The imperfect chessed thread. The other side off the story

Ema of 5

Wed, May 18 2022, 11:18 am

yiddishmom wrote:

Oh my!

What's with all the "what if she can't come down because of this, that, and who knows what".

Of course some women won't be able to walk down the stairs shoetly after giving birth, but many women can!

Therefore, I think it's totally OK for the mom who made the food to call and ask if the PP mom can come down because it's tough to find parking.

PP could say, "I really appreciate your help. I can't make it down right now."

And then together they can brainstorm another plan.

1) Chessed mom can give it an extra few minutes to try to find parking.

2) perhaps a neighbor can come down to get it?

3) Perhaps chesed mom can double park and drop off the food box in the main entrance and then the husband can bring it up when he comes home a little later.

4) if PP mom can come down, but not take up the box, maybe she can come down to be in the car while chesed mom runs up with the food.

It's definitely ok to ask PP mom if she can come down, and PP mom can communicate if not. There are so many options to make this work! Seriously.

No, this should be done before the day of, preferably by the person arranging the meals, so that the new mom isn’t put on the spot. It’s not up to her to figure out how to get the food into her house.

amother

Buttercup

Wed, May 18 2022, 11:19 am

watergirl wrote:

I just wrote this in a previous post but we cross posted.

I know this is blunt and honest. But if you feel you need more than chicken and potatos, or chicken and rice and a veg, order the rest from a take out counter. People do not need to send a full catered meal, and no, no one needs a meal with soup, sides, main, and dessert every night of the week. It's asking a LOT to expect everyone send this to you.

And this is why people write here that after reading this kind of comment, they don't want to make mealtrain meals anymore.

I don’t need a five course meal, but sending just legs and potatoes seems like you did this by force and half heartily. This will make me feel like a nebach case.

You can easily dress up the chicken and potato meal by adding either one or two of the following: blended soup (no chopping) vegetable side, salad or some cut up fruit.

I don’t sign up for meal trains, but some family and friends do send over supper without being asked. I don’t need anyone’s favor, but if you’re gonna do it, do it mentchlich. I guess this is my Hungarian balabatishe blood talking.

Heyaaa

Wed, May 18 2022, 11:24 am

Ema of 4 wrote:

If you read the thread then it seems that the new mom was aware that there is difficult parking but didn't warn in advance. Whose fault was it then? The delivery person who never tried parking on that street or the person who lives there and didn't tell?

amother

Dimgray

Wed, May 18 2022, 11:30 am

amother [ Buttercup ] wrote:

This is why I stopped participating in meal trains. Not only because of imamother but because of IRL complaints I've heard. (Not directed at me personally, I guess people have more tact than to tell one to their face that they think the food they sent was nebby, but people complaining about others' food to me. One person had the audacity to tell me she thought it wasn't right that a mutual friend sent over hot dogs and burgers from a restaurant for a large family with a bunch of older kids that just had another baby. Because if you sign up for a meal, you owe that family a homemade meal, not take out. Never mind that our friend worked full time and the complainer was a SAHM never having worked more than a part time job in her life, even prior to having kids.) But the threads I read here just reinforce my decision to stop. So I am glad these threads continue, otherwise I might start to feel guilty!! (No, I don't take meals myself.)

Ema of 5

Wed, May 18 2022, 11:39 am

Heyaaa wrote:

It’s no ones fault, but I don’t think it’s right for the new mon to be put in the spot Ike that. She should for sure make the organizer aware, so she can let everyone know, but at the end of the day one can not assume that a new mom will be able to come out to get food.

Heyaaa

Wed, May 18 2022, 11:48 am

Ema of 4 wrote:

She could've suggested somewhere in the lobby to put it for her dh to bring up if it was so difficult.

I don't know if anyone is at fault but I do know who isn't and it isn't the lady who did the shopped for, cooked, packaged, and drove over the food at a difficult enough hour that there was no parking nearby.

