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Simchas Torah Anxiety regarding social interaction
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gefiltefishy




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Sep 19 2021, 6:14 pm
Oh I know that feeling! I don't like being asked too many questions either. I'd try to ask them questions instead before they ask too much. People love to talk about themselves, after all.
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zaq




 
 
 
 

Post Sun, Sep 19 2021, 10:49 pm
amother [ Bronze ] wrote:
So stay home. Judaism as a spectator sport is no fun anyway


Which is precisely why women should lobby for arrangements that will allow them to dance separately. Why DO all those women press up to the mechitzah and watch the men stomping around? Once you've done the Jewish version of Where's Waldo? and spotted your chosson or dh, ds, and dgs, what's there to see? A bunch of guys stomping around and around and around and AROUND and AROUND ad nauseam. Now and then maybe they go a little wild and circle around and around in the opposite direction--woo-hoo!

Weddings, I understand. There's always some bocher doing the kazatzka or walking on his hands or setting his hat afire, none of which you see on the women's side.

So what's stopping all you ladies from at least pretending to dance in the aisles in the Ezras Nashim? You can't be any less graceful than the menfolks, and at least you'd be DOING something.
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seeker




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 3:45 am
I dunno, I never thought of questions/comments about clothing as being personal or invasive - I think it's what people do to AVOID being invasive. You say did people forget how to be friendly and cordial - well what should they say? You can't ask about their kids because what if they don't have kids or have issues with their kids. You can't ask who they're having their meal with because maybe they don't have anyone to eat with. Etc. But you can clearly see that they're wearing a pink sweater so you feel fairly safe saying "I love your pink sweater!" And "Where did you get it" well honestly that's useful information in general. If the truth is that you got it from a gemach and don't want to share that, you could always go with "don't remember" or something. Still a lot safer than "how's your mom? (She died last month)"

Color me clueless. How do you want people to show their friendliness? Assuming you'll be sharing the same space for more than a few minutes, so you're not going to just drop all talk after "hi." And you can't leave out of boredom because you have kids who are not ready to leave.
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LovesHashem




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 3:47 am
zaq wrote:
Which is precisely why women should lobby for arrangements that will allow them to dance separately. Why DO all those women press up to the mechitzah and watch the men stomping around? Once you've done the Jewish version of Where's Waldo? and spotted your chosson or dh, ds, and dgs, what's there to see? A bunch of guys stomping around and around and around and AROUND and AROUND ad nauseam. Now and then maybe they go a little wild and circle around and around in the opposite direction--woo-hoo!

Weddings, I understand. There's always some bocher doing the kazatzka or walking on his hands or setting his hat afire, none of which you see on the women's side.

So what's stopping all you ladies from at least pretending to dance in the aisles in the Ezras Nashim? You can't be any less graceful than the menfolks, and at least you'd be DOING something.


Because there's not much room, and it's not as accepted so no one is going to be that first person and start it.

It's a shame.
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 4:37 am
seeker wrote:
I dunno, I never thought of questions/comments about clothing as being personal or invasive - I think it's what people do to AVOID being invasive. You say did people forget how to be friendly and cordial - well what should they say? You can't ask about their kids because what if they don't have kids or have issues with their kids. You can't ask who they're having their meal with because maybe they don't have anyone to eat with. Etc. But you can clearly see that they're wearing a pink sweater so you feel fairly safe saying "I love your pink sweater!" And "Where did you get it" well honestly that's useful information in general. If the truth is that you got it from a gemach and don't want to share that, you could always go with "don't remember" or something. Still a lot safer than "how's your mom? (She died last month)"

Color me clueless. How do you want people to show their friendliness? Assuming you'll be sharing the same space for more than a few minutes, so you're not going to just drop all talk after "hi." And you can't leave out of boredom because you have kids who are not ready to leave.


Firstly, one can compliment without asking where they bought the item and how much it cost.

But conversations can start with anything light and then women start to share more without the other person prompting it and making it feel like an interrogation.
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amother




Aqua
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 4:44 am
There are some people out there that sound more like an interrogator when they try small talk. It's exhausting. Try not to sit next to them. It's like you're finally done answering their question and they have another ten ready. And they never talk about themselves or share anything interesting.
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seeker




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 9:06 am
So if you have such specific ideas of what a conversation should consist of, why don't you take the lead? Maybe they will learn from your superior social graces...
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amother




Brickred
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 9:45 am
amother [ Aqua ] wrote:
There are some people out there that sound more like an interrogator when they try small talk. It's exhausting. Try not to sit next to them. It's like you're finally done answering their question and they have another ten ready. And they never talk about themselves or share anything interesting.


