I am so upset! adults hitting, shouting at etc. children

GAMZu

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 10:33 am

amother wrote:

Gamzu I never said I am proud. I said this is how I raise my kids.
Gamzu you know me very well and if you dont want to be friends with me that is fine.

I don't have to agree with everything someone does in order to be her friend. Confused

But since you said I know you very well, I'm happy you posted anon. Sometimes I also scream at my kids sometimes when I lose control. But I don't see this as a parenting technique, but rather as a flaw that should be worked on.

gamekeeper

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 11:11 am

beating your kids or giving them a little spanking? if the child is doing somthing that can be dangerous or something that is really bad or even dangerous, then sometimes there is a need for a little spank-as long as you are calm and not letting out your frustrations on your kids. but smacking them bec they are annoying you or not fitting into whats comfortable for you(and I have seen it done too often unfortunately) is wrong and abusive!

happymom

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 12:03 pm

Quote:

And also, sometimes, you get a good feeling by not hitting, but the "clean" punishment is much worse. Not eating, sleeping on the floor... thanks but no thanks.

abuse or hiting are not the only ways do deal with behavior. those are both two very wrong ways that dont teach anything.

many ppl believe giving a patch once in a while isnt a bad thing. I dont think it ever teaches anything other then it is ok to hit when really really upset or somone does somethingr eally bad etc... there is also a very fine line between a patch and hitting that turns into abuse.

happymom

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 12:05 pm

Quote:

if the child is doing somthing that can be dangerous or something that is really bad or even dangerous, then sometimes there is a need for a little spank-as long as you are calm and not letting out your frustrations on your kids.

how will this teach them anything??

all ppl are the same. so I try and see what would help me change if I did something wrong. If my husband would yell at me or critisize me would I want to change? or would I feel angry at him? what do u think a child feels when thier parent hits them

I am certain it isnt : "wow, what I did really wasnt proper. next time I wont ever do it again.

its something more like this "my mommy is really mean. she is hurting me (slapping me lighlty) and that really isnt nice. I feel so sad......" it doesnt teach them ANYTHING postive!

ora_43

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 2:58 pm

happymom wrote:

Quote:

And also, sometimes, you get a good feeling by not hitting, but the "clean" punishment is much worse. Not eating, sleeping on the floor... thanks but no thanks.

I really don't understand this argument against hitting (potching hitting, not beating hitting). Why would hitting be different from any other punishment? My parents gave me the occasional potch. I didn't think it gave me the right to hit others just like I knew that I couldn't send my friends to time out when they upset me. Kids understand that parents are in a position of authority and can decide punishments while kids can't.

Also, if a parent hits correctly, with no anger, then I don't think kids will get the wrong ideas about corporal punishment (that is, start thinking that it means they aren't loved, or that it's OK to hit if you're upset). They'll treat it as a punishment just like missing dessert, getting detention, or any one of the other punishments kids sometimes get.

happymom

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 4:07 pm

Quote:

I didn't think it gave me the right to hit others just like I knew that I couldn't send my friends to time out when they upset me. Kids understand that parents are in a position of authority and can decide punishments while kids can't.

its good u didnt feel that way, many kids do. I see it all the time.

Quote:

Also, if a parent hits correctly, with no anger, then I don't think kids will get the wrong ideas about corporal punishment

the kind of hitting with no anger that the torah talks about is of a very high level. there is a rav (I can find out which one and where he write it) that talks about how in this day and age, we are NOT on that level and therefore hitting is never ok.

SingALong

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 6:02 pm

someone once told me that if you hit your kid out of fear, like if they run in the street or turn on the fire, then its "ok" but if its from anger at your kid or they are being kvetchy and annoying-its not ok to hit, use a different mode of discipline.
I guess its trying to say that you are giving your kid the message that I love you, I dont want you to get hurt or be in danger, so I dont want you to do this dangerous thing again.
but when someone hits out of anger, then the child senses that resentment, and feels abused, and unloved.
Additionally, how often will someone smack a kid if they limit themselves to the times when kids do someting dangerous? really infrequent.

side point, I had to stop taking my kid to the local library since a certain incident. some shaygetz took his kids to the library where there are crayons and coloring paper for the kids. I was sitting with my DD of age 3 who was happily coloring. other parents were sitting with their kids coloring or reading. this guy's kid wanted to color, nebech he was holding this little container of crayons and looking at all the happy kids and asking his father to let him color. he sat at a table and his father pulled at his ear and said "I said git!" and half dragged him away. My DD was traumatized, along with the other parents and kids there. seh said afterwards, "that totty was so angry." I dont want her to see that stuff, she doesn't see it at home. now I'll only take her to that library when its school hours and she has off.