90% of the people were bashing the lady for doing a Chessed and for being unable to find parking.

mig100

Wed, May 18 2022, 11:58 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I was very disheartened by the coming downstairs thread yesterday.
I am a totally normal person and that could have totally happened to me. Yes, even the comment part. And of course I would have realized 20 minutes later once I picked up/dropped of/got home/got off the meeting/Got the results from the Dr. etc..
But I was shocked at the people that were so ready to just rip apart the woman who cooked.
So this thread is about all the times that we went out of our way, did a huge chessed, but it was imperfect for whatever reason.
Maybe we can show that it does not have to be perfect for it to be great.
I'll start

Late last night somebody called to ask if I could watch their baby because the wife is in labor. (Turns out I was their plan all along) There wasn't any other answer aside from yes at that point. And I am also happy to do it- I just wished I would have been told earlier that I was the plan.
The baby stayed the night with us and at the earliest minute possible I dropped him off at his babysitter without dressing him or changing his diaper.
I was in such a rush to get to work and had not factored in the extra time in the morning or the extra stop on my carpool route.

Wow. Huge chesed to take a baby unexpected for a whole night and drop off in the morning.

There is a very big difference for a chesed like u did which is last minute emergency and something thats volunteered in advance like having guests and making supper.

If I volunteer to do a chesed I would go out of my way to do it in best way to make receipient feel comfortable

For what you did main thing is baby was safe and cared for and mother could take care of herself

You cant compare this

mig100

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:01 pm

amother [ Valerian ] wrote:

I see it more as of course the person receiving the chessed should say thank you. But we as the chessed giver should strive to do it in a way that the receiver is actually benefiting.

In this case of the baby the one needing the chessed didn’t lose out by you not dressing the baby. So I don’t think it’s the same. There are many people post birth that cannot walk or get to the door in that case sometimes eating a box of crackers is easier for them.

It’s like we always learned about bikur cholim don’t go in a way that causes them issues. And don’t have the attitude of well be glad I at least showed up you don’t get to have preferences and needs.

So yeah sometimes things go wrong. But to have the attitude of be glad I did it, who cares if it caused you pain is not in line with the Torah. And yes we can all use improvement no need for people to have gotten so offended.

All very good points

keym

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:02 pm

mig100 wrote:

I agree.
If you would have offered to take the kid and then dropped her off without changing her, then I would have a problem with that.
If you offer to do a Chessed, do it in a helpful way

amother

Lightpink

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:04 pm

Just chiming in to add my story-
I didn’t have a baby in a bunch of years so this happened a while ago.
Neighbors were sending nice meals every night. Usually soup, type of chicken, starch, veggies, sometimes cut up pickles, sometimes even dessert… it was really nice of them. The day I went back to work a relative called to say she really wants to send over a meal… she said she knows what it’s like to go back to work etc. - by that point I wasn’t getting meals so I first told her it’s okay… she insisted and I thanked her. When I came home she called and asked if we can pick up the food because she couldn’t get out. I sent dh. He came back with a salad that was from a bag of shredded lettuce and some slices of tomatoes. The only other thing was cookies. I asked dh if he left anything in the car.. nope. I figured relative would realize she forgot to send me the main dish.. I didn’t hear from her. I don’t remember what I did but I had to figure out something fast. The next day I was wondering if I should call her to thank her. I did. She said it was so good that she planned to send me food because all her kids were home from school (snow) and they helped cut the tomatoes and bake the cookies… kept them busy. She never said anything about not really sending us supper! I don’t know what she was thinking! I never figured out what happened there. I’m sure she doesn’t feed her family lettuce and cookies.
That’s something I’ll always remember.
A good friend of mine doesn’t accept any meals ever. She said she doesn’t want to feel that she has to send back.
I do think it’s a good idea for people to fend for themselves. Order pizza, frozen pizza, sandwiches etc - that’s not too hard and it’s filling.
I once came home from the hospital and made a pot of spaghetti and cheese. My mother was staying with us to help with the kids so people assumed she was taking care of meals. She was totally not able to. It was fine cooking the spaghetti. No big deal really. I doubt I washed the pot but who cares?
Having a baby is a big deal but it’s not like dealing with chemotherapy treatments! People here make it sound like it’s a desperate situation. It’s fine if the kids eat cereal for supper for a few days.

watergirl

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:07 pm

amother [ Buttercup ] wrote:

I think it's nebuch that you think it's nebuch. Chicken and potatos is a really nice meal where I live. Chicken? On a weeknight? On the bone and not as a shabbos leftover? It's a really nice, mentchlich meal!

Maybe YOU can easily make blended soup, a side, a salad, and have time to cut fruit. I work full time, so do most women I know. This all takes a lot of time.

