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The imperfect chessed thread. The other side off the story
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amother




OP
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:27 am
I was very disheartened by the coming downstairs thread yesterday.
I am a totally normal person and that could have totally happened to me. Yes, even the comment part. And of course I would have realized 20 minutes later once I picked up/dropped of/got home/got off the meeting/Got the results from the Dr. etc..
But I was shocked at the people that were so ready to just rip apart the woman who cooked.
So this thread is about all the times that we went out of our way, did a huge chessed, but it was imperfect for whatever reason.
Maybe we can show that it does not have to be perfect for it to be great.
I'll start

Late last night somebody called to ask if I could watch their baby because the wife is in labor. (Turns out I was their plan all along) There wasn't any other answer aside from yes at that point. And I am also happy to do it- I just wished I would have been told earlier that I was the plan.
The baby stayed the night with us and at the earliest minute possible I dropped him off at his babysitter without dressing him or changing his diaper.
I was in such a rush to get to work and had not factored in the extra time in the morning or the extra stop on my carpool route.
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amother




Blush
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:34 am
How could you!!!
😂😂😂
Seriously, Tizku l’mitzvot. That was so nice of you to take the baby for the night. That could not have been easy. They are lucky to have you in their life.
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amother




Yarrow
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:39 am
I see this original thread already has spin-offs a few just have been bad didn’t read it see it. But people who don’t see peoples kindness are usually brats.
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Rubies




 
 
 
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:41 am
We're all human and make mistakes. Yet, the ideal should be to do a chessed fully.

I'm having a hard time understanding how the car and food incident is different than showing up to visit a sick person, in a way that makes them uncomfortable. Or to host people in your home, but the kids are inappropriately using their bedroom, or to be a kallah teacher but omit necessary information.

Sometimes the end does not justify the means.
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amother




Valerian
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:48 am
I see it more as of course the person receiving the chessed should say thank you. But we as the chessed giver should strive to do it in a way that the receiver is actually benefiting.

In this case of the baby the one needing the chessed didn’t lose out by you not dressing the baby. So I don’t think it’s the same. There are many people post birth that cannot walk or get to the door in that case sometimes eating a box of crackers is easier for them.

It’s like we always learned about bikur cholim don’t go in a way that causes them issues. And don’t have the attitude of well be glad I at least showed up you don’t get to have preferences and needs.

So yeah sometimes things go wrong. But to have the attitude of be glad I did it, who cares if it caused you pain is not in line with the Torah. And yes we can all use improvement no need for people to have gotten so offended.
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amother




Yarrow
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:54 am
amother [ Valerian ] wrote:
I see it more as of course the person receiving the chessed should say thank you. But we as the chessed giver should strive to do it in a way that the receiver is actually benefiting.

In this case of the baby the one needing the chessed didn’t lose out by you not dressing the baby. So I don’t think it’s the same. There are many people post birth that cannot walk or get to the door in that case sometimes eating a box of crackers is easier for them.

It’s like we always learned about bikur cholim don’t go in a way that causes them issues. And don’t have the attitude of well be glad I at least showed up you don’t get to have preferences and needs.

So yeah sometimes things go wrong. But to have the attitude of be glad I did it, who cares if it caused you pain is not in line with the Torah. And yes we can all use improvement no need for people to have gotten so offended.


I do think there’s communication also involved when I send supper for someone I don’t drive I send it with a taxi . I pay extra for the person to go to the door but they will drop by door and leave I call the person before I communicate what time is best and can someone get it from the door. Usually people can go get stuff from somewhere otherwise communicate it. I had 7 babies I had a c section most of the time . You can get the food or ask the person can it wait till my husband can come get it. People after having a baby are 95% not invalids like Imamther makes it sound.
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amother




Maroon
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:55 am
.
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amother




Yarrow
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:57 am
Truthfully I used to send people much more suppers I had to be in the kitchen hours for even a basic meal. I stopped I realized no one appreciates it now I send cake and a kugel for Shabbos for them to enjoy. One sil I ordered pizza and sushi I spent $65 was almost as much as me slaving away.
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amother




Lightcoral
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:58 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
(Turns out I was their plan all along) There wasn't any other answer aside from yes at that point. And I am also happy to do it- I just wished I would have been told earlier that I was the plan.


I know this isn't the intent of your thread but seriously what is up with people. I once was informed by someone that I was the plan (for 5 kids!) and she went into labor on a Friday and couldn't reach me and had to dig up some relatives (I'm not a relative in this particular case) to take the place she had designated for me (without discussing it with me). As it is, Hashem was good to me because I was totally not up to taking care of 5 kids for Shabbos right then, so Hashem made me be out and my cell was dead.
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amother




Valerian
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 5:59 am
amother [ Yarrow ] wrote:
I do think there’s communication also involved when I send supper for someone I don’t drive I send it with a taxi . I pay extra for the person to go to the door but they will drop by door and leave I call the person before I communicate what time is best and can someone get it from the door. Usually people can go get stuff from somewhere otherwise communicate it. I had 7 babies I had a c section most of the time . You can get the food or ask the person can it wait till my husband can come get it. People after having a baby are 95% not invalids like Imamther makes it sound.


