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My three year old triggers me
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mommy3b2c




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 6:54 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
I really don't understand why you're calling me immature because I said I am close with my three-year-old daughter, that's really hurtful. But I will try to keep in mind that she is just a baby, maybe my expectations for her are too high. Thanks for the advice, regardless of the delivery.


You are not immature for being close with your three year old. I think you are misunderstanding me and a lot of other posters. But anyway, you seem to understand my point here. Your expectations of her are to high, she is just a baby. Please keep reminding yourself, she is just a little baby. Many of us go through what you are describing. Suddenly our toddlers seem like a grownup when the new baby comes. But she’s not, she’s just a baby.
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amother
Thistle


 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 6:57 pm
A friendship, even a best friend is conditional. In order for a friendship to last, it has to go both ways. If one person constantly acts not nice to the other, it would probably end. It can feel scary to a three yr old that she has to act a certain way in order to be loved. It can cause her to act out to see if that's true - will she be loved either way? Or is it conditional like a friendship?

Also sometimes one friend can make a new best friend (the baby for instance here) and that can make the original best friend jealous and angry.

A mothers love is unconditional. No matter what a child does or says and no matter how many children she has.
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amother
OP


 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 7:03 pm
amother [ Thistle ] wrote:
A friendship, even a best friend is conditional. In order for a friendship to last, it has to go both ways. If one person constantly acts not nice to the other, it would probably end. It can feel scary to a three yr old that she has to act a certain way in order to be loved. It can cause her to act out to see if that's true - will she be loved either way? Or is it conditional like a friendship?

Also sometimes one friend can make a new best friend (the baby for instance here) and that can make the original best friend jealous and angry.

A mothers love is unconditional. No matter what a child does or says and no matter how many children she has.


This is well put and also phrased kindly, thank you. I'll be referring back to this. It never occurred to me that her behavior is testing my love to see if it's conditional. Does it make a difference that unconditional love is a big theme in our house and we're always saying "mommy loves you even when we argue" and "mommy loves you no matter what "?
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keym




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 7:13 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
This is well put and also phrased kindly, thank you. I'll be referring back to this. It never occurred to me that her behavior is testing my love to see if it's conditional. Does it make a difference that unconditional love is a big theme in our house and we're always saying "mommy loves you even when we argue" and "mommy loves you no matter what "?


Well you say it.
But toddlers are notorious for needing proof to believe. You say that's sharp, they'll try to touch it. You say a car is coming, they'll run to look.
You say mommy loves you,she wants proof that it's true. Even if I scream? Even if I tantrum? Even if I refuse to take my bath? Even if I hit the baby?
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batya100




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 7:16 pm
OP you sound like a warm, intuitive and connected Mommy!
I had the same thing with my oldest - he was 3 and actually loved the new baby but boy oh boy was he mad at me! I was shocked! He actually kicked me when I came home from the hospital!
It took him time to adjust to sharing my attention... but BH time heals!

About the unconditional love, imho it def. helps to say that Mommy loves you no matter what, always and forever! But still, children do pick up on our emotions and being that you are human, believe it or not, it's fine if your dd sometimes gets hurt that you're angry at her, feels rejected, criticized etc - it is part of life!

When I sometimes lose it with my kids, I reassure myself that yeah, I sometimes felt hurt, angry... by my mother's actions while I was growing up, but BH I know she loves me deeply unconditionally.
We obviously try to do our best, but we can accept our limitations and weaknesses with love and daven that our kids will be resilient and grow and mature in every way.

Hatzlacha OP!!
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amother
OP


 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 7:19 pm
batya100 wrote:
OP you sound like a warm, intuitive and connected Mommy!
I had the same thing with my oldest - he was 3 and actually loved the new baby but boy oh boy was he mad at me! I was shocked! He actually kicked me when I came home from the hospital!
It took him time to adjust to sharing my attention... but BH time heals!

About the unconditional love, imho it def. helps to say that Mommy loves you no matter what, always and forever! But still, children do pick up on our emotions and being that you are human, believe it or not, it's fine if your dd sometimes gets hurt that you're angry at her, feels rejected, criticized etc - it is part of life!

