Home

Counterfeit goods and halacha
1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forum -> Shopping


View latest: 24h 48h 72h


Puppies




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:15 pm
I'm curious about how so many people are ok with buying items that are clearly counterfeit when it is against halacha to do so. Buying knockoffs, or copied items, that aren't exactly the same, or without a brand name on it is fine, but placing a brand name on an item that is not, is genaivas daas and transgresses the avaira of onaah - trickery in business.

I was so surprised to see in the Ali shopping thread, so many people asking specifically for brand name imitations. And then tips given about how to have false labels added!

The frum community, especially the 'intown' crowd who is concerned with brand names, is so particular in areas of kashrus, tznius, nidda/mikva. Why do I not see the same concern in areas of yashrus in business? With situations that are straight halacha, not chumra or minhag?
Back to top

LovesHashem




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:20 pm
Denial and lack of knowledge that this is an issue.
Back to top

ShishKabob




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:21 pm
I don't think there's enough awareness about it. Some people may think it's not problematic because 'everyone' does it.
Back to top

Fox




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:41 pm
I can only speak to handbags, but I agree that ignorance is at the root. Ignorance of halacha among frum Jews. Just plain ignorance among non-observant Jews and non-Jews.

If halachic prohibitions aren't enough, counterfeit designer goods are one of the major sources of income for terrorist groups around the world, including many that force children to join their ranks as soldiers.

And if even *that* doesn't slow your roll, chances are good that you'll eventually run into a true aficionado/a who will spot the counterfeit right off the bat. Embarrassing!
Back to top

amother




Peru
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 12:44 pm
Fox wrote:
I can only speak to handbags, but I agree that ignorance is at the root. Ignorance of halacha among frum Jews. Just plain ignorance among non-observant Jews and non-Jews.

If halachic prohibitions aren't enough, counterfeit designer goods are one of the major sources of income for terrorist groups around the world, including many that force children to join their ranks as soldiers.

And if even *that* doesn't slow your roll, chances are good that you'll eventually run into a true aficionado/a who will spot the counterfeit right off the bat. Embarrassing!

When you speak to them what do they answer? Laugh
Back to top

Puppies




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 1:00 pm
Fox wrote:


If halachic prohibitions aren't enough, counterfeit designer goods are one of the major sources of income for terrorist groups around the world, including many that force children to join their ranks as soldiers.


Absolutely! These items are produced in countries with no worker protections, so children and adults are forced to work in horrible conditions. Additionally, there is no consumer protection either, so we have no idea what types of dangerous chemicals and ingredients are in the item. For example, toys from china can have crazy high levels of lead and other toxins.

But I am not looking at this issue from an ethical or safety perspective, which can apply to any Chinese or third world product, but strictly from the Halachic standpoint on counterfeit items.
Back to top

amother




Mintgreen
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 1:26 pm
I think it’s stealing.

I don’t think most ppl realize.

How would they feel if they built a brand, designed products. And others started selling exact replicas including their brand label at 5% the price.

The need to wear a fake to look like you can afford it is sad.
Back to top

amother




Calendula
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 1:39 pm
That whole thread is sad.

I thought it was about good deals, not a opportunity for so many to do an aveira for the sake of looking AS IF you have money.

I feel like shaking that thread over the head and saying come on ladies were better than that. Much better than that.
Back to top

LovesHashem




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 1:49 pm
Zara and H&M and many other brands use child slavery. I'm sure terrorists get money through them too.
Back to top

amother




Orange
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 6:43 pm
Puppies wrote:
I'm curious about how so many people are ok with buying items that are clearly counterfeit when it is against halacha to do so. Buying knockoffs, or copied items, that aren't exactly the same, or without a brand name on it is fine, but placing a brand name on an item that is not, is genaivas daas and transgresses the avaira of onaah - trickery in business.