I know someone like this. She is trying to have a small talk but it‘s not working out: Nice sheitel! Is it new? Did you buy it? When are you due? etc.

Another brand of intruder would react in horror to any thing you get. Say, you splurged on something expensive for once, for example something LV.
You‘ll be standing there minding your own business and they will suddenly notice and ask with alarm/disgust : „ What, is it really LV?“ how do you react to that.

Last week at a social gathering a friend noticed I wore a shorter sheitel than usual. She: It is so nice! Did you cut your old sheitel?
Me: No, I bought it.

She: horror in the eyes, walking away in silence...
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zaq




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 10:46 am
PSA: Asking where one bought something is marginally acceptable. Asking what they paid is absolutely not. But you knew that, right?


You didn't? Surprised
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amother




Cyclamen
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 11:14 am
zaq wrote:
Which is precisely why women should lobby for arrangements that will allow them to dance separately. Why DO all those women press up to the mechitzah and watch the men stomping around? Once you've done the Jewish version of Where's Waldo? and spotted your chosson or dh, ds, and dgs, what's there to see? A bunch of guys stomping around and around and around and AROUND and AROUND ad nauseam. Now and then maybe they go a little wild and circle around and around in the opposite direction--woo-hoo!

Weddings, I understand. There's always some bocher doing the kazatzka or walking on his hands or setting his hat afire, none of which you see on the women's side.

So what's stopping all you ladies from at least pretending to dance in the aisles in the Ezras Nashim? You can't be any less graceful than the menfolks, and at least you'd be DOING something.

I soooo miss college. That was the best!
Honestly, as a married woman in MO community shuls, it still not the same.
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imaima




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 11:17 am
zaq wrote:
Which is precisely why women should lobby for arrangements that will allow them to dance separately. Why DO all those women press up to the mechitzah and watch the men stomping around? Once you've done the Jewish version of Where's Waldo? and spotted your chosson or dh, ds, and dgs, what's there to see? A bunch of guys stomping around and around and around and AROUND and AROUND ad nauseam. Now and then maybe they go a little wild and circle around and around in the opposite direction--woo-hoo!

Weddings, I understand. There's always some bocher doing the kazatzka or walking on his hands or setting his hat afire, none of which you see on the women's side.

So what's stopping all you ladies from at least pretending to dance in the aisles in the Ezras Nashim? You can't be any less graceful than the menfolks, and at least you'd be DOING something.


Why of course it‘s fun to look how drunk some men get.
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, Sep 20 2021, 12:09 pm
zaq wrote:
PSA: Asking where one bought something is marginally acceptable. Asking what they paid is absolutely not. But you knew that, right?


You didn't? Surprised


The 2 often go together in my community and therefore I don't like the first question because I know what will follow...

But I do think that usually when I compliment someone on what they are wearing, they will either thank me and move onto the next conversation or they will launch into a whole talk about what a metzia it was etc. So if they are choosing to move on and don't volunteer the info, I would assume they don't want to share it so what exactly is the point in asking?
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Sesame




 
 
 
 

Post Tue, Sep 21 2021, 3:15 pm
As a good excuse! If I don’t want to answer
Whenever someone asks how much something costs I just reply “oh I can’t say cos it’s yt, we don’t talk about money on yt but you could call me after”. Totally polite, in line with halachos and no one is gonna call me to find out how much I paid for xyz.
Where did you buy it? Oh I just picked it up randomly, forgot the name of the place. It’ll come to me. When I remember I’ll tell you. OR no clue it was gifted.
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amother




Mustard
 

Post Tue, Sep 21 2021, 7:40 pm
OP - totally get you. There's a different between the type of small talk where people casually compliment your clothes/ kid's clothes and the "is that real? How much was it?" Same as the dif between asking where you live vs asking how much rent you pay. Its beyond intrusive.. Also, Even casual questions like where are you from quickly get into very uncomfortable territory with me because I come from a small town and a very problematic family (which ppl put together pretty quickly). So when I'm at a Simcha, my husband is my designated bodyguard. He is great at skillfully changing topics and getting people to talk about themselves.
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DrMom




 
 
 
 

Post Wed, Sep 22 2021, 12:00 am
amother [ Cyclamen ] wrote:
I soooo miss college. That was the best!
Honestly, as a married woman in MO community shuls, it still not the same.

In our DL shul, women dance with the Torah, regardless of marital status, juts like we would dance at a wedding.
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Jewishmom8




 
 
 
 

Post Wed, Sep 22 2021, 2:26 am
I hear what you are saying op.
mostly its just because people do not know what else to say.
but they still are happy to see you and want to talk to you. think of it as a compliment.
can you come prepared with real things to talk about?
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