More on the finance threads

amother

Raspberry

Fri, Jan 27 2023, 5:45 am

watergirl wrote:

There is a current thread at the moment, woman posting about how great their husbands are.

There is another current thread about people posting what makes their marriages great.

People post all the time about vacations they go on.

People post all the time about the schools, camps, or seminaries their kids got into.

People post to hear about how they got married after a quick and easy shidduch parsha.

Women post hear about their many many children.

Nobody accuses these women about bragging and flaunting their husbands and their great marriages. There are plenty of women here who have horrible marriages, they are divorced, or widowed, and these threads are terribly hurtful to them. But they (mostly) skip the threads, or they hold their comments.

We all know how many people here would love to see their children in the right school, getting into camp, etc. Nobody accuses those women of flaunting and bragging about their good fortune and getting their kids into the right places. You don’t see women who are mothers of children with special needs telling the mothers who got their kid into their seminary of choice that their post is in bad taste.

I’m sure you know how many women here or deal with infertility. Nobody accuses a mother of 10 who posts how many children she has hear of bragging and flaunting.

A lot of threads here have potential to cause a lot of pain and bad feelings for many people. But we are all supposed to be grownups here and know what to avoid or how to scroll on.

Yet a post about money, that’s bad taste. The same HKBU who gave the good husband, who gave the children, who gave the schools, He also gave the money.

A post about it a vacation or a bracelet/eternity ring, or a $350 outfit is flaunting. Posting about renovating your house to make it “fitting for the frum lifestyle” a that’s just the Jewish norm apparently. It’s totally fine to post your weekly menu which features foods that a lot of us consider to be way too expensive for a weekday, that’s fine. It’s totally fine to post about your brand new Tesla in a space where the majority of readers could never even dream of one. That’s OK. Creating a pool asking how many children you have, that’s not flaunting.

There’s just a lot of cognitive dissonance. And people need to take ownership of their triggers and avoid them.

Personally, I have a current struggle and trigger that I never had before. There is a forum on this site dedicated to this topic, and I happen to be a moderator there. I knew there was no way for me to moderate or even see the topics without getting upset and triggered and snarky, so I told Yael that I am hiding it, and to please remove me as a moderator there. Problem solved.

On this website, it is extremely easy to know what threads to go into and which ones to avoid. Nobody is “making you feel bad” when they post some thing, you have to take ownership of your feelings. You allow yourself to feel bad, or to feel jealous. These are character traits that could be changed, but it takes time and work.

Can’t like this post enough!!

notshanarishona

Fri, Jan 27 2023, 6:03 am

I don’t like it when my kid’s classmates come in bragging about their expensive stuff because it means a lot of tantrums for me about it’s not fair, why can’t I get what x has.
At the same time, I wouldn’t expect a rich person to buy shoes at Goodwill or Walmart so that my kids won’t be upset.
It’s frustrating because it highers the standards and creates jealousy (that’s part of the reason we have school uniforms but it extends to shoes, headbands, backpacks, coat, etc).
For example, my daughter refused to wear her coat until it got really cold in protest that I didn’t buy her the one that the cool kids have (which was very expensive).
I didn’t back down because we couldn’t and even if we had an extra $250 a coat wouldn’t be where I would spend it but that’s life. There will always be the haves and the have nots.
I do think when possible it’s preferable to be quiet about what you have and/or not send your kids to school with it (because most kids aren’t mature enough to be sensitive) but there is nothing wrong with spending your money how you see fit even if it does cause others pain.

amother

Zinnia

Fri, Jan 27 2023, 6:28 am

mommy3b2c wrote:

Exactly. I’m not sure whether to laugh or cry. I literally gave a direct example, hesitated before I wrote the price and then said to myself, “let’s go for it. Let’s see what happens.” And here we have it…

The jealousy, the shaming, the mocking, the accusations of showing off, of not being compassionate. And there’s no way to defend myself, because if I do, like by saying I do give tzedaka, then that’s considered another brag. It’s jealousy, plain and simple, people just really don’t want to admit it.

I won’t judge. I’ve never been jealous in my life. Envious, yes. I definitely want things other people have. My life is a painful one. But I can wish I have something and at the same be so happy for the people who do have it.

You are a giver. You gave to your son generously just like you give to other people. There is nothing wrong with what you did. I don't earn much, I've never spent more than $75 on a pair of shoes, but I am so happy if you do, and I admire your generous heart and spirit. I wonder if I would be as generous if I were in your place, it is a different kind of nisayon but also a nisayon. May you always be bentched.

amother

Cobalt

Fri, Jan 27 2023, 6:46 am

watergirl wrote:

We're talking about children here who do not have the maturity and understanding to accept that life is not fair or equal.

amother

Zinnia

Fri, Jan 27 2023, 7:10 am

amother Cobalt wrote:

We're talking about children here who do not have the maturity and understanding to accept that life is not fair or equal.

