Home
Log in / Sign Up
    Private Messages   Advanced Search   Rules   New User Guide   FAQ   Advertise   Contact Us  
Forum -> Parenting our children
Smart but unmotivated kid



Post new topic   Reply to topic View latest: 24h 48h 72h

amother
OP


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 11:13 am
My son in 5th grade ka"h is very bright, he does well in school without studying and as a school psychologist by training I've used him for practice assessments and I know he's in the upper 90th percentile. He's among the youngest in his class which "puts him in his place" a bit and he's already in the highest ability groups in his class. He can't be skipped because I have another son in the grade above him and that would not be good for a lot of reasons.

Problem is he is very unmotivated to do more in terms of enrichment. He's more of a "jock" and wants to play sports and computers more than anything. He's acting out in ELA class, he hates reading (already has glasses so it's not that) and writing. The teacher is probably satisfactory, he's relatively new to the school and doesn't send out much homework so I don't really know what they do in class so I'm not crazy about him, but we're in a small community so there aren't any other options.

He's kind of stumping me in terms of what to do with him.
Back to top

amother
Marigold


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 11:17 am
I would evaluate him, sometimes a smart kid like that covers up a learning disability. He might be dyslexic or similar. It’s common to play out this way.
Back to top

mha3484




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 11:19 am
I really believe that kids do well when they can. He is showing you that he cant meet your expectations. Have you read the explosive child? I think it could really help you. It sounds a lot like hes bored.
Back to top

giftedmom




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 11:27 am
Very common for giftedness to play out this way for several reasons
Back to top

amother
Lavender


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 11:34 am
Possible ad(h)d?
Back to top

theoneandonly




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 11:39 am
Leave him alone. Let him play sports and enjoy life.
Signed,
The smart, gifted kid who was pushed to do more and more and is now burnt out for life.
Back to top

amother
OP


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 11:41 am
amother Marigold wrote:
I would evaluate him, sometimes a smart kid like that covers up a learning disability. He might be dyslexic or similar. It’s common to play out this way.


It's not inability. He just doesn't want to. He's been able to read since he was 4 but didn't want to. He was treated for a convergence insuffinciency before he had glasses and it got a little bit better, He has read several-hundred-page books and didn't want to read shorter ones. He had ONE series that he liked and then the library didn't have the rest so he gave up, I finally got another book in the series and he said he doesn't like them anymore. He's a lot like me in that I like reading when I find a book that I like, but I'm more interested in other things. I keep trying to suggest other series, but he keeps saying no, refuses to go to the library to find books.

It's possible its ADHD, more likely anxiety. I haven't ruled out the possibility, he's just shown the ability to "hold it together" so I haven't needed to assess him. Our school doesn't really have and "2-e" accommodations so there's really no point. I work for the local school district so I know how SpEd works here.

It's not so much "my" expectations, its that he's disruptive during class, so not sure what to do to curtail this. He's probably bored, but doesn't want to be "punished" for being able to finish his work faster.
Back to top

amother
Powderblue


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 11:46 am
I'm thinking 2 things.

1. Either he just has has energy and let him do sports and don't stress on acedemics so much. Doesn't mean he can misbehave, you can try doing behavior plan for him... but don't make it a focal point for him to get top marks... if he's bright enough he'll do ok without 100% effort all the time.

2. Does he have adhd? Might be very hard for him to sit so long or to focus... I've seen it many times in kids where they are bright but "unmotivated" when really it's a lack of executive functions skills to sit and focus and get through the tasks. Don't drive him nuts. Rather teach him a skill to help him.
Back to top

amother
Seablue


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 12:03 pm
My son was just like this!!!

He didn't lift a finger for school and aced tests. Crazy smart (his teachers say he won't meet many that can keep up with him). No bribery or prize would get him to do any of the extra credit/learning offered. We couldn't skip him because he's more of an introvert and socially would fail a grade ahead.

That was until Mesivta when all of a sudden he had to work for gemara. You can't breeze through a gemara. He didn't know what to do with himself. He was burning out fast.

It took time, but he figured out a balance. He's now in beis medresh. His motivation is setting himself goals and deadlines to finish X. He can't just do a project and it take as long as it takes--he loses motivation mid way. But if there is a self set deadline with expectations of how much to get done in that time frame (example---if he wants to learn on an off shabbos without goals he may learn a bit here or there or may not at all. But if he makes himself a goal to cover a certain amount over the off shabbos, splits it out over the days home---then he'll go to learn and finish the goal.)
Back to top

amother
NeonOrange


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 12:45 pm
This sounds like my son who just realized he had to study hard for mesivta farhers and is still learning how to appt himself. He is also a smart and unmotivated kid. Seablue, you have given me encouragement!!


amother Seablue wrote:
My son was just like this!!!

