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Im seriously shocked!! such bad customer service....
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watergirl




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 10:01 am
amother [ Jasmine ] wrote:
But people get so annoyed even when we try to please them- how dare you send me something dirty??? Even though I paid $10 for a blanket on sale that costed you $20…

Sorry, what? It does not matter how much I paid or how much the store paid for the item (you work for the store, you do not own it, so you are not the one who purchased it to sell), unless the item was marked and sold as damaged, it should arrive in pristine condition. Sale or not.
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amother




Jasmine
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 11:10 am
watergirl wrote:
Sorry, what? It does not matter how much I paid or how much the store paid for the item (you work for the store, you do not own it, so you are not the one who purchased it to sell), unless the item was marked and sold as damaged, it should arrive in pristine condition. Sale or not.


Did you read what I wrote? No normal business would sell something intentionally with a stain. That would damage their reputation for no good reason. I’m just pointing out that if a mistake happens there’s no need to be nasty or rush to dispute it on your credit card before trying to see if you can get a refund.

And speaking of disputes because I handle them- in all of my years doing this no customer has ever won.
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watergirl




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 11:20 am
amother [ Jasmine ] wrote:
Did you read what I wrote? No normal business would sell something intentionally with a stain. That would damage their reputation for no good reason. I’m just pointing out that if a mistake happens there’s no need to be nasty or rush to dispute it on your credit card before trying to see if you can get a refund.

And speaking of disputes because I handle them- in all of my years doing this no customer has ever won.

Yes, I read what you wrote thank you. OP was in no way nasty, but the reply she received is unacceptable.

My response to you, which I cut to show what I was replying to, was only questioning why you made sure to point out that she bought a $10 shirt which cost the store more initially. It doesn’t matter what she paid.
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amother




Latte
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 11:25 am
FranticFrummie wrote:
If you can't afford to run a decent store and still have good profit margins, then maybe you're in the wrong business.

You can't pick and choose which customers you want to be nice to. The customer who is stressed out might be the one who is in the most need of a little kindness that day. Just breaking the rules for people you like is incredibly unfair and unprofessional.

I'm a very nonconfrontational person, and always try to take the friendly approach whenever possible. What if you decide you don't like something about me, or if you are having a bad day? I should suffer for that?

It’s not a matter of who I do or don’t like but let’s say you come in a day after your return window and you start yelling at me that our store policy is crazy and you are never shopping here again well that probably won’t make me decide to make an exception for your return. However if you come in and say I’m sorry I know it’s past the return window but my baby was sick yesterday and I couldn’t come I would be much more likely to make an exception. I am human too I understand.
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ShishKabob




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 11:35 am
The person handling the call should've been more sympathetic and professional and offered something due to the damage.
However, I do like to say, that whenever there's a fundraiser or there's a fire chalilah, or any other type of tzeddakah, the local jewish stores do contribute very nicely and graciously. You DO NOT FIND THAT with the department stores or online stores.
I'm not condoning the very restrictive return policies, but at least it's balanced out with some other good.
You can't continue shopping elsewhere and then run to the local stores when you need a favor or other.

There's a local store here in Monsey that allowed me to take an outfit home without paying, so that my ds can try it on at home and they let me pay for it afterwards. They'd rather not charge my card and then refund it, they'd rather trust me to go home and then pay for it afterwards or not pay for it, if I didn't keep it. (my ds couldn't come into the store during hours) I can't think of a department store doing that for anyone, nor are they required to.
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amother




Chicory
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 11:54 am
There are some nice Jewish local store with good customer service, but they are very few, unfortunately.

I Reiterate, there's a middle ground. No one here has complained about stores not accepting returns past the week permitted. Please reread the posts. The complaints are not about making exceptions to stated store rules. The people here are willing to abide by store policy but are complaining that stores need to have more reasonable policies.

Customers would like clean, not damaged merchandise. Customers would like an acceptable return policy, be it 3 days or a week. Customers would like their payment returned in the manner they paid - be it credit card or cash. Customers don't want a store credit especially since they usually come with so many restrictions so as to render it useless.

I think if local stores want our business, these type of policies seem fair.

I will talk about problem Customers in the next post so as not to muddle this topic.

At the end of the day, local stores have a choice - be right or be smart. If you insist that bad Customers force you to make ridiculous policies, you end up losing all those good Customers you want also. Then, where does it leave you?
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amother




Tealblue
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:00 pm
Genius wrote:
This is one Jewish shop you should never step into again. I don’t think it’s fair to smear all Jewish shops though. I see customer service improving at my local shops as the competition grows. Shop wherever you like (or don’t shop wherever you don’t) but don’t spread negativity. The shops that might lose out because of the bad press, did nothing to deserve it.
I do hope you get a replacement or refund. Stores shouldn’t sell dirty items.

