What are we doing wrong?

amother

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 3:45 pm

We are a family of 5 living out of town and recently I've noticed that our monthly spending seems crazy - we're spending about $11/12k each month not including tuition, tzedaka or big-ticket expenses (like travel, big purchases, etc.) I always thought we were pretty frugal, but this seems like a lot!! Is this normal??

Here's the breakdown of our average monthly expenses, give or take:

Car lease: 335
Car Insurance & Maintenance: 158
Gas: 200
Bills (electric/gas, water, internet, cell phone): 475
Groceries: 2,000
Food out: 400
House Cleaning: 390
Mortgage (inc home insurance & taxes): 1,740
Clothing: 700 (we don't spend this much every month, but averaging out the whole year....)
Tutoring: 250
Entertainment: 120
Gifts: 100
Life Insurance: 186
Doctor/Dentist: 200
Pharmacy: 225
Home services (lawn, gutter-cleaning, handyman, etc.): 200
Camp payments: 300
Dry-cleaning: 40
Beauty (Haircuts, wig, manicures, etc.): 100
Misc Shopping: 1,300
Cash: 300

amother

Bluebonnet

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 3:55 pm

amother OP wrote:

Wish I could help you but I spend way more… and no I can’t afford it either. Budgeting is beyond hard

amother

Catmint

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 4:31 pm

I obviously don’t have all your financial details but to me it seems that you are way overspending on clothing. You should not be spending $8,400/year on clothing unless you can comfortably afford it. Even out of town, it is possible to clothe a family of 5 on a fraction of that. I recommend cutting your annual clothing budget to $1,000 per person, so $5,000/year. This is still a generous amount. You can order lots of weekday clothes from target, childrens place, shein, and you can get shabbos clothes from cheaper stores like Kiddichic/Tottinni and on sale from other Jewish brands (all these places ship).

$400/month in eating out sounds high considering your $2,000 grocery spending, although I don’t know if groceries are super expensive where you live. Regardless, if your restaurant expenses are simply adding convenience to your life, try to slash them in half to $200 if possible.

Also, $1,300 misc. spending a month in addition to all your other spending sounds high, especially if it doesn’t include large purchases or vacations.

I don’t know if you are in debt or just not savings as much as you would like, but you need to first figure out your income and base your spending around that, with hopefully enough of a cushion to save some money each month (not possible for every family but always worth trying).

You are lucky that your mortgage is extremely low, and I think you will quickly see the savings add up by cutting back in a few other key areas.

I have always been naturally interested in personal finances so keeping track of my income and expenses comes naturally to me, but I understand not everyone is like that. I recommend downloading an app like Mint to give you an easy and convenient way to track your financial flow.

For reference we are a family of 4 living in NYC . Our income is about $250k pretax and our expenses are about $65k (includes everything except tzedaka, which is about $15-20k a year). However we are not homeowners yet, our expenses will go up once we have a mortgage/property tax (though I would note our rent is only $200 less than your mortgage).

Hatzlacha!

ETA I don’t know how much you are struggling, If at all, but if you aren’t making ends meet I assume you already know to immediately cut out extras like manicures, entertainment, etc

amother

RosePink

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 4:32 pm

We are a family of 6 living out of town. The following in your budget is high compared to what we spend:

Groceries: Used to be around $1,000, but with inflation still about $1,200. There are certain expensive things (like store bought dips - we now make our own) I stopped buying to try to keep it from climbing.

House cleaning: How many hours a week is that? Our monthly cost is $180 (3 hours a week at $15/hour). Less than half of what you are spending.

Clothing: Even with uniforms and buying Shabbos clothes in frum stores, I don't spend anywhere near $8,400 a year! Maybe $3,000-$4,000 tops.

Doctor/Dentist and pharmacy: you spend over $5,000 a year out of pocket, after insurance? That's tough. Any way to get better insurance? Do you have access to a HSA plan?

Misc. shopping: I get there needs to be some wiggle room, but what is this used for? On what are your spending over $15,000 a year? That is a huge part of budget

Cash: what is that $300/month used for?

Also, did you forget to add tuition to the list?

amother

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 4:42 pm

Thanks for the replies!

The eating out category isn't really eating out so much. It includes weekly Thurs. night pizza takeout, slurpees, ice cream, coffees, etc. I wouldn't have imagined that is our total, but it adds up quickly when you track it!

Someone in my family has a health issue and needs special food, that's probably a lot of the grocery expense.

