Cholov yisroel, yoshon, checked lettuce

amother

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 3:10 pm

I’m really really trying to slowly transition to cholov yisroel and yoshon. But honestly, I just left the grocery and it’s SO HARD. Why is cheese $2-$3 more PER PACKAGE? And butter? I can’t bring myself to spend $10 on butter when the equivalent is like $3 non-cholov-yisroel.

Milk is so painful. Checked lettuce is $7-$10 a bag and they rot so quickly. I try to check lettuce myself but the cRc has me so paranoid and I don’t own a light box or whatever so I buy the lettuce already checked because I’m so scared I’ll burn in hell about a bug I missed.

I really want to do the right thing here and I remind myself that Hashem gives us whatever money we need and He will help me afford these extra chumras. (Chumras?) but it feels so extravagant at a time when my entire grocery bill is already insane.

Anyone offer chizuk? Ideas? Validation?

amother

Royalblue

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 3:21 pm

I don't know who you are nor your background. But the first question you must ask is what is compelling you to make such a change ? The second thing I would suggest is to take one chumra SLOWLY at a time. I would suggest start off with the lettuce first because it's doraissa and there are no shitos that hold bugs are ok. Remember also the same hashem who wants you to keep kashrus wants you to be happy, and by taking a step too big (chumros) you are not being happy. I don't know your specific situation though so I can't determine whats exactly best for you.

(BTW we personally always check for bugs , most of the time avoid chalav stam and are not makpid with yoshon)

amother

Royalblue

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 3:32 pm

amother [ Navy ] wrote:

If you want iceberg lettuce with a hechsher, Aldi has for .95 a bag. Romaine is too pricey because I only use actually checked lettuce if romaine, so I just don’t use that variety.

Is this every week ? Or just this weeks sale ?

amother

Offwhite

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 3:35 pm

I think maybe you should talk to a Rav for some guidance because it sounds like it's causing unnecessary anxiety.

I'm certainly not an authority but I check my own veg and I know we don't know anything for sure, but I believe Hashem loves us and I kind of think that it's the effort that counts. Obviously I don't know, but the burning in hell for an accidentally missed bug doesn't sound like a Jewish thing to me.

amother

Pumpkin

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 3:37 pm

Checked lettuce/broccoli/etc is a must. Most mainstream litvish would consider cholov yisroel and yoshon to be chumros. (Yes widely followed, but less important than checking for bugs in your produce. You have to start somewhere, not take it all on at once. If I were in your shoes, I would focus on the produce and not worry about the others until you are ready to take them on.)

We do keep CY, but our rav holds that for butter, it is not necessary, because it is impossible to make butter out of treif milk.

I know I'm not fully answering your quandary, but hope this helps.

amother

Nasturtium

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 3:46 pm

Do you have a big freezer? I live out of town and sometimes go to a bigger community and buy up milk, cheese, cream cheese, buter for much cheaper. I freeze. You can do this if you live in town and buy on sale. For yoshon, I go to a big box store before yoshon season and buy in bulk, store, and/or freeze. You can still probably buy non-Jewish brand flours (hecker's and I just bought gold medal). I try to avoid lettuce and buggy veggies. I did invest in a bug light and check if I need lettuce.

shyner

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 3:56 pm

Many Rabbanim today say that Cholov Yisroel is not a chumra (Some have changed their minds in the last few years since many cows were discovered to be treif due to injuries and many rabonim who previously allowed chalav stam do not today)
But its still more important to check your lettuce since eating bugs is min hatorah and chalav yisorel is originally derabonon ( Whether you keep it today or not it was always derabonon)
Yoshon is a chumra so should be the last one on your list.

Hashem_Yaazor

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 4:08 pm

I agree start slowly and get guidance along the easy. It's very hard to start yoshon mid season without stocking up on non Jewish brands in advance... And we hold yoshon is halacha not chumra to give clarity on my perspective.

I do a lot of iceberg lettuce, and check my own romaine and baby spinach when I can. Other times I splurge on checked romaine but it's not an every day staple in my house. When you're comfortable with that, get guidance what your next step should be.

If you do get CY as your answer, should it be all at once or also do that gradually? As a previous poster mentioned, there are differences of opinion on butter and also on powdered milk ingredients. Find out what you should be stringent on.

Yoshon is a wonderful mitzvah but I think if you haven't been guided to keep it yet, wait till next summer at the earliest so you can prepare in advance.

amother

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 4:15 pm

Hashem_Yaazor wrote:

So every year before yoshon I look up the laws and it’s SO CONFUSING. Really confusing. What I try to do it buy yoshon flour (not that much more expensive than regular these days), and yoshon barley. I can’t read the tiny print - is geffen barley yoshon? I buy the one for $3 which giant letters that say yoshon. We don’t use so much barley so it’s fine.

We definitely can’t be totally cholov yisroel because we love flavored coffee creamer and there’s nothing cholov yisroel. Right now just trying to get milk and cheese that’s cholov yisroel. I also use heavy cream quite a bit but it’s $15!!!! For a teeny amount! In the stores the cream is $3!!!

Hashem_Yaazor

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 4:47 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Yoshon.com is your friend! There are resources on how to start and quick cheat sheets as well as a huge search engine to find products. This year is harder than ever for flour because there used to be regular brands you could buy buy not this year due to the crop...

Also not sure where you live but I buy shredded mozzarella in bulk at Costco and it's cheaper than even cholov stam in regular store (still has to be kosher!)

There are some almond based creamers that people use to avoid needing CY, but again I suggest getting guidance for a proper timeline...

amother

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 4:52 pm

amother [ Royalblue ] wrote:

OP for lettuce are you willing to check it yourself with a light box or is it too much of a hassle ? It saves you a lot of money on the long run.

1) I have no kitchen space
2) I don’t trust myself in general. It seems easier to rely on the person who checked the lettuce. I don’t really think it’s a huge deal to eat a speck that to the naked eye doesn’t look like a bug, so I’m trying to rely on a hechsher that has their own rabbinic guidance.
3) also, I like kale. All these Instagram posters always use that curly kale and fresh broccoli and I wish sometimes I can just be like them

amother

Bluebell

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 5:33 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I used to think like this too until a few friends in the food industry told me how checking is done commercially vs. at home. I know feel perfectly good with my own checking. Oh, and I don't have a light box. Just decent kitchen lighting a good pair of eyes.

observer

Sun, Jan 02 2022, 6:10 pm

I agree that you should be taking things on one at a time. It's way too daunting to take on 3 things at once, and when people do too much at the same time, they often end up not doing them properly.

Do you have a rov you can consult with? Find out which one you should start with. Probably the checked lettuce, broccoli, etc., as bugs are a real issue with no heter.

How do we handle the price?
The same way we handle the higher price of all kosher food. It should be in your mind like there is no other option. There are many expenses in being a frum Jew. It says in shema "Ve'ahavta es Hashem Elokecha bechol levavecha uvechol nafshecha uvechol meodecha". Uvechol Meodacha means with all your money. Using your money to serve Hashem better is huge!!
Personally, we check lettuce and cabbage when we can, to reduce the cost. Or you can pay a friend to check it, it will probably still come out cheaper. Extra perk, it's so much fresher than the bagged stuff!

Last edited by observer on Sat, Jan 08 2022, 9:21 pm; edited 1 time in total