When I sometimes lose it with my kids, I reassure myself that yeah, I sometimes felt hurt, angry... by my mother's actions while I was growing up, but BH I know she loves me deeply unconditionally.
We obviously try to do our best, but we can accept our limitations and weaknesses with love and daven that our kids will be resilient and grow and mature in every way.

Hatzlacha OP!!


Your empathy and advice is more appreciated than you will ever know!
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amother
Blushpink


 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 7:28 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Again, I keep saying that she is consistently disciplined. She does not ever get away with speaking to me disrespectfully or acting rude. And just because I know her weaknesses (and I very much do, I'm not in denial) doesn't mean I don't think she's the most perfect little thing in the world. Who in the world is supposed to see the best in us and think we are brilliant and perfect if not our own parents who created us?!


I think it’s great to only see the best, but it sounds like you only think that when she acts perfectly. You need to give a little extra love and acceptance now, she was upset to be sent away, about the new baby, and your new annoyance with her.
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amother
Thistle


 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 7:30 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
This is well put and also phrased kindly, thank you. I'll be referring back to this. It never occurred to me that her behavior is testing my love to see if it's conditional. Does it make a difference that unconditional love is a big theme in our house and we're always saying "mommy loves you even when we argue" and "mommy loves you no matter what "?


Sure it helps - it's great that it's a theme in your house. Just make sure to back it up with actions. For example if you tell a child she/he will get a cookie if they behave while you shop but you never end up giving it, they'll learn not to trust you. If a child is told they are loved no matter what, but then the parents actions don't match that, it's confusing to the child. Can they trust mommy? Does mommy really love them no matter what? I really need that feeling of security that mommy loves me no matter what happens. Lets test this is out by acting out and see....

Just want to also add to this that there is no such thing as a perfect parent. The fact that your so devastated about this and so aware of your feelings towards your daughter - shows that your a great parent - otherwise you wouldn't care.
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allthingsblue




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 7:58 pm
mommy3b2c wrote:
This. And I will take it a step further. You will know their flaws and their imperfections and you will love them and think they are amazing people IN SPITE of it all. Because what happens when they get older and they are just not that perfect and brilliant and gorgeous anymore? Do you suddenly love them less?


I literally used to worry if anyone would love me if I woke up and wasn’t as (talented/pretty/smart). That’s why I tell my kids all the time “ I love you because you’re you, you’re my child, and I’ll always love you. I make sure not to say things like “you’re so cute! I love you!” Or “you’re so smart! I love you!” So that the love should be independent and unconditional.

But I digress.

Op, you do sound mature, just maybe you need to work on boundaries. You seem to be taking it personally. This is a stage. Your children will go through stages. It’s easy to love them when they’re cute and sweet, but we also need to love them when they are angry, confrontational, etc. In fact that might be when they need us most.

I try very hard to stay calm, validate, and many times the storm blows over. Distraction is also a good tool.
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lamplighter




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 10:06 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
The best way to guide someone with love is to see the best in them, to think they are beautiful and brilliant, to feel good about our connection with them and to be best friends with them.


Actually children need us to be the adults, not their equals. But that's a whole other topic. She's not your best friend, she's 3 for goodness sakes. It doesn't matter how mature she is, she is not your best friend.

The thing is you're the one who said she is triggering you, that she's not her brilliant amazing self. I'm saying that we should not make it about our gushy love and thier perfect brilliance but rather to love them unconditionally even when they are triggering. And acting like normal 3 year olds who was sent away while her mother found a new best friend.

I'd love for you to revisit this thread in 10 years.
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amother
Pearl


 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 10:21 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
I meant to see the best in the person.


I think that’s where we (and you) are getting stuck- it’s seeing the good and the bad of your child and loving all of it. That’s why you’re not just friends. She’ll have enough ppl Iyh loving her and admiring her exceptional beauty and smarts. She needs her mom to just love her.
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amother
Pearl


 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 10:28 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
In general when she ignores what I'm saying or when she becomes unreasonable. I guess I'm just used to her being sweet and go-with-the-flow.


I think it can be good to reframe- she is supposed to do these things as a toddler, she’s not supposed to be good all the time.
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WhatFor




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Oct 14 2021, 11:03 pm
OP, maybe this has already been explained but I think people are responding to the "best friend" bit because maybe they think you mean that you have expectations of your daughter like one would have of a friend. If my friend was behaving irrationally and needy, I would distance myself. If my baby was, I'd give her even more attention (or whatever she needed that was causing her to behave that way).