He didn't lift a finger for school and aced tests. Crazy smart (his teachers say he won't meet many that can keep up with him). No bribery or prize would get him to do any of the extra credit/learning offered. We couldn't skip him because he's more of an introvert and socially would fail a grade ahead.

That was until Mesivta when all of a sudden he had to work for gemara. You can't breeze through a gemara. He didn't know what to do with himself. He was burning out fast.

It took time, but he figured out a balance. He's now in beis medresh. His motivation is setting himself goals and deadlines to finish X. He can't just do a project and it take as long as it takes--he loses motivation mid way. But if there is a self set deadline with expectations of how much to get done in that time frame (example---if he wants to learn on an off shabbos without goals he may learn a bit here or there or may not at all. But if he makes himself a goal to cover a certain amount over the off shabbos, splits it out over the days home---then he'll go to learn and finish the goal.)
Back to top

amother
Chicory


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 12:51 pm
Focus on his social life and let him be a kid.
Signed,
Another gifted kid who grew up feeling different
Back to top

mha3484




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 12:56 pm
My son is brilliant. He would need to be in mesivta at this point to not be bored. (Hes in 6th grade)

I don't pressure him. He learns extra when he wants to. He goes to masimidim after dinner when he wants the social scene. And I leave him alone. I refuse to burn him out in 6th grade. Between minyan and late dismissal he is adjusting to so many changes. I just try to keep the atmosphere low pressure and light.
Back to top

amother
OP


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 1:53 pm
amother Seablue wrote:
My son was just like this!!!

He didn't lift a finger for school and aced tests. Crazy smart (his teachers say he won't meet many that can keep up with him). No bribery or prize would get him to do any of the extra credit/learning offered. We couldn't skip him because he's more of an introvert and socially would fail a grade ahead.


This is him exactly, I'm just trying to figure out how to avoid him getting in trouble, because he's not a "bad" kid cv"s just kind of gets caught up in silliness, and he can be disrespectful at times. He's told me he's been sent to the principal's office a few times.

He loves kodesh learning, I just can't get him to apply himself in chol.
Back to top

amother
Dill


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 1:59 pm
Sounds like he’s doing well in most classes. Some students like certain subjects more than others. He might not be a reader , but he sounds ok. I would just leave him alone and let him enjoy his sports and computers (in moderation).
Back to top

amother
Foxglove


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 2:29 pm
I have a 4th grader like this. He does have adhd, but his doctor feels it's relatively mild and does not recommend medication at this time. He is also the youngest in the grade, so we don't want to skip him as he's already fairly immature for his age. His teachers allow him to use a fidget toy when he needs to or to even leave class and walk up and down the halls for a few minutes when he needs a break. The main idea is not to push him to do more with his brains (likely to backfire) but as long as he's doing what he has to do and is not disruptive when he gets bored, we leave him alone.
Back to top

amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 3:37 pm
I came on here because one of the people on this thread asked me to reply.

I run a site called giftedspace.com servicing the needs of frum gifted kids.

A few thoughts here.

    Many gifted kids are unbribable.

    Many are unmotivated.

    There is one big red flag for me in your post which is the distaste for reading. I'd want to check that with an expert reading specialist. It's very unusual in the gifted world.

    There are no frum schools who really have facility for helping with 2E kids.

    It's essential that he does something which he feels passionate about - even if it's standing on his head. A person who lives without passion is on a dangerous road. Maybe passion is the wrong word but something which he wants to do and is prepared to put effort into. A person who never puts effort into anything is at risk.

    You need to focus not on academic learning but on teaching him life skills. Things like doing things even if they're boring etc.

    In terms of school: you need to flip the outlook for him. He isn't going to school to learn math. He is going to school to (fill in the gap).

    Challenge him with physical activities that need brainpower as well as physical prowess. eg. karate, tightrope walking etc.


You can contact me through my website - I give an initial 30 minute free consultation.
Back to top

amother
OP


 

Post Wed, Feb 08 2023, 7:02 pm
amother Aquamarine wrote:
I came on here because one of the people on this thread asked me to reply.

I run a site called giftedspace.com servicing the needs of frum gifted kids.

A few thoughts here.

    Many gifted kids are unbribable.

    Many are unmotivated.

    There is one big red flag for