I totally agree>
I work as a saleslady in a very popular store.

We service very generously when it comes to stains or defects, even after several uses and washes.
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amother




Bluebell
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:03 pm
amother [ Quince ] wrote:
Imagine if a store has a 2-3 day money back policy. Someone gets 3 dresses in 5 sizes each and brings it back 3 days later. Meanwhile, others had wanted that dress & the store didn't have it, and they lost out on sales. If the policy is next day money back, it makes people think twice before buying tons only to return everything 3 days later. (And often dirty). Local shops are not department stores that have unlimited stock.
I've been serviced PLENTY by grouchy salespeople at department stores. Plenty.


This is a very strange concept to me. I would never imagine buying a bunch of items with the knowledge half will be returned and trying them all on at home. I think this is a Jewish thing...
I have heard people saying they order extra items from stores like Gap or Zara online to get to the free shipping minimum then just return them. This issue is foreign to me. Every time I return something in a nonJewish store I wonder if they are thinking "another Jewish person making returns..". For example if I get an item online and it doesn't fit, and I return it, I am even hesitant to return.

I guess with the initial concept of the thread, the fault is on both sides. Customers who take advantage, and stores who aren't flexible.
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LovesHashem




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:05 pm
amother [ Chicory ] wrote:
There are some nice Jewish local store with good customer service, but they are very few, unfortunately.

I Reiterate, there's a middle ground. No one here has complained about stores not accepting returns past the week permitted. Please reread the posts. The complaints are not about making exceptions to stated store rules. The people here are willing to abide by store policy but are complaining that stores need to have more reasonable policies.

Customers would like clean, not damaged merchandise. Customers would like an acceptable return policy, be it 3 days or a week. Customers would like their payment returned in the manner they paid - be it credit card or cash. Customers don't want a store credit especially since they usually come with so many restrictions so as to render it useless.

I think if local stores want our business, these type of policies seem fair.

I will talk about problem Customers in the next post so as not to muddle this topic.

At the end of the day, local stores have a choice - be right or be smart. If you insist that bad Customers force you to make ridiculous policies, you end up losing all those good Customers you want also. Then, where does it leave you?


I don't care how many bad customers you have. There's no excuse for selling damaged products and refusing to refund it.

In Israel we have 48 hours to get money back and 2 weeks for a store credit. We're all used to it. It's not a big deal.

But when we get store credit it's usually good for up to a year or two years and can be used during sales. It doesn't have limits on it.
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Reality




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:05 pm
amother [ Peru ] wrote:
I don't think it reflects on customer service if a store refuses to accept a return that is missing its tag.


First of all I wanted to exchange it because my daughter loved the dress. It was obviously unworn from the way it looked. If you looked at it it was obvious that it was defective. It came damaged and we didn't realize until after my daughter had snipped the tags before Yom Tov. I had the receipt that it was purchased a few days before.

I didn't make a big deal. I accepted what she said without arguing. My point was people make it sound like department stores have the most amazing customer service and they don't always.
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amother




Chicory
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:07 pm
Any business, local or otherwise, has had to deal with nasty customers at one point or another. If you want to keep the business open, the stores need to have effective policies on how to deal with those customers.

As an aside, it is usually the same few people acting nasty. You need to find a way to deal with them, while not chasing away good customers.

I'll suggest some ideas and I'm sure many of you can chime in as well.

All stores nowadays are computerized. Records are kept which makes things easier.

Some suggestions:

1- limit amount of purchase that can be bought and returned in any given time. For instance, store policy allows items up to $200 to be bought and returned in 3 day span.

2 - limit items that can be bought and returned in a given time. For instance, 3 items in a 3 day span.

3 - For repeat customers who buy 12 items and return 11, you put a cap in the computer of only one item or none. You nicely tell the customer that since she already returned 10 items since September 1, the computer has blocked her from making returns for this year so please make sure you like what you're buying because you won't be able to return them...


The point is there's a way to make fair policies while still dealing with the problem customers.

