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Normal or worrisome?



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amother
OP


 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 7:37 am
My 5 year old DD takes other peoples things and lies about where she got them. She’ll say that the person gave it to her, she found it, etc. I think that she really believes that though. She’s extremely stubborn and oh the tantrums she has when I tell her that I know it’s not true…..
Lying in general is a problem with her that I don’t know how to deal with. She lies straight through her teeth. She has a vivid imagination and makes things up all the time. And then believes it. I’m not sure what to do.
Any advice?
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amother
Moonstone


 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 7:52 am
Yes lying at 5 years is normal. Not okay. But normal. I used to take peoples things at that age as well because I liked seeing their reaction when they didn’t know where it went. I see my now 5 year old say and do things to see the reaction of kids around him as well as his own siblings. Also my son is always giving away his toys when he has play dates so you never know if someone gave her things…

Just keep pushing that lying isn’t okay. If she wants something specific better not to take from her friends but ask you for it. Maybe try to remember to talk to her about it when it’s not happening.

Teaching not to lie is just another part of parenting.
Wipe your own butt ✔️
Don’t lie ✔️
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BrisketBoss




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 9:55 am
Yeah, when young children 'lie' it's a fantasy thing. They have a foot in reality and a foot in fantasy. Normal. They might say what they wish had happened or what might have been more interesting. Teaching them not to lie is unnecessary and possibly futile. Just remember not to take what they say at face value.
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amother
Bergamot


 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 10:37 am
My six year old is the same. It bothers me, and we are working on it, but I think in the range of normal. They have a huge imagination and a hard time putting limits on themselves.
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MonseyMommy3




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 10:47 am
It's totally normal until age 7 or 8.
When she says a lie, you can correct her and say "you wish you went to...." or "that would be really cool if..."

You can teach her how to communicate her imagination without stating it as a fact... use terms like "I wonder what it would be like to...." "Can you imagine if...."
She will mimic your way of speaking IYH and with time differentiate imagination from reality.
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amother
Cantaloupe


 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:36 am
.
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BrisketBoss




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:39 am
amother [ Cantaloupe ] wrote:
Please can we stop calling it 'lies'??
Children either say it as it happens or don't say it as it happens.
When you tell them they lied you put on them an exaggerated label.
A lie is a thought out and deliberate deception. Your child isn't doing that.
It is common for creative children to say what they wish or dream happened.
1st read them 2 children's books. One that is real or could be real like 'who's sleeping on my sofa bed' and one that is fantasy like 'Cinderella'
Explain that one is reality and one is fantasy.
We gently ask children when they say something that didn't happen
"Is this reality or fantasy"?
Do you wish this happened?
Are you nervous to get into trouble and so you said what you preferred happened?
In this way we teach the lesson without damaging the child.


Yeah, the more I learn about child development the more I wish everyone would. It would make parenting and childing (yeah, I made that up) so much easier.
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ShishKabob




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:40 am
BrisketBoss wrote:
Yeah, when young children 'lie' it's a fantasy thing. They have a foot in reality and a foot in fantasy. Normal. They might say what they wish had happened or what might have been more interesting. Teaching them not to lie is unnecessary and possibly futile. Just remember not to take what they say at face value.
I agree with all of your sentences except for the second to last one. "Teaching them not to lie is unnecessary and possibly futile"
We must and can teach children not to lie.
I will make it my business to tell my children that I'm not going to give them a consequence for what they did ONLY because they said the truth. Even if it's a pretty serious offense. Like that I show them how important it is to say the truth. And it's been working so far bh. (yes, my kids also lie and I have to deal with it)
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BrisketBoss




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:43 am
ShishKabob wrote:
I agree with all of your sentences except for the second to last one. "Teaching them not to lie is unnecessary and possibly futile"
We must and can teach children not to lie.
I will make it my business to tell my children that I'm not going to give them a consequence for what they did ONLY because they said the truth. Even if it's a pretty serious offense. Like that I show them how important it is to say the truth. And it's been working so far bh. (yes, my kids also lie and I have to deal with it)


So you punish them when they lie? Great that it's been working for you, but this is not necessarily the way to make kids comfortable telling you things. When children lie, it's a developmentally appropriate phase that they'll grow out of or they have a reason to lie. It's easier to tell the truth when you can.