The clothing! We're really simple (I do buy myself mostly from Shein, my boys from Old Navy and as much on sale as I can) and I can't figure out why it's adding up to so much, it just seems that every month there's more to buy - YT clothing, camp clothes, winter coats, swimsuits, uniforms, it doesn't end! I included alterations in that total too btw.

The misc shopping is all household stuff (shampoo, garbage bags, laundry detergent, paper goods, etc.), camp shopping, Amazon stuff, random purchases (e.g. desk for my son), school supplies, etc.

amother

NeonOrange

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 4:47 pm

amother OP wrote:

.

Since you asked, I still believe these are the categories you can cut back in. Generally overspending comes from a little bit here and a little bit there. So it's understandable when you add it up and it seems so high.

Unless the special food includes a lot of chalav yisrael products or animal protein, it shouldn't affect your food budget to this extent. Most of my family has special food needs and we spend about half of what you do.

dena613

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 5:44 pm

Clothes you wrote 700x12=8400 per year is quite excessive. That's over1k/person!

How much do you spend per person per season?

For example, I am very frugal, but if I spent more on myself per year:

40 undergarments (because not all new every year)
60 tights
600??? Clothes (I spend more like $200. I don't replace my wardrobe each year)
80 Shoes (because not new every year)
Total $780

Coat, sheitel, etc not new every year

Let's say you have a girl who is age 5-12
Uniforms $70 (I'm halving the amount because you only need to buy every other year. not new every year. Bring down hem etc.)
Shabbos clothes 120x2 seasons is 240
Tottini weekday, 2 for winter and6 summer: $200
Total $510
Plus school, shabbosx2, and summer shoes: max 200
Total $700

amother

SandyBrown

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 6:42 pm

amother OP wrote:

My family of 10 spends $2000/month on groceries. What are you buying?

amother

Almond

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 7:17 pm

My first thought was 1k pp on clothes is a lot but then I realize my older boys spend at least that much if I'm including shoes. Figure 2 pairs of yeshiva loafers and 2 shabbos shoes a yr. Each pair is $50-100 . 6 Yeshiva shirts plus 2 shabbos shirts, around 40 dollars each= $320. A suit with alterations $300. Yeshiva pants x3 $120 total plus alterations. Plus any underwear socks (lots and lots of socks replaced throughput the year when they get holes), tzitzis, yamulkas, and sometimes bathing suits PJs tshirts and tiros. Also once in a few years a new black hat and new davening jacket. This doesn't include sweatshirt, coats, boots. We are waaaay over 1k and I'm very frugal in general but I do buy at the Jewish stores so they can dress in style with their peers.

I don't have older girls but I'd imagine they buy new clothes each season it really does add up.

As far as cutting, what is your goal? Just to see where your money is going or to make actual changes to save money? You can cut down on many things if you are willing..the question is what can you live without. Less cleaning help? Do your own nails or not at all? Less coffees? Less on entertainment? You need to think about what you are willing to cut..

amother

Tue, Aug 16 2022, 7:20 pm

amother SandyBrown wrote:

My family of 10 spends $2000/month on groceries. What are you buying?

Here is my shopping receipt from the other week (I go about once a week) - total: $431
Many of the specialty items and produce are for the family member who is gluten/soy/dairy-free.

