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Renovations? Anyone not?
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amother
OP


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 11:21 am
I was speaking to a non jewish coworker of mine and she was surprised that we do renovations to our home. She said it's very uncommon in middle to low class. If something breaks or some kind of major life change they would but it's not done often. Fixer uppers are bought by people who fix it mostly themselves.
It was an interesting take. Everyone in my area either fully renovated their home before moving in and or do renovations projects every 2 years or so.
Why is this? It feels like a need to me but maybe I'm just influenced by what's normal here and really should just live with the house as is.
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amother
Maple


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 11:32 am
I see the same where I live. The non jews haven't touched their houses in years. They fix something when it breaks but that's pretty much it. Maybe the simple folks don't have the same keeping up with the whoevers mentality and are happy with less.
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amother
Stone


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 11:34 am
Non-jews don't do renovations as much because when they want an upgrade they just move.

We are much more limited to where we can (and want ) to live. So we stay put and do renovations.
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amother
OP


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 11:36 am
amother Stone wrote:
Non-jews don't do renovations as much because when they want an upgrade they just move.

We are much more limited to where we can (and want ) to live. So we stay put and do renovations.


Really? That's an interesting take. My non Jewish neighbors have all lived in their homes for many many years.
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mha3484




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 11:40 am
This is the case where I live. My non jewish neighbors dont do anything to their houses. Maybe inside they paint or get new furniture or carpet or whatever but on the outside not a thing.

Where I live, there are a few styles of homes none of which are great for a bigger family. Its not about looks its about small bedrooms, one bathroom, generally crowded once you have more then 4 kids. IE two to a room plus a room for parents. Many houses here were added on to decades ago on the first floor. Its become common for people to build back and add a second bathroom and more bedrooms on the second floor. But once you do that its usually once in a life time deal. Renovations every two years I dont really know anyone doing that.
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amother
Lilac


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 11:51 am
I think it depends on the family. If you only have maybe 1.2 children and a dog, a small 3 bedroom house is fine. But if you have a few children, then you need more space. Also if you have a lot of family and simchos, you might need more space.
We also have shabbos and yom tov where we get together and overall our livestyles are quite different. When I speak to colleagues around December time and they talk about how difficult it is to make a family meal and how much work, they forget that we do this weekly for shabbos, and also every yom tov!
We spend a lot of time in our homes and we want them to work for us. Most people I know though aren't constantly renovating. You buy a house and years down the line when you have enough kids (and money) and you need more space, it's often cheaper and easier to extend the house than it is to try and move to something larger.
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amother
Chambray


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 11:55 am
Our communities standards are insanely high with everything.
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watergirl




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 11:57 am
So interesting. I know people who may replace a kitchen counter or remodel a bathroom, but I don't know a lot of people who do real renovations.
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amother
Burgundy


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:01 pm
We bought our house 4 years ago. A major requirement for us was no big renovations necessary.
Layout is decent although I'm sure with renovations I can make it more jewish family friendly.
I'm not doing it though. We can't afford it easily and I rather save the money for future simchas.
I recently had someone comment to me "you don't have any plans to renovate? Like not at all?". And I said no we do not. She was shocked. Tells me "all my neighbors renovated".
I guess that's a running mentality here. But I don't care. I will do what's best for my family financially.
We have a huge house b"h. But no pesach kitchen, no convenient coat closet, no laundry room, non Jewish layout kitchen (we added a sink), etc... typical non Jewish house. I'm happy enough b"h.
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amother
Stonewash


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:11 pm
It's not just about where you move but where you buy. Non Jews who know they want to havea bunch of kids will find a decent sized house for that goal in a neighborhood they're good with in general and happy with the school district, and that's that. I do tbink that in some sectors there's more of a culture of getting a bunch of friends together to do work as necessary. But in general, that's that. We pick specific neighborhoods and then look for what we can afford now. If that's enough for two of three kids and that's what we have, great, and then when we need more space it often makes more sense to renovate than move. Also, in specific areas, there are few if any houses available that are big enough for a family movong in, so pretty much everyone buys and constructs.
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mha3484




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:14 pm
amother Stonewash wrote:
It's not just about where you move but where you buy. Non Jews who know they want to havea bunch of kids will find a decent sized house for that goal in a neighborhood they're good with in general and happy with the school district, and that's that. I do tbink that in some sectors there's more of a culture of getting a bunch of friends together to do work as necessary. But in general, that's that. We pick specific neighborhoods and then look for what we can afford now. If that's enough for two of three kids and that's what we have, great, and then when we need more space it often makes more sense to renovate than move. Also, in specific areas, there are few if any houses available that are big enough for a family movong in, so pretty much everyone buys and constructs.