Adults lie also, now and then.
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mushkamothers




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:48 am
BrisketBoss wrote:
Yeah, the more I learn about child development the more I wish everyone would. It would make parenting and childing (yeah, I made that up) so much easier.


I love the word childing

And yes development is so important. I'm so into this. Everyone is hyped up on connecting with the kid etc but you also need to just know what's developmentally appropriate.

Op state facts. Don't accuse of lying. There is no moral issue here.

I see chocolate on your face. I hear Sara looking for her game.
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ShishKabob




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:49 am
BrisketBoss wrote:
So you punish them when they lie? Great that it's been working for you, but this is not necessarily the way to make kids comfortable telling you things. When children lie, it's a developmentally appropriate phase that they'll grow out of or they have a reason to lie. It's easier to tell the truth when you can.
You got it wrong. I deliberately withhold the consequence for something they did, because they said the truth, despite the fact that they did something wrong.
Ex: did you destroy your sisters arts and crafts that she just completed? If they admit to their wrongdoing I will tell them that they are not getting a consequence just because they said the truth.
Please don't get hung up on my example. It's not the point.
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BrisketBoss




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:53 am
ShishKabob wrote:
You got it wrong. I deliberately withhold the consequence for something they did, because they said the truth, despite the fact that they did something wrong.
Ex: did you destroy your sisters arts and crafts that she just completed? If they admit to their wrongdoing I will tell them that they are not getting a consequence just because they said the truth.
Please don't get hung up on my example. It's not the point.


How does that contradict what I said? You seem to have repeated the same thing just now, which is that you don't punish if they tell the truth. That implies that if they don't tell the truth, they are punished. Doesn't it?

I suspect though, that the success of your system is much less fueled by the 'stick' and much more fueled by the fact that they are 'safe' when they tell the truth. And that's what you're focusing on here too.

(You said not to get hung up on your example, but do you really test them by asking questions that you already know the answer to? And if so, why set them up like that?)
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amother
SandyBrown


 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:54 am
Op, if it makes you feel better, I'm a pretty honest and straightforward person as an adult, more midadek than average, and what you describe reminds me of me as a kid. Up until I was around 6 or 7 I did this. I took toys home from playgroup and lied and told my mother the morah said I could. She made me bring it back. I stole a girl's chapstick when I was six. I also stole a girl's toy and lied and told my mother she gave it to me. My mother made me bring it back and then I think I lied and told the girl I found it in the back of the room bc I don't want to admit stealing it. This stopped when I was around age 7 I think.
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ShishKabob




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 11:55 am
BrisketBoss wrote:
How does that contradict what I said? You seem to have repeated the same thing just now, which is that you don't punish if they tell the truth. That implies that if they don't tell the truth, they are punished. Doesn't it?

I suspect though, that the success of your system is much less fueled by the 'stick' and much more fueled by the fact that they are 'safe' when they tell the truth. And that's what you're focusing on here too.

(You said not to get hung up on your example, but do you really test them by asking questions that you already know the answer to? And if so, why set them up like that?)
I won't ask them the question. I'll ask them how they ruined the project with a scizzors or tore it with their own hands. Smile
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amother
SandyBrown


 

Post Wed, Aug 10 2022, 12:04 pm
But rereading your op, maybe less of the "I know it isn't true." If anything, phrase it more like "did this happen in real life or in your imagination?" And if she says it really happened "we really wish so much that happened, don't we?"

Also, "let's do a game of wishes where we say all the things we wish were true. I wish..."

Also, during a neutral time that has nothing to do with her talking stuff, tell stories that highlight the importance of the truth and trust. Look for opportunities to praise her when she's honest so it can become a point of pride.
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