It's also illegal as heck. The state Department of Labor has a whole unit devoted to battling this scourge. Not only do the makers of these "knockoffs" rip off the original designers and manufacturers but often these illegal goods are made in sweatshops where the workers are not much better off than slaves.
Back to top

zaq




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 6:47 pm
From Wikipedia:

According to Forbes, in 2018 counterfeiting was the largest criminal enterprise in the world.[16] Sales of counterfeit and pirated goods totals $1.7 trillion per year, which is more than drugs and human trafficking. It is expected to grow to $2.8 trillion and cost 5.4 million jobs by 2022.[16] According to The Counterfeit Report, "China produces 80% of the world's counterfeits and we're supporting China. Whether or not it's their intention to completely undermine and destroy the U.S. economy, we [in the United States] buy about 60% to 80% of the products."
Back to top

MrsDash




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 7:13 pm
Fox wrote:
I can only speak to handbags, but I agree that ignorance is at the root. Ignorance of halacha among frum Jews. Just plain ignorance among non-observant Jews and non-Jews.

If halachic prohibitions aren't enough, counterfeit designer goods are one of the major sources of income for terrorist groups around the world, including many that force children to join their ranks as soldiers.

And if even *that* doesn't slow your roll, chances are good that you'll eventually run into a true aficionado/a who will spot the counterfeit right off the bat. Embarrassing!


I'm no fashionista, but I see a lot of those knockoff bags, and the fakeness of the bag is blaring. I have come to the conclusion that a vast majority of the men and women in some areas, communities, neighborhoods, etc. own the counterfeit product, so no one knows a difference. Whistling
Back to top

chocolate moose




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 7:36 pm
I wore denim a lot years ago and wanted a small brown purse which I thought would look nice with it. I bought somelthing on the street near lord and taylor and brought it home. dd said it was a knock off louie vitton. well, I was just happy it was small, brown and cheap. was that wrong?
Back to top

Fox




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 7:37 pm
amother [ Peru ] wrote:
When you speak to them what do they answer? Laugh

Sometimes they tell me they love me and want to come live with me forever. In a few cases, they got here and decided they wanted to live with one of my daughters. Handbags are fickle like that.
Back to top

amother




Ginger
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 7:43 pm
Fox wrote:
Sometimes they tell me they love me and want to come live with me forever. In a few cases, they got here and decided they wanted to live with one of my daughters. Handbags are fickle like that.

If I visit will you ask them if they want to come live with me?
Back to top

amother




Molasses
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 7:59 pm
I've been wondering about that too. Part of me just assumes that if so many people are asking for it then it must be okay
Back to top

amother




Glitter
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 8:04 pm
is there a source in halacha that this is assur?
I can understand if its a counterfeit on a Jewish owned business or product, but hilchas mumin is different in the outside world

I genuinely want to know.
Back to top

amother




Wine
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 8:07 pm
Pretty much everything on ali is a knockoff not just the designer stuff. It's all stolen designs many from small mom and pop shops.
Back to top

creditcards




 
 
 
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 8:08 pm
I'm was never into brand names. When people post a knockoff I would order it because it looks nice. Not because I was looking for the brand name. The fact that everyone is talking that it's a knockoff got me to look at it and decide that I like it enough to buy it. I would never dream of buying the brand name, so I don't feel like the original company lost out any money because if me.
Back to top

amother




Cerulean
 

Post Thu, Nov 25 2021, 8:38 pm
amother [ Orange ] wrote:
It's also illegal as heck. The state Department of Labor has a whole unit devoted to battling this scourge. Not only do the makers of these "knockoffs" rip off the original designers and manufacturers but often these illegal goods are made in sweatshops where the workers are not much better off than slaves.

The state department of labor is really not doing much about it. Knockoffs can easily be purchased online, in the street, and even in stores.
The designer brand names use the same slave laborers.
I think the knockoffs always look fake, so I'm not sure it's really stealing.
If you can find a cheaper way to make a product, why should I pay the higher price?

Signed,
Owner of lots of CZ Jewelry


Last edited by amother on Fri, Nov 26 2021, 8:10 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
1, 2  Next Recent Topics

Page 1 of 2 View latest: 24h 48h 72h


Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forum -> Shopping

Related Topics Replies Last Post
Party goods store
by amother
1 Today at 10:27 am View last post
Ashley Home Goods Furniture?
by hodeez
6 Thu, Nov 18 2021, 2:36 pm View last post
Shabbos paper goods in a box
by penguin
3 Wed, Sep 08 2021, 10:54 pm View last post
Halacha in yerusha
by amother
11 Wed, Aug 25 2021, 10:31 pm View last post
Anyone know if the baked goods from Cafoteria are dairy? 0 Tue, Aug 17 2021, 9:49 pm View last post