Not inviting kids - how to make it clear

amother

Zinnia

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 3:08 pm

amother [ Hyssop ] wrote:

I don't understand this. Is it only her child that's being excluded - or are all children being excluded from the event?

If it's the former, I agree it hurts. If it's the latter, then your comment makes no sense. Every person is entitled to make their simcha as they see fit, regardless of what is considered to be a standard in a community.

Not inviting all children just means extending the insult to all children. Children are people.

It's even worse if it's to make the event "classy." Imagine if you were told that you were not invited because the hosts wanted a "classy" event.

watergirl

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 3:10 pm

amother [ Zinnia ] wrote:

The person making a simcha is not obligated to provide babysitting, but the person invited isn't obligated to attend either. If you know someone has children, you can't require them to come without their children.

This sounds aggressive, maybe I am reading it in the wrong tone. I can't obligate any guest to come to my simcha. Anyone can skip it if they want to. All I can do is tell people that the invitation is for themselves only. I hope people get it, and for those who don't (I am sure that one couple I mentioned will bring at least one kid), it is what it is.

dankbar

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 3:16 pm

Obviously you are not in a family that has at least 30-40 grandchildren at each side, if you say kids must be invited. What are you supposed to do with 80 children running around the hall & pay for 80 extra portions. The adults and couples might only be like 25-30 couples if it's a small affair.

People have to put limits & they can decide where not the guests.

Simple1

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 3:55 pm

wifenmother wrote:

Yes, inviting your twin nephews is 'different'. Since you're the baal simcha you get to decide who you make exceptions for.

At a recent bar mitzva I made, my sil was literally offended when I told her that her 10 year old son is not invited even though he was 'really looking forward'. It's her issue, not mine...

I never heard of not inviting the boy's cousins to his bar mitzvah, especially 10 year olds who are not toddlers and are appropriate age to attend a bar mitzvah.

the world's best mom

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 4:04 pm

We recently attended a nephew's bar mitzvah and only 2 of my children were invited. My 2 boys, ages 9 and 13. If they would have invited all their nieces and nephews, between the 2 sides, there would have been over 100 kids KA"H. Nobody was insulted.

You are totally entitled to invite someone to a simcha without kids.

If someone invites us to a simcha out of my neighborhood for Shabbos and they don't allow kids, then I don't come. I'm not leaving my baby/toddler for shabbos in order to attend a simcha.

watergirl

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 4:10 pm

the world's best mom wrote:

Thanks. I am not inviting anyone from out of town with their children. Not because I don’t want to, but because when I say I have a small family, I mean it! Other than the two nephews I mentioned before. I have other nieces in a few but they live out of the country and they cannot come in sadly.

amother

Tuberose

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 5:52 pm

amother [ Hyssop ] wrote:

I have neighbors and friends who think like you, and I find that very frustrating. Strollers in the hall, scattered around the tables, mess up the decor and setup. You go and spend money to create a nice affair, with an elegant ambiance and then you have some guests who have no concerns upending it with their own preferences.

Imo, strollers have no place in the hall. It's not a restaurant, it's not a casual party, it's a serious sit down affair. If I've respectfully asked someone not to bring the baby, I will respectfully ask them to keep the stroller outside.

You're more than entitled to your own opinions around this - at your own affair. You're not entitled to impose your opinion on someone else's affair.

I actually think differently, and I’m also very into the ambiance and decor.
In fact, it makes me happy that young babies aren’t left yet again by their mothers. Especially these days, where we have so many obligations and babies are often left with sitters.
If a mom is happy to have her baby with her, I encourage that. I prefer that the adult like, beautiful ambiance I work hard to create is slightly upended if it means my friends are doing what is best for their child. A parents first and primary obligation is to their child, and I will always encourage that.
Yes agreed, that if you respectfully ask that the baby not be brought it is disrespectful to. However I do believe that may not be an appropriate thing to ask of the parent of a young child, unless worded in a way which reflects the value of a parent’s presence to their baby.

amother

Molasses

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 6:26 pm

amother [ Tuberose ] wrote:

I very much agree. Whenever possible, young children should be allowed to be with their parents instead of a babysitter. In this case, though, sounds like it's not feasible for the OP.

ally

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 6:36 pm

amother [ Hyssop ] wrote:

I'm going to guess you don't nurse. When I have a nursing baby, the baby is attached to me and if you want me to come to the wedding, the baby will be coming too. I don't otherwise bring my children to events unless it's close relatives.

amother

Hyssop

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 6:54 pm

ally wrote:

I had nursing babies too. Many other people nurse too, and they seem to figure out how to attend simchas without their babies.

amother

Tuberose

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 7:43 pm

amother [ Molasses ] wrote:

I very much agree. Whenever possible, young children should be allowed to be with their parents instead of a babysitter. In this case, though, sounds like it's not feasible for the OP.