Lettuce
$3.99
Banana, 1 ct
$1.91
Bard Valley Natural Delights Pitted Fresh Medjool Dates, 12 oz
$5.99
Barilla Marinara Pasta Sauce, 24 oz
$6.58
2 x $3.29 each
Black Plums, 1 ct
$3.56
Bloom Haus™ Dozen Rose Bunch - Pink, 12-stem
$12.00
Butternut Squash, 1 ct
$4.27
Califia Farms® French Vanilla Dairy Free Almondmilk Creamer, 48 fl oz
$8.99
Chicken of the Sea® Chunk Light Tuna in Water, 5 oz
$7.74
6 x $1.29 $1.39 each
Cotton Candy Grapes, 1 lb
$7.98
Daisy Cottage Cheese, 24 oz
$4.29
Empire Kosher Slow Roasted Turkey Breast Slices Lunch Meat, 7 oz
$6.99
Empire Kosher Smoked Turkey Breast Slices Lunch Meat, 7 oz
$6.99
English Cucumber, 1 ct
$1.50
Extra Large Avocado, 1 ct
$6.00
4 x $1.50 $2.50 each
Gala Apples Bag, 3 lb
$4.29
Green Seedless Grapes, 1 lb
$4.38
Hellmann's Real Mayonnaise, 5.5 fl oz
$3.29
Hunt's Tomato Paste, 6 oz
$1.19
Hunt's® Tomato Sauce, 15 oz
$1.34
Hunt's® Tomato Sauce, 15 oz
$1.33
Jumbo Red Onions, 1 ct
$1.17
Kineret Ready-To-Bake Challah Dough, 15 oz
$11.58
2 x $5.79 each
Klosterman 100% Whole Wheat Bread, 20 oz
$2.49
Kohlrabi Lettuce, 1 each
$3.49
Kosh Bf Chuck Flankn Ribs
$14.75
Kosh Bf London Broil Tp
$14.90
Kosh Chk Broilr Yng Wh Fs
$14.02
Kosher Chicken Leg Quarters, 1 lb
$27.57
Kosher Ground Beef, 1 lb
$9.11
Kosher Ground Beef, 1 lb
$8.95
Lightly Salted Roasted Almonds, 24 oz
$9.99
100% Orange Juice with Calcium, 52 fl oz
$2.99
2% Reduced Fat Milk, 1/2 gal
$5.97
3 x $1.99 $2.39 each
Classic Garden Salad, 12 oz
$1.69
Elbow Macaroni Pasta, 32 oz
$1.99
Large White Eggs, 18 ct
$3.39
Low Fat Blended Vanilla Yogurt, 32 oz
$2.00
Purified Drinking Water, 24 bottles / 16.9 fl oz
$2.99
Large Ruby Red Grapefruit, 1 ct
$5.00
3 x $1.66 each (approx.)
Lieber's Thin Crispy Corn Cakes, 2.9 oz
$18.83
7 x $2.69 each
MorningStar Farms Meatless Chicken Nuggets Original, 10.5 oz
$7.98
2 x $3.99 $4.49 each
Nature Sweet Cherub Tomatoes, 10 oz
$3.99
Newman's Own Dairy-Free Avocado Oil & Extra Virgin Olive Oil Caesar Dressing, 8 fl oz
$11.98
Newman's Own Dairy-Free Avocado Oil & Extra Virgin Olive Oil Greek Dressing, 8 fl oz
$5.99
Orange Bell Pepper, 1 ct
$4.17
3 x $1.39 each
Organic Gold Jewel Sweet Potatoes, 1 ct
$6.08
3.6 lbs x $1.68 each (approx.)
Parsnip, 1 lb
$0.52
Private Selection Long Celery Sticks, 12 oz
$2.99
Private Selection™ Mini Seedless Cucumbers, 1 lb
$5.58
2 x $2.79 each
Quaker™ Oats 1 Minute Oatmeal, 42 oz
$5.99
Red Hothouse Bell Pepper, 1 ct
$4.17
3 x $1.39 each
Red Seedless Grapes, 1 lb
$3.78
1.9 lbs x $1.98 each (approx.)
RXBAR Mixed Berry Protein Bar, 1.83 oz
$3.33
2 x $1.66 $1.99 each (approx.)
RXBAR® Blueberry Protein Bar, 1.83 oz
$3.33
2 x $1.66 $1.99 each (approx.)
RXBAR® Coconut Chocolate Protein Bar, 1.83 oz
$3.34
2 x $1.67 $1.99 each
Silk Vanilla Almond Milk, 6 ct / 8 fl oz
$7.49
1 x $7.49 each
Silk® Strawberry Almondmilk Yogurt, 5.3 oz
$13.93
7 x $1.99 each
Silk® Vanilla Almond Milk Yogurt Alternative, 5.3 oz
$1.99
1 x $1.99 each
Simple Truth Organic® Extra Firm Tofu, 14 oz
$1.79
Simple Truth Organic™ Crushed Rosemary, 0.97 oz
$3.79
Smidge and Spoon™ Garlic Powder, 2 oz
$2.50
2 x $1.25 each
Smidge and Spoon™ Onion Powder, 1.75 oz
$2.50
2 x $1.25 each
Snyder's of Hanover Sourdough Hard Pretzels, 13.5 oz
$4.79
SO Delicious Dairy Free Vanilla Bean Coconutmilk Sandwiches Frozen Dessert 8 Count, 8 ct
$5.49
Starbucks® Pike Place® Medium Roast Ground Coffee, 12 oz
$9.49
Strawberries, 32 oz
$3.99
Streit's Israeli Couscous, 8.8 oz
$4.58
2 x $2.29 each
Streit's Matzo Ball Soup Mix, 4.5 oz
$3.29
White Whole Mushrooms, 8 oz
$2.29
Whole Carrots, 2 lb
$2.19
Yellow Nectarines, 1 ct
$13.97
5.61 lbs x $2.49 each (approx.)
Yellow Onions, 3 lb
$2.59
Zucchini, 1 ct
$3.16