Anyway, my first thought on reading your OP is I wonder how much of your reaction is due to pp hormones. I also don't think your DD is behaving alarmingly, based on what you described. Her mother suddenly went away for ages (in her 3 year old conception of time, she may not have even understood that you were returning), came back with another baby, and now has less time for her.

Imagine if your DH suddenly left you for a week, you couldn't understand why, and he came home with a new wife. Then when you were outraged and angry, he kept patting your head and telling you he still loves you and you're behaving unreasonably. Obviously that analogy doesn't hold up from your side of things (you're not bringing home another spouse), but perhaps that's what it feels like from your 3yo's perspective.

Can DH watch the newbie so you can take special time to go out with your DD for ice cream? Also even when with the newbie, maybe you can just wear him/her while focusing all of your attention on DD. When you're feeding the baby, ask DD to join you and read her a book. While the newbie may need a lot physically from you right now, I think your DD is more in need of your attention and emotional connection.
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amother
Hotpink


 

Post Fri, Oct 15 2021, 12:15 am
OP you should check out Dr Koslowitz on Instagram - she's @dr.koslowitzpsychology. She talks about this type of topic a lot....her thing is Post-Traumatic Parenting and I've learned a lot from her Lives and her page. She wrote something once that stuck with me about how the whole purpose of a toddler is to figure out the world, and you are your child's world, so when she's pushing your buttons she's trying to figure out what makes you tick..... Was one of the most helpful things I ever read, and it really helped me with a lot of other things that my toddler was doing.
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amother
Blueberry


 

Post Fri, Oct 15 2021, 12:34 am
I don’t know… to me this sounds like a very normal maternal instinct thing.

You were very close with your three year old but now you have a strong instinctual protective response to your newborn and so the closeness with your three year old is (temporarily) on hold.

On some instinctual biological level you may even see the three year old as a threat to the safety of your newborn.

I thought this was a very normal postpartum thing and the relationship will return to a good place (a new normal) once newborn is a little bit older

Just my two cents
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Oct 15 2021, 3:40 am
You seem to be assuming that if she's testing your patience, that means something is wrong.

On the contrary. She's 3. This is what "terrible 2s" (/3s) is! This is a healthy stage! It's important for kids to detach a little bit at certain stages. Over time that's how they eventually turn into independent adults. Right now your dd needs to test her boundaries as her own person, to figure out when she is going to listen to mommy and when she isn't and where the limits are.

Weird as it may sound, her screaming and pushing your buttons is exactly the kind of behavior you want to be seeing. The fact that she's succeeding in irritating you means she's a smart kid who understands emotions.

OK, it also might have something to do with how she's your oldest and you're attaching a bit too much importance to her current behavior. Once you've seen it a couple times, and seen them come out of it on the other side as (mostly...) sweet and friendly 4/5 year olds, the 3-year-old defiant stage seems less threatening.

Long story short: relax. That stage at the beginning where your child is a perfect angel who can do no wrong, and the two of you are in perfect sync, never lasts. It's not supposed to last. And in the long run that's a good thing. Iy'H you'll come out the other end with a beautiful, loving connection between two imperfect, independent people who don't always agree.
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Oct 15 2021, 3:47 am
I think people are getting caught on 'friend' because to a lot of people that implies a relationship very different from a parent-child relationship. Like, friends don't try to make big life decisions for each other, or to shape each other's behavior or worldview.

But if I understand you, you're using 'friend' to basically mean that you don't just love your daughter, you also like her, and enjoy spending time together. And I agree that that's a wonderful thing and an excellent goal as a parent.

You just need to keep in mind that sometimes, her emotional needs are going to include a certain need to drive you away. That doesn't mean you can't still enjoy each other's company and genuinely have fun together - it just means that sometimes (mostly now, and when she's somewhere in the 11-14 range, but not only then) those good times are going to be interspersed with times where she's screaming at you for basically no reason, or being defiant over something that makes no sense. It's all good Smile write down some of the reasons for her tantrums, someday you'll both laugh about it.
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SuperWify




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Oct 15 2021, 4:29 am
keym wrote:
Well you say it.
But toddlers are notorious for needing proof to believe. You say that's sharp, they'll try to touch it. You say a car is coming, they'll run to look.
You say mommy loves you,she wants proof that it's true. Even if I scream? Even if I tantrum? Even if I refuse to take my bath? Even if I hit the baby?