All those local stores that insist they have no choice are really just kicking themselves in the pants. They're taking the easy way out by making unreasonable policies which scares away the good customers they really want. A much better idea is to make reasonable policies and different ones for nasty customers. It's totally doable, especially nowadays where you can set the computer up with restrictions for some
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LovesHashem




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:11 pm
amother [ Jasmine ] wrote:
Did you read what I wrote? No normal business would sell something intentionally with a stain. That would damage their reputation for no good reason. I’m just pointing out that if a mistake happens there’s no need to be nasty or rush to dispute it on your credit card before trying to see if you can get a refund.

And speaking of disputes because I handle them- in all of my years doing this no customer has ever won.


I only brought up credit card disputes in scenarios where the store is refusing to give money back.

Like my friend recently ordered from a frum company having a sale. A month later her order didn't ship. Suddenly they say some items are out of stock (WTH do they not count their stock????) and offer items of equal value. She tells them what items she will take instead. They send her 2 items instead of 4. And mind you they were also on sale for the same amount she paid so there's no reason she should get 2 and not 4. She wasn't asked if she'd be fine with 2/4 and wasn't asked if she would prefer a refund. Whenever she emails it takes them 5 days to answer. No phone number. At this point it's been 5 weeks since shes ordered, many emails, and they shipped 2 items instead of 4 for a price she didn't agree to. She disputed the charge. I don't blame her.

And in any case I've never lost a credit card or PayPal dispute. Maybe I am a reasonable person and only dispute when there's a solid reason too. Idk.
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LovesHashem




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:15 pm
amother [ Bluebell ] wrote:
This is a very strange concept to me. I would never imagine buying a bunch of items with the knowledge half will be returned and trying them all on at home. I think this is a Jewish thing...
I have heard people saying they order extra items from stores like Gap or Zara online to get to the free shipping minimum then just return them. This issue is foreign to me. Every time I return something in a nonJewish store I wonder if they are thinking "another Jewish person making returns..". For example if I get an item online and it doesn't fit, and I return it, I am even hesitant to return.

I guess with the initial concept of the thread, the fault is on both sides. Customers who take advantage, and stores who aren't flexible.


I actually did this with a store in Israel. I ordered a few things in 2 sizes during an online sale. But in Israel you have 2 days to get your money back so I returned them to a store the day after I got it.

People do this with shoes as well. I'm considering ordering shoes from England to Israel and want to make sure I get my size right. Order once a bunch of pairs with two sizes each and keep what fits.

I do think if a customer brings in a dirty item even with tags it should not be refunded. There's a difference between stains and just dust. How on earth do things get that dirty when being tried on?
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amother




Jasmine
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 1:16 pm
LovesHashem wrote:
I only brought up credit card disputes in scenarios where the store is refusing to give money back.

Like my friend recently ordered from a frum company having a sale. A month later her order didn't ship. Suddenly they say some items are out of stock (WTH do they not count their stock????) and offer items of equal value. She tells them what items she will take instead. They send her 2 items instead of 4. And mind you they were also on sale for the same amount she paid so there's no reason she should get 2 and not 4. She wasn't asked if she'd be fine with 2/4 and wasn't asked if she would prefer a refund. Whenever she emails it takes them 5 days to answer. No phone number. At this point it's been 5 weeks since shes ordered, many emails, and they shipped 2 items instead of 4 for a price she didn't agree to. She disputed the charge. I don't blame her.

And in any case I've never lost a credit card or PayPal dispute. Maybe I am a reasonable person and only dispute when there's a solid reason too. Idk.


Ok but that’s a crazy story. The company sounds ridiculously unprofessional. I honestly can’t believe that most frum business work that way. Most people dispute because the item took an extra day to arrive or because there return came back in an unusable condition.

I work for a few different frum companies in the customer service department and I can promise you if they ever sent something stained by mistake they would refund the customer without a question.

I will say that there are customers who send back and return stained items and then try to blame it ion the company and say- I got it like this. Which is highly unlikely because most complained inspect each Iria before sending it out.

Or they send it back without buttons, tags, really crumpled and not usable ect. And then they complain that we can’t accept the return because we gently can’t resell it. We’re not macys we can’t afford to take back something we can’t sell. No frum company can.
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ShishKabob




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 1:20 pm
amother [ Jasmine ] wrote:

Or they send it back without buttons, tags, really crumpled and not usable ect. And then they complain that we can’t accept the return because we gently can’t resell it. We’re not macys we can’t afford to take back something we can’t sell. No frum company can.
This, I think that some bad apples ruin it for everyone and they're the ones that complain the loudest and make the most noise.
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LovesHashem




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 1:58 pm
amother [ Jasmine ] wrote:
Ok but that’s a crazy story. The company sounds ridiculously unprofessional. I honestly can’t believe that most frum business work that way. Most people dispute because the item took an extra day to arrive or because there return came back in an unusable condition.