This is my experience with everyone I know who isnt frum. You buy based on public schools and what you can afford and you factor in the commute too.
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amother
Stoneblue


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:24 pm
I was given the advice to live in the space before renovating so you can best see how you utilize the space. Also having just liquidated most of my cash reserves on down payment I wanted to reestablish my savings. So I instituted an automatic monthly savings plan and saved up for about 5 years. I was shocked at how much I saved without even feeling it.
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amother
Firebrick


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:27 pm
Most of our renovations make it a more Jewish friendly home. Like double sinks, larger dining room for bigger family, bedrooms set up for more kids etc.. and non Jews do move if they want bigger or different. Since we are so dependent on location we just renovate instead.
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amother
Rainbow


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:27 pm
Many of my colleagues do renovations... dont think this is a jewish thing at all.many of my husbands colleagues live a high life (vacations, country clubs, living in gated communities) while we live super simple because were paying tuition kosher food yt etc.

Short story non Jews in my income bracket seem to live a much more luxurious lifestyle than frum people earning the same.
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amother
Feverfew


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:31 pm
I think this is just a very bizarre interpretation.

The home remodeling industry is HUGE and very very busy. Frum Jews are a minuscule percentage of the population - who do you think is actually doing all of that renovation all over the US if not for non frum people.

I am often stunned by the lack of knowledge or insight that some people have as to how non frum people actually live.

It is like the old fable of blind people who were describing an elephant and each touched a different part of the animal and so described it differently.

If you live in a neighborhood where the non frum people have lived for many years and aren't remodeling, it is because older people generally are at a stage in life where they aren't remodeling or taking on large projects. They are thinking of downsizing and also don't want their lives disrupted for a long period of time. This is true of neighborhoods where non Jews live as well - whoever buys a home that is in its original condition from an older person who is moving or their estate will generally do a completely gut remodel.

To think that only frum Jews renovate or remodel is and somehow this is because they have higher standards is beyond silly.

What might be linked to being frum is that frum Jews are generally trapped in certain areas that are older because the frum lifestyle is more difficult in suburbs with large distances between homes and between certain requisite stuff that has to be walkable. And those homes tend to be older.

But the same is true of non frum people who move into older areas because they don't want to commute - closer in suburbs or gentrifying metropolitan areas. All of those homes are renovated as soon as they are sold. Some are even torn down because the modest homes are on land which is highly desirable to affluent people.
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mha3484




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:33 pm
OP specifically said middle to low class. Those are the people I live around and no they really dont do major home renos. Upper middle class to Wealthy obviously do.
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amother
Beige


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:37 pm
Funny you brought this up, my non Jewish coworker actually told me (after having his 4th kid) that he priced out renovations to make his house bigger but financially it made more sense to move, he moved less than a mile away from his old house.
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amother
Glitter


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:57 pm
I noticed this also. Even those who "don't renovate" will have the floors scraped, house painted. Even for a rental. Oh, and put in another bathroom or sink.

I think we're the only ones who just moved in.
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amother
Slateblue


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:57 pm
I belong to some interior design groups on Facebook. Granted I don’t know how much money they have, but they put a lot of work into their homes, and they don’t all seem like they’re rich. They try to find dups, or get bargains on marketplace or outlets. They do some work on their own, but they outsource too.
Frum people also tend to renovate because they need 2 sinks, a pesach kitchen, more room in general for larger families or hosting for Shabbos/Yom Tov.
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amother
Firebrick


 

Post Thu, Jan 26 2023, 12:58 pm
amother Glitter wrote:
I noticed this also. Even those who "don't renovate" will have the floors scraped, house painted. Even for a rental. Oh, and put in another bathroom or sink.

I think we're the only ones who just moved in.


Painting and floors are basics non Jews do it too.
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