Heyaaa

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:15 pm

I feel pampered by what people do, the more they do, the more I feel taken care of. But I’ve learned to temper my expectations. I’ve learned that I may get gross food that I would normally not touch but at least I didn’t have to cook it. Someone ends up eating it even if it’s not something we usually enjoy. I am still grateful even if it’s not our food preference. There have been times when we got the same food a few times and we don’t even like that food. But again, not having to cook was important enough that I made it work. I may get dinner 90 minutes after I asked for it and my starving kids will be crying so I will pull out some processed junk from the freezer and give it to them and then I will save the dinner to be used as lunch for the rest of the week. I think that when people expect it to be at the level of a paid service then expectations are high and disappointment is sure to follow. I think about the time, energy, expense and care taken out of someone else’s life just so that I can be taken care of and that emotional reality that really gets to me. When a busy mom does it, I’m extra touched. When the food is packaged nicely, I’m extra touched. When there are different options (even if it’s just 2 kinds of veggies) , I’m extra touched. When there is dessert (even cut up fruit), I’m extra touched. Literally when there is anything homemade that I didn’t have to cook and they brought it to my home, I am extra touched.

Reality

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:17 pm

amother [ Buttercup ] wrote:

It has nothing to do with your Hungarian balabatishe blood. I'm as litvish and un-balabatishe as they come and I agree with you 100%. I would never send someone just chicken and potatoes. I would add a salad with dressing on the side and depending on the season either a soup or cut up melon.

In my experience most people who think sending so little food is ok also send insufficient quantity of food. Not everyone can do every type of chesed. If it's too hard don't do it. If you can't send a balanced meal in a normal amount don't sign up.

For a few years I skipped most meal trains. I was a full time working mom with young kids and no cleaning help. I could barely get supper on the table on time for myself let a lone another family. It didn't mean I didn't do chesed. I did other chasadim. When dynamics changed in my house and I was able to make meals like a normal person I signed up again.

Know your strengths and weaknesses and do chasadim that play to your strengths.

amother

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:20 pm

mig100 wrote:

But my point was that under ALL circumstances there is another side to the story.
Imagine she would have cleared it with me in advance and I was on call the entire 9th month, had a pack n play set up, made sure to know his entire schedule, stocked up on diapers or whatever and then the exact day she goes into labor I come down with a stomache bug and do a mediocre job and rely on the babysitter to do her part.

Imagine after that the mother or the babysitter would get on here venting. Imagine everybody would bash me over the head for even taking on a task I was not prepared and able to execute perfectly.

Point is, you never know. New mother can be validated for feeling her. But any talk about the food deliverer is inappropriate.

watergirl

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:25 pm

Reality wrote:

Maybe it's community dependent? I send this and this is what everyone writes on the mealtrain (it asks you to write what you are sending). For a family of 6, I send at least 10 legs (leg and thigh together, so really 20 if you separate it). And I roast a 5lb bag of potatos. It's a lot of food.

Amelia Bedelia

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:30 pm

watergirl wrote:

Probably is. In my circles, chicken is a typical weeknight supper. I serve chicken or some sort of beef every single night. (My kids don't like dairy or fish.)

Reality

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:32 pm

watergirl wrote:

That is a lot! If I got that I would think it was really nice and just pull out a bag of baby carrots to round things out. I've never received such a large quantity of chicken. People in my neighborhood send an extra 1-2 pieces of chicken and more variety for the sides.

Like I said in my (old) neighborhood, people who only send two things usually don't send enough. You definitely get the vibe of " I really was forced into this chesed."

watergirl

Wed, May 18 2022, 12:34 pm

Amelia Bedelia wrote:

Probably is. In my circles, chicken is a typical weeknight supper. I serve chicken or some sort of beef every single night. (My kids don't like dairy or fish.)

I imagine if we took the time to break down your community, what people eat on any given night, etc. then these threads would have a very different feel. Women (chassidishe ladies, based off what I read on the whats for supper threads both in the regular forum and in the CV) who eat soup, chicken or meat main, a cooked veg, a salad, and a dessert every night will be livid with chicken and potatos. Women who are used to smaller, more basic meals would be very very happy with chicken and potatos. Also community expectations are so different, we know chaddishe ladies view recovery from birth very differently than non.

Note - this is in NO way bashing, I am just pointing out observed differences based on this site.