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Im seriously shocked!! such bad customer service....
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amother




Dill
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 8:04 am
I do hope you get a refund. You deserve decent customer service on a sale item. No I dont work in a store. I also like good customer service. I AGREE with the poster than said I'm sure the store didn't send you a defective item on purpose. And you know the 4000 or however many items they shipped out in perfect condition. Its possible one was damaged.
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amother




Quince
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 8:24 am
amother [ Feverfew ] wrote:
So maybe we're barking up the wrong tree here. Why do "our crowds" cultivate the kind of person who takes advantage of store policies? Why is there a larger percentage of difficult customers in frum stores than at other places?


It's not a bigger percentage. But department stores can afford the losses caused by the behavior of bad customers that abuse store policy. Local shops can't afford it.
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amother




Feverfew
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 8:39 am
amother [ Quince ] wrote:
It's not a bigger percentage. But department stores can afford the losses caused by the behavior of bad customers that abuse store policy. Local shops can't afford it.


I hope you are right, but I wonder.

About five years ago, an internet retailer that sold kids' designer clothing banned returns from 5 zip codes - all heavily populated with frum Jews- because of customers from those locations abusing the return policies.
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amother




Quince
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 8:44 am
amother [ Feverfew ] wrote:
I hope you are right, but I wonder.

About five years ago, an internet retailer that sold kids' designer clothing banned returns from 5 zip codes - all heavily populated with frum Jews- because of customers from those locations abusing the return policies.


I remember that. I still don't think we have a larger percentage that abuse policy, we just get a larger percentage of shopping done, especially in certain seasons.
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amother




Bluebell
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 8:51 am
amother [ Quince ] wrote:
It's not a bigger percentage. But department stores can afford the losses caused by the behavior of bad customers that abuse store policy. Local shops can't afford it.


How do you know it’s not a bigger percentage? I think it definitely is.
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amother




Bluebell
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 8:52 am
amother [ Quince ] wrote:
I remember that. I still don't think we have a larger percentage that abuse policy, we just get a larger percentage of shopping done, especially in certain seasons.


Frum Jews are less than 0.5% of the American population. If we act like everyone else, no, I don’t think our shopping in early September would be a blip on their radar.
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amother




Quince
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 9:01 am
amother [ Bluebell ] wrote:
Frum Jews are less than 0.5% of the American population. If we act like everyone else, no, I don’t think our shopping in early September would be a blip on their radar.


It depends where we shop. At some places, jews are the biggest percentage of shoppers, especially in the yom tov season. We buy full wardrobes for many kids. Though if I remember correctly, that store didn't take returns from certain zip codes, not because people were abusing policy, but because people bought a lot and returned a lot and they needed the stock. They only had this policy for a week or two during yom tov season. They couldn't afford to have people buying out the stock only to return most of the things after busy season and they could've sold the items already.
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amother




Bluebell
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 9:26 am
amother [ Quince ] wrote:
It depends where we shop. At some places, jews are the biggest percentage of shoppers, especially in the yom tov season. We buy full wardrobes for many kids. Though if I remember correctly, that store didn't take returns from certain zip codes, not because people were abusing policy, but because people bought a lot and returned a lot and they needed the stock. They only had this policy for a week or two during yom tov season. They couldn't afford to have people buying out the stock only to return most of the things after busy season and they could've sold the items already.


There are no national chains where the majority of shoppers are frum Jews, even Zara crew cuts hm whatever. We are such a tiny percentage of people.
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amother




Bronze
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 9:54 am
amother [ Bluebell ] wrote:
There are no national chains where the majority of shoppers are frum Jews, even Zara crew cuts hm whatever. We are such a tiny percentage of people.

True but they can track trends within zipcodes. I do remember this story, though I think it might have been a different store. I have mixed feelings about it. OTOH you can't discriminate, change your return policy for all if you think people are taking advantage. OTOH it's pretty embarrassing for them to realize this was a pattern in a certain area and figuring out that it was a religious Jewish area where so many customers were taking advantage.
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amother




Quince
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 9:56 am
amother [ Bluebell ] wrote:
There are no national chains where the majority of shoppers are frum Jews, even Zara crew cuts hm whatever. We are such a tiny percentage of people.


Right. But it is very obvious when a big percentage of certain zip codes have certain shopping trends.
And this wasn't a chain store, it was a website that sells the same brands and clothing as the local frum stores and also designer clothing.
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amother




Begonia
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 10:06 am
amother [ Quince ] wrote:
Right. But it is very obvious when a big percentage of certain zip codes have certain shopping trends.
And this wasn't a chain store, it was a website that sells the same brands and clothing as the local frum stores and also designer clothing.

Then they should be sued for discrimination, plain and simple. They should change the policy for everyone but they are not allowed to say they won't sell to a certain group.
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amother




Quince
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 10:09 am
amother [ Begonia ] wrote:
Then they should be sued for discrimination, plain and simple. They should change the policy for everyone but they are not allowed to say they won't sell to a certain group.


I think they did change the policy for everyone for those 2 weeks and people just spread the word that it's because of that.
But those people did not abuse policy, the store just needed the stock so they changed the policy for erev yom tov season.
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amother




Bronze
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 10:09 am
amother [ Begonia ] wrote:
Then they should be sued for discrimination, plain and simple. They should change the policy for everyone but they are not allowed to say they won't sell to a certain group.

First of all, they didn't refuse to sell. They just tightened the return policy.
Second, it wasn't a group, it was for the zip codes with a major pattern of taking advantage of the return policy.
Third, whether or not it was discrimination, it was not a good look for our community. We can and should do better.
Finally, they did reverse it after there was an outcry.
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amother




Quince
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 10:16 am
amother [ Bronze ] wrote:
First of all, they didn't refuse to sell. They just tightened the return policy.
Second, it wasn't a group, it was for the zip codes with a major pattern of taking advantage of the return policy.
Third, whether or not it was discrimination, it was not a good look for our community. We can and should do better.
Finally, they did reverse it after there was an outcry.


Why is it not a good look for our community?? They didn't do anything wrong, they did not abuse policy.
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amother




Bronze
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 10:29 am
amother [ Quince ] wrote:
Why is it not a good look for our community?? They didn't do anything wrong, they did not abuse policy.

Yes, they did. I'm not going to dig up the articles but it was not a good look.
Back in the day I remember learning in halacha class that there is a problem going into a store and trying on stuff you know you are not going to end up buying because you make the owner think they are going to make a sale. The rav who taught this was very clear, it is a form of gneivas daas. These were shoppers who knew they were only going to keep a fraction of the huge orders they were placing. They didn't need to order 10 different outfits for each child in the family, knowing they were only going to keep 1 per kid, and wait to return the rest after YT when the likelihood of the store making up the loss by reselling all those returns at full price now that the holiday shopping season was over was nil.
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amother




Begonia
 

Post Fri, Nov 26 2021, 11:36 am
amother [ Bronze ] wrote:
Yes, they did. I'm not going to dig up the articles but it was not a good look.
Back in the day I remember learning in halacha class that there is a problem going into a store and trying on stuff you know you are not going to end up buying because you make the owner think they are going to make a sale. The rav who taught this was very clear, it is a form of gneivas daas. These were shoppers who knew they were only going to keep a fraction of the huge orders they were placing. They didn't need to order 10 different outfits for each child in the family, knowing they were only going to keep 1 per kid, and wait to return the rest after YT when the likelihood of the store making up the loss by reselling all those returns at full price now that the holiday shopping season was over was nil.

Then they should go after those buyers, going after certain zip codes is discrimination. Just like COVID red zones.
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