Tefila

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 6:10 pm

Quote:

I keep seeing mothers, babysitters, teachers, abusing thier children and I cannot handel it!

I choose to Concentrate / focus on the many mothers who do, do it right.
since

Quote:

every time I see it I get so upset. how can I not let it affect me so much

Thats how depression can come about u know.Try not to focus on the things wrong with life that you cannot fix but the things that make our very existance a living miracle, the wonders of creation and work on stuff that you can do to make our world a better place ot live in.

mimivan

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 6:54 pm

amother wrote:

Quote:

You DID NOT just write that?!!!!!

u know I ttoally seee how it sounds but really I meant like this:

I live in brooklyn and seriously alot of the blacks here are very abusive and for example my neighbors, the way they talk actually scares me. and I do not want to be spoken to that way. of course there are many many whites and all idff tyopes that are abusive but I am talking about a specific way of talking.

but I still don't think it is race...
I grew up in the Mid West where there were hardly any blacks and a lot of the whites there were very very abusive to their kids. It was impossible to go to the grocery store without seeing a kid being hit and yelled at...

It isn't a black or white issue...but perhaps the pressures of poverty, which of course is no excuse, but an explanation..

mimivan

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 6:58 pm

GAMZu wrote:

amother wrote:

Gamzu I never said I am proud. I said this is how I raise my kids.
Gamzu you know me very well and if you dont want to be friends with me that is fine.

I don't have to agree with everything someone does in order to be her friend. Confused

Yes, as Gamzu said, we are human...the yelling should be the exception to the rule.

micki

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 7:55 pm

today we were in boro park and I saw a mother smacking, and I mean practically pounding her kid about 5 again and again. she had a stroller and was pounding on him anywhere she could. the kid was laughing.
my kids saw it and said, and were very silent. my son said, I think that kid is being bad.

I was quite disturbed by it.

Blossom

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 8:03 pm

Tefila wrote:

Quote:

I keep seeing mothers, babysitters, teachers, abusing thier children and I cannot handel it!

I choose to Concentrate / focus on the many mothers who do, do it right.
since

Quote:

every time I see it I get so upset. how can I not let it affect me so much

Tefila, maybe you can give me some therapy on how to refocus my thoughts. I'm not the OP, but seriously, after I read about or hear about a child abuse case I am so obsessed with it that it disturbs my appetite and sleep.
I think a lot about abused children, about these innocent little things and how some of them are treated and it just makes me very sad.

Blossom

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 8:04 pm

micki wrote:

Micki, I know everybody is different but I definitely would've gone up to that woman and given her a piece of my mind.

happymom

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 8:10 pm

even when its something dangerous that are doing I still believe it is wrong to hit. I mean how would you feel if you were hit when u did something dangerous? that u wont do it again? or angry at the person who just hit u? personally id feel the second way. I actually remember being a kid and I know thats how id feel. its just not the best way of dicipline. there are better ways.

happymom

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 8:11 pm

Quote:

my kids saw it and said, and were very silent. my son said, I think that kid is being bad.

that can be an opportunity to teach them that noone is bad and kids arent bad. sometimes people make mistakes and need to apologize (like that mother in that case, she was wrong) kids also need to know that noone deserves to be treated badly! no matter how "bad" they are

He*Sings*To*Me

Wed, Apr 09 2008, 8:58 pm

I look at my newborn daughter as I am breastfeeding her and shudder at the thought that ANYONE could smack their babies, toddlers, preschoolers. I'm not too sure about how I feel about "older" children...our 7-year-old has become very chutzpahdik. The first several times, my husband and I have explained to her the importance of respecting us, her siblings, and others in general by speaking to others in the same manner that she wants others to speak to her in. We are also very careful to use the words "please" and "thank you" to our children, rather than to bark orders when we need them to do something. She began challenging our authority months before we announced my pregnancy, and we've at times, had to resort to orders, which usually ended with an ultimatum. When she has flat-out refused or has been mouthy, I've popped her in the mouth with my hand and it startled her to the point that she has ceased and desisted, and mellowed out immediately. So, for us, it has worked for chutzpah...and, has proven to be a deterrent. She now thinks twice before mouthing off, because she knows that if she demonstrates the chutzpah with the mouth, I'm going to demonstrate some of my own chutzpah with my hand! It works.

Last edited by He*Sings*To*Me on Wed, Apr 09 2008, 9:17 pm; edited 1 time in total