Very well said. and a great reminder.

IMO Anyone with little kids should print this out and hang this up on their fridge.
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Chickensoupprof




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Oct 15 2021, 4:48 am
Maybe an advice... for some people who don't have it in their hashkafa/derech to share pregnancies with children but at least do it in the 3rd semester please. Introduce your pregnancy to your children, read a book about (there are frum books out there) of a child who comes the new brother or sister. If you are going to a kimpeturin home or have your mom/mil stay over to help you out make sure someone is looking for after your other child and give it love and everything.
I often went with the sluchim children to the park and give their attention while the mother had a baby, I also was at my post partrum friend giving her food and everything while the daddy had time to take out the other children. And explain it to the children and no you don't need to say 'Well mummys v@gina is torn and bloods like hell and is tired and has pain and needs to adjust to your new sibling' you say 'for the next month mommy will be really tired and needs to sleep and rest a lot and then mummy can do things again' and whenever you are shlepping with your infant 'Oh who wants to give the baby the socks?' or 'Who wants to help mummy with...' so the children feel that they are still important.
Also be sure you have the right people for you there. My mom had a c-section and couldn't do much when my brother was born and I was 4. She had a postpartum nurse (you get a week post-Patrum care in the Netherlands and more if you had surgery) and she sent her away. Why? Because my mom really want to let me be involved with the care of the baby because I was really loving the baby and was so happy to be a big sister and this nurse happened to sneer at me that I should not touch the baby, that the baby needs to be with mummy, that I couldn't help with formula or snuggle against my mummy something I really liked as 4 year old. And when my mom went for a nap... the nurse was only holding the baby and doing cute and ignored me.... So my mom called for another nurse who was so cute with me we did together with the baby in the bath and I could help with things... Children need that... and also know that there will be a new baby. I was totally exatic to be a big sister... A month before my mother got a baby she gave me new clothes and I cried a big time in this store. ''Mama you are a bad mother! I get new clothes and the baby doesn't the baby in your tummy is really cold because it is getting colder outside!' and I cried and cried and then my dad 'Esther... the baby is in mama's tummy... HOW will the clothing get in?'' ''WELL SHE HAS TO EAT IT...'' And then I could choose something for the baby and I gave my unborn brother a cute set... Oh so empathic why did I got the asd diangoses anyway.
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SuperWify




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Oct 15 2021, 4:53 am
Op, I get you. We all want to succeed in parenting. We all want our children to love us, to trust us and to feel like they are loved. Most important, we want them to feel that as parents, we did our best and they know it.

parents who were raised to fear their parents tend to go in the opposite extreme.

But extremes are never healthy. We need to learn the magic balance. (Which is very hard when we are programmed to do the complete opposite of what our parents did.)

I know someone who was raised in an extremely dysfunctional environment. Her parents couldn’t care a dime for her. She overcompensated by having her own children call her by her first name so that she could “be their best friends”. Obviously that’s completely inappropriate no matter her intentions. She was running away from the strict demands of respect her parents placed on her and going to opposite side of that spectrum. The problem is that the opposite side is equally dysfunctional.

Why? Simple. Children look to their parents as their superheroes. Children need their parents to be that stable loving constant figure of security in a crazy world. It’s not about the parents getting respect, it’s about the children feeling secure.

A child needs the emotional security a parent can give. A child cannot give emotional security to a parent though like best friend might.

I also had a baby recently and my 4 year old took it hard. His stable world was uprooted. I went away for a week and I felt terrible. When I came home, he seemed almost fine but his bedtime schedule was crazy. He refused to go to bed in his own bed. Guess what, it’s over six months later and he still falls asleep in my bed. And that’s ok, because he needs the security to know that I’m here for him. But because I respect my own boundaries as well, (time for myself, time for me and dh only ect) once he’s sleeping I carry him back to bed. And I believe that’s healthy and ok.

I second Dr. Koslowitz, she has an amazing podcast called post traumatic-parenting.
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