I know from my own experience and from my friends that I could not shlep things or get to the door. I canceled meals halfway because it was just too much to deal with it. There are plenty of people that cannot do things post birth and they matter and need the help most. Just because many can go shopping a week later doesn’t mean everyone can. And it’s not 95% the amount of people needing help is much higher. And it’s ok for people to learn they exist and keep it in mind. And sometimes people are too embarrassed or need to keep it quiet so are unable to share.
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watergirl




 
 
 
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:06 am
amother [ Yarrow ] wrote:
Truthfully I used to send people much more suppers I had to be in the kitchen hours for even a basic meal. I stopped I realized no one appreciates it now I send cake and a kugel for Shabbos for them to enjoy. One sil I ordered pizza and sushi I spent $65 was almost as much as me slaving away.

Ok is this hyperbole? Hours and slaving away? I wonder what I'm doing wrong because when I make a weeknight meal for a new mom, it takes about 15 minutes tops.

Cut up an onion, throw on the bottom of the pan - 1 minute.
Open package of chicken legs, put on top on chicken - 1 minute.
Top with spices - 2 minutes maybe.
Cover with foil and put in the oven - 30 seconds.

Cut up potatos, season and a bit of oil, throw on cookie sheet - 5 minutes.

It cooks while I do other things. Maybe I'll also send a salad, which takes:
open bag of salad, throw in a tin - 20 seconds.
cut cucumbers and tomatos, throw in tin - 2 minutes.

Cover and drive over depends but no more than 15 minutes.

There is no reason to make more, no reason to send more. If I do dairy, it's baked ziti and roasted vegetables which takes the same amount of time. If I send pareve, it's falafel which takes even less time.
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amother




Yarrow
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:06 am
amother [ Valerian ] wrote:
I know from my own experience and from my friends that I could not shlep things or get to the door. I canceled meals halfway because it was just too much to deal with it. There are plenty of people that cannot do things post birth and they matter and need the help most. Just because many can go shopping a week later doesn’t mean everyone can. And it’s not 95% the amount of people needing help is much higher. And it’s ok for people to learn they exist and keep it in mind. And sometimes people are too embarrassed or need to keep it quiet so are unable to share.


Ever thought of telling them to send the food when hubs is home or when your a week past birth. And sorry yes take some Motrin, take a shower sit on your couch like a mentch you feel better automatically, stitches hurt yes and usually going to the door ain’t so physically bad, I’m tired I would take a meal 4 weeks after birth when I’m seen acting normal.
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amother




OP
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:07 am
amother [ Lightcoral ] wrote:
I know this isn't the intent of your thread but seriously what is up with people. I once was informed by someone that I was the plan (for 5 kids!) and she went into labor on a Friday and couldn't reach me and had to dig up some relatives (I'm not a relative in this particular case) to take the place she had designated for me (without discussing it with me). As it is, Hashem was good to me because I was totally not up to taking care of 5 kids for Shabbos right then, so Hashem made me be out and my cell was dead.


It really wasn't lol Smile
I have resigned myself long ago to who this person is.
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amother




Yarrow
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:09 am
watergirl wrote:
Ok is this hyperbole? Hours and slaving away? I wonder what I'm doing wrong because when I make a weeknight meal for a new mom, it takes about 15 minutes tops.

Cut up an onion, throw on the bottom of the pan - 1 minute.
Open package of chicken legs, put on top on chicken - 1 minute.
Top with spices - 2 minutes maybe.
Cover with foil and put in the oven - 30 seconds.

Cut up potatos, season and a bit of oil, throw on cookie sheet - 5 minutes.

It cooks while I do other things. Maybe I'll also send a salad, which takes:
open bag of salad, throw in a tin - 20 seconds.
cut cucumbers and tomatos, throw in tin - 2 minutes.

Cover and drive over depends but no more than 15 minutes.

There is no reason to make more, no reason to send more. If I do dairy, it's baked ziti and roasted vegetables which takes the same amount of time. If I send pareve, it's falafel which takes even less time.


I never send chicken bottoms cause I feel the mom can do that herself.

