to reread the kitten manual and practice properly. At the 3rd meeting, once again there were people with scratches all over. And then the organizer said, "Oh, didn't you know? You all got kitten manuals. But some of you got lion cubs."

amother

Sunflower

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 5:54 pm

Shabbosiscoming wrote:

You’re preaching to the choir. I’m trying to say it’s not for everyone, but there are some posters who think it’s the only right way to parent, and if you’re getting scratches on your face you’re not following the manual properly. I’m not even so opposed in practice, it’s still better than the alternative, but some of the premises really irk me. And it’s not because I’m a control freak or convinced my children need to be marching soldiers, or that obedience it’s a virtue unto itself. Far from.
Also, I’m not so convinced my kids are such outliers. Or that I’m the only parent left feeling confused and resentful when we try to parent gently.

Zehava

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 5:58 pm

amother [ Sunflower ] wrote:

The premises are what matter. I believe parents of lion Cubs would get scratched no matter the manual.

amother

Tuberose

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 7:20 pm

Zehava wrote:

The premises are what matter. I believe parents of lion Cubs would get scratched no matter the manual.

No, they wouldn't get scratched no matter the manual. I know it's just a mashal but if we want to continue following it- there are lion tamers who can train a lion or a lion cub. The lion cub won't scratch no matter what you do, but if you handle a cub like a kitten you'll have a problem. For a lion cub you need to use a cub manual.
Humans are complex creatures. There's a wide range of perceptions and behaviors among young humans that require different parenting skills and methods. Finding out what methods work best on your own little ones is the first of many steps in helping them reach adulthood as great human beings.

amother

Wheat

Mon, Sep 13 2021, 7:28 pm

amother [ Tuberose ] wrote:

I think your right, but sounds difficult.

A) how do I lnow if I have a manual for a kitten, cat, lion cub or a lion?

B) how do I know which manuals are for which?

C) how do I know which manuals work and which are a waste of time.

FranticFrummie

Tue, Sep 14 2021, 11:45 am

Does the "Parenting Kids with Love and Logic" method qualify?

It worked miracles for my relationship with DD. I'm not kidding. One day she said to me "Mama, I really like that book you're reading. We're not fighting anymore!"

Power struggles literally went from constant and daily, to very rare. Usually there was a problem when I forgot to use Love and Logic with her.

(Of course, it depends entirely on your child's personality.)

Zehava

Tue, Sep 14 2021, 11:48 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

No
Love and logic is the opposite of that in every way

sky

Tue, Sep 14 2021, 11:56 am

amother [ Wheat ] wrote:

It’s chanoch l’nar al pi darcho

There has never been or assumed a manual that fits all.

SuperWify

Tue, Sep 14 2021, 12:01 pm

mha3484 wrote:

I parent this way and its been very positive for my family. I talk about it a lot on the challenging children forum. I credit the book the explosive child with why I have a relationship with my preteen son.

Would this book be helpful to learn to deal with my explosive 4 year old son?

mha3484

Tue, Sep 14 2021, 12:06 pm

Yes. I learned about the method when my son was in Nursery ( 4 year olds). The author spoke at an event in my community. I found that what he said really resonated with me so I went and bought the book. I have been using it ever since. This son will be 11 in a couple of months.

amother

Junglegreen

Tue, Sep 14 2021, 12:12 pm

Where can I find out more information on this. Apparently I'm clueless and there are so many people out there with all diff methods I stay away because I'm overwhelmed and confused. I'd love to understand better. I want to have a good relationship with my children and I think I do.. But we have our times..

Zehava

Tue, Sep 14 2021, 12:58 pm

amother [ Junglegreen ] wrote:

Are you on Instagram? There are some great, very informative accounts you can follow.