Life is a growing process from very young till very old. Of course children don't have maturity because they've never been taught. This is the chance for their parents to teach them. Otherwise how will they learn.

I have five teenagers (plus littles) and they have never asked me for the same coat or shoes as their classmates. (In brooklyn)

When they were younger and went to friends houses for playdates or parties, they obviously saw that some homes are much fancier and bigger than ours, and some are tinier cluttered apartments.

When it came to bar mitzvahs and bas mitzvahs, the same story. They were smart enough to see and discern that doing what everyone else does is not necessarily the best. They saw, a fancy party made in a huge hall with very little relatives, was awkward. Another fancy party with random guests told to go because the bar mitzva boy is a yasom, also not ideal. A party with lots of speeches or running so late that it's midnight and dessert hasn't been served yet, not our style. This fancy party, that fancy party, very nice events but also very repetitive. Copycat simchas. So they learned, we don't need to copy everyone else. We have our own way, the way we think is best.

Now they are older and the peer pressure is about heavier things. One of my teens is more curious and experimental and observant than the others- he sees friends dealing with major addictions. His friend who gets drunk on shabbos so that he won't feel the need to smoke. Another friend who is unstable without his alcohol fix. Another who is a slave to his cigarettes. My son does not want to be like that. He sees his friends are dysfunctional and he doesn't want a messed up life. He told me recently thats smoking is disgusting and nasty and his friends stink. I was so proud of him for learning what not to do from friends instead of what to do.
He comes to us and asks: my friends are skipping yeshiva tonight to go to a sports event, would it be a problem if I go with them? Would it be okay if I went to florida for a weekend with my friends? Can I go on a road trip with my friends overnight? He will not jump on his friends' bandwagon without thinking it through first. He loves fun and misses out a ton because he understands our safety and propriety standards are higher than those of his friends' families. He's not perfect every time because growing up is a slow imperfect process, but the strength he has developed from standing up to peer pressure is unbelievable. Much more than my other teens who wouldn't have these friends to begin with.

So we need to be raising thinking children. Children who think before they leap, and practice it not only at 5 and 10 years old, but over and over so when that critical teen decision-making moment occurs: wanna smoke, wanna ride across town, wanna try this drug, the child will stop and take a moment to think before leaping.

amother

Oatmeal

Fri, Jan 27 2023, 8:41 am

There is so much jealousy in this thread and so many other threads this week.
Why cant people spend money the way they want?
If certain brands or items are important to someone and thats what they want to spend money on, what is it to you?

Everyone has what they splurge on. I personally dont have much money but I really wanted to buy very nice layette when my long awaited baby was born.
Maybe family or friends thought it was a waste of money, but no one was all up in arms about my spending!

I am so happy for others who can afford beautiful large homes, luxury cars, gorgeous clothing and jewelry etc
If I was jealous and always looking at what others have and what I lack I would be miserable!
I have a sister who gets gifted jewelry from her husband very often. My husband cant afford to gift me jewelry. I am so happy for my sister. Genuinely happy for her.

Lets work on being happy for others and being grateful for what we have.
And seriously stop being so bothered how other people spend their money

amother

Cadetblue

Fri, Jan 27 2023, 10:02 am

watergirl wrote:

What I think you’re missing is that just because people don’t always complaint about or even worse make themselves vulnerable to share how hurt they are by people bragging about things they have that some others weren’t blessed with (children, or more children, Shalom bayis, marriage, a good husband…) that does not mean they aren’t hurtful!
I know for myself I have been very hurt reading some of those threads you mentioned because I don’t have some of it and it pains me every Day and when I read about some people who seem to have what I’m missing and even more it’s just normal human nature to feel bad. I’m sure I’m not alone.
It’s easier to comment on someone flaunting money than saying I’m experiencing infertility and when you complain that all your kids are fighting and you’re losing your mind from it I can’t help but think if only I had your problem.
So don’t be sure what you wrote is true.
Not everyone comments here about what hurts them when they read threads listing all people’s blessings that they don’t have. Even worse when people complain about them and don’t realize what they have.

mommy3b2c

Fri, Jan 27 2023, 10:35 am

amother Cadetblue wrote:

I don’t think she’s missing anything. People get jealous. Some over this and some over that, it’s on yoh to work on your middos and not get jealous. It’s on everyone else to work on their middos and not brag and flaunt. On this site , you can’t have normal conversation without someone getting hurt and complaining. Everyone needs to grow up and work on their middos. Period.