Agreed! I wasn’t talking about OP at all, just the way of thinking in general. OP seems very well meaning

amother

Tuberose

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 7:45 pm

amother [ Hyssop ] wrote:

I had nursing babies too. Many other people nurse too, and they seem to figure out how to attend simchas without their babies.

Not if the baby doesn’t take a bottle. Or if the simcha isn’t very close. And when they do figure it out, sometimes, the mother is rushing home to a baby who’s been screaming for a half hour from hunger bc mom couldn’t bring that baby along…

amother

Snapdragon

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 7:46 pm

ally wrote:

Just about everyone I know nurses and they dont bring their babies along.
If its a close wedding and they'll be there all night they get a sitter at the hall that stays in a side room so they can nurse when necessary.

amother

Royalblue

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 7:54 pm

watergirl wrote:

I am about to send out invitations for a small simcha BH. I have a few very close friends (my husband and I are friends with the couple) and there are a number of kids between all of them. It's not a lot, just about 6-8, but even that number of kids is more than I can pay, and also some of the kids are very wild. Most people would read their names on an invitation and if it does not say "and family", they know it's just for the adults. Not these friends. My best friend just made a wedding and had the same thing with these couples, she told them it was adults only, and they brought their kids anyway and they sat everyone down to eat. My best friend's kids are the same age as my son or older, so they are invited. I also have a very close relationship with her kids... The other kids are all between 5-10 and I have no real relationship with them, one of the families kids don't even know my name, much less my son's name, which is weird considering we've hosted them often.

So I need to be clear with them, but as nice as possible... how do I make it clear? I am sending the invitations via evite.

You will have to be specific, as uncomfortable as it might be, and say it on the evite. “Unfortunately we will not be able to accommodate children at our simcha. we thank you for your understanding in advance, and look forward to seeing you both at our simcha.”

amother

Lawngreen

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 7:57 pm

amother [ Zinnia ] wrote:

Lol, well, even my most gorgeous amazing children are not what I’d call “classy” when they’re old enough to be mobile but not old enough to sit calmly through speeches.
My beautiful princess 3 year old, I would use many words to describe that are very positive but classy right now wouldn’t be the first.

amother

Lawngreen

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 8:04 pm

I think we can all agree there’s a difference between a 5 week old baby that nurses and a 3 year old.

Even an 18 month old that nurses … or a 9 month old for that matter… should be asleep in the evening and I don’t think it’s beneficial for them in any way to take them to a bar mitzvah where they would be expected to sit calmly and quietly for hours.

amother

Wheat

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 8:22 pm

amother [ Lawngreen ] wrote:

A 5 week old doesn't really belong at an affair anyway, what with loud booming music, etc. Nobody will be insulted if a post partum mom stays home with a tiny infant, in any case. If it's a close relative, the norm is to hire a babysitter to watch baby in a nearby room.
It's also OK to stay for a short time if you need to get back to young children at home.

BrachaBatya

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 9:02 pm

This thread reminds me - my mother still, after many years, mentions various parents who showed up at our s'machot with uninvited children. One was over 25 years ago and she never forgot how she felt it was incredibly rude and chutzpadik, and the other time was about 4 years ago -that really presses my mother's buttons!

watergirl

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 9:23 pm

amother [ Royalblue ] wrote:

Ooohhhh I like this wording too!

chanchy123

Thu, Apr 28 2022, 9:37 pm

watergirl wrote:

Totally, which is why I am comfortable saying something like, we are inviting only kids over bar mitzvah, I just don't know how to say that.

I have a relative who did that for all her children’s bar/bar mitzvahs.
They explicitly wrote that only guests advice bar/bat mitzvah are invited and clarified in a phone call that the event is only appropriate for older kids.