Soup- grating veggies etc
Chicken cutlet coating and frying
Cubed potatoes in the oven
Stir fry with added veggies
Dessert some sort of compote or I bake something

I always send more to be safe. And I try and send by 5ish if there are little kids so need to start at 2
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amother




Valerian
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:12 am
amother [ Yarrow ] wrote:
Ever thought of telling them to send the food when hubs is home or when your a week past birth. And sorry yes take some Motrin, take a shower sit on your couch like a mentch you feel better automatically, stitches hurt yes and usually going to the door ain’t so physically bad, I’m tired I would take a meal 4 weeks after birth when I’m seen acting normal.


Yeah I asked for specific times was told no so I said forget it, it’s not working. Like I said just because you don’t have a bad experience post birth doesn’t mean many other don’t. What’s up with the attitude of just take Motrin blah blah. This is the issue people not willing to think past their own experience and understand others experience things differently.
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watergirl




 
 
 
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:14 am
amother [ Yarrow ] wrote:
I never send chicken bottoms cause I feel the mom can do that herself.

Soup- grating veggies etc
Chicken cutlet coating and frying
Cubed potatoes in the oven
Stir fry with added veggies
Dessert some sort of compote or I bake something

I always send more to be safe. And I try and send by 5ish if there are little kids so need to start at 2

With all due respect, this is all on you that it takes you hours to do this. You should not be making meals that involve so much active prep time, since it means you either spend hours or spend a ton of money. Standing to coat and fry chicken, grate vegetables, make soup, stir fry more vegetables and bake dessert is not at all what anyone would call basic. You said:
amother [ Yarrow ] wrote:
Truthfully I used to send people much more suppers I had to be in the kitchen hours for even a basic meal.

What you wrote is not basic, it's patchke. What I wrote (baked chicken with simple spices and roasted potatos) is basic, wholesome, healthy, and delicious. If you would make things that can just be thrown in a pan in the oven, and if you must send soup, keep frozen soup at the ready to just heat up and send hot, you would no longer be spending hours in the kitchen.

Yes, the mom can do chicken (dark or white meat) in the oven by herself. No, she does not have to if someone else will for her. And we know from this site, many women feel they are not up to the 8 minutes it takes to do the basic I do for them when they are right after birth.

ETA - my point, I actually have a few points, is that you said you stopped making these hours long prep meals because you realized (or assumed) no one appreciated it. Truthfully, no, no one appreciates you slaving away for them for hours. It is TRULY not necessary. The point is to provide a hot nourishing meal for a new mom who can't or should not have to do it on her own for a week or two. No one can eat these massive meals every night. Kids are used to their mothers cooking and honestly, it's best in my opinion to send simple and easy for that reason. There is TRULY no reason to make all of that, spend all of that time and money, to send that kind of a meal. Maybe if you are making an entire shabbos dinner... but for a weeknight? No.

Eta again - if someone feels they do need even more, they should be calling the local take out and place an order to round out the meal as they want it to be.


Last edited by watergirl on Wed, May 18 2022, 6:23 am; edited 2 times in total
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amother




Buttercup
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:21 am
Honestly, I wouldn’t appreciate being sent a supper of just baked chicken legs and potatoes.
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amother




OP
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:24 am
amother [ Buttercup ] wrote:
Honestly, I wouldn’t appreciate being sent a supper of just baked chicken legs and potatoes.

I really appreciate your honest answer. case in point.
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Chayalle




 
 
 
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:26 am
I do try to send a filling supper to a new Mom, but it doesn't take me hours. Maybe 1/2 hour to 45 minutes? I can put up a vegetable barley soup (I like to send soup, I find new mothers like soup, and it can serve as lunch the next day too if there are leftovers) pretty quickly using my chopper. I usually send a bunch of broiled chicken which is super easy (bunch of thin-sliced white chicken meat, toss with oil, salt, pepper, and garlic powder, lay out on baking sheet and broil in oven a few minutes per side till just done), and then a starch (potatoes, or rice, or pasta-based like orzo or cous cous). Cut up fruit (like watermelon in the summer) if I can.

As a younger mother, I honestly found the delivery to be the most difficult (load kids in car when they just came home from school to shlep supper out) and it's so much easier now that they are grown. I still find supper delivery to be at the most trafficky time of day, and if it's not in my neighborhood I have to think twice if I can do it.
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watergirl




 
 
 
 

Post Wed, May 18 2022, 6:29 am
amother [ Buttercup ] wrote:
Honestly, I wouldn’t appreciate being sent a supper of just baked chicken legs and potatoes.

I just wrote this in a previous post but we cross posted.

I know this is blunt and honest. But if you feel you need more than chicken and potatos, or chicken and rice and a veg, order the rest from a take out counter. People do not need to send a full catered meal, and no, no one needs a meal with soup, sides, main, and dessert every night of the week. It's asking a LOT to expect everyone send this to you.

And this is why people write here that after reading this kind of comment, they don't want to make mealtrain meals anymore.
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