I work for a few different frum companies in the customer service department and I can promise you if they ever sent something stained by mistake they would refund the customer without a question.

I will say that there are customers who send back and return stained items and then try to blame it ion the company and say- I got it like this. Which is highly unlikely because most complained inspect each Iria before sending it out.

Or they send it back without buttons, tags, really crumpled and not usable ect. And then they complain that we can’t accept the return because we gently can’t resell it. We’re not macys we can’t afford to take back something we can’t sell. No frum company can.


Fine have policies like that. Those are normal policies. But many frum stores do not have good ones. Not all, but many.

My neighbor used to do customer service for a big store and quit because it was so difficult to watch the customers get treated horribly and email her with problems and she couldn't do anything.

She said it was too hard to get emails from people saying they received ripped items and her boss told her to tell them they can't help them and they don't take responsibility for clothing.
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amother




Indigo
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 11:48 pm
I always have horrible experiences in local jewish stores. I still shop there because some things I cant get in department stores or amazon.

Once I bought my daughter a gorgeous shabbos dress. really high end. She wore it once and the whole thing unraveled. it literally fell apart at the seams.

I brought it to the store and the lady insisted that my daughter snagged it on something and thats why it ripped. She tried to show me that it was only that seam and not the other seams. While showing me she pulled a little too hard and the other seam unraveled. She basically proved I was right and she was wrong since the product was defective and fell apart while she was holding it. Within the same breath she then tried to say that because my daughter snagged the dress on one side (which she didnt) thats why the other side unraveled when she pulled on it. Then she went straight into her next point to tell me it was final sale anyway and it doesnt matter that the product was garbage because its final sale and last years style anyway so she cant replace it even if she wanted to.

I was so disgusted. The dress retailed for $150. I purchased it at 70% off at the end of the season when she had to make room for next years inventory. It's not like she was going to keep it on the shelf anyway. At least give me a credit for what I paid so I can buy something else.
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amother




Feverfew
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 6:12 am
amother [ Peru ] wrote:
Agree with this. This is not a case of which came first the chicken or the egg. These policies are a result of very inappropriate behavior among some of our crowds. The stores have no choice but to adapt such policies to protect themselves.


So maybe we're barking up the wrong tree here. Why do "our crowds" cultivate the kind of person who takes advantage of store policies? Why is there a larger percentage of difficult customers in frum stores than at other places?
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amother




DarkOrange
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 7:31 am
amother [ Feverfew ] wrote:
So maybe we're barking up the wrong tree here. Why do "our crowds" cultivate the kind of person who takes advantage of store policies? Why is there a larger percentage of difficult customers in frum stores than at other places?


Maybe this is a no fault situation.

Our stores don't have the ability to order huge stock like a chain store, so they can't swallow as many losses.
They are also catering to a homogeneous crowd, where everyone wants to shop at the same seasonal times. After yuntif everything is pretty quick to go on sale.
Families also have BH many more children. So a mother who wants to take home extra sizes might have to take for several kids.
Then there's the fact that the mothers who are shopping also work, and the ladies manning the store are also mothers. So shopping hours are limited (most frum stores I know of in Flatbush close at 6) and mothers are scrambling to go after work.
Some outfits are dependant on matching shells working out, some are dependant on multiple sizes working...there's so much more that goes into it.

I don't like the frum store policies. But I get it. And I don't take advantage, but I could see how the way I shop by necessity would make it hard or impossible for Jewish stores to have "normal" policies and still make a profit.
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amother




DarkOrange
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 7:41 am
amother [ Bluebell ] wrote:
This is a very strange concept to me. I would never imagine buying a bunch of items with the knowledge half will be returned and trying them all on at home. I think this is a Jewish thing...
I have heard people saying they order extra items from stores like Gap or Zara online to get to the free shipping minimum then just return them. This issue is foreign to me. Every time I return something in a nonJewish store I wonder if they are thinking "another Jewish person making returns..". For example if I get an item online and it doesn't fit, and I return it, I am even hesitant to return.

I guess with the initial concept of the thread, the fault is on both sides. Customers who take advantage, and stores who aren't flexible.


Oh, please. Definitely not a Jewish thing. Some websites have a drop down list of reasons for returns, and many have the option of "ordered multiple sizes". Also most big chain stores encourage ordering with "free shipping and free returns!!" And "try it for free, free shipping for returns" and so on. It's a marketing thing. For those bigger stores, it's worth the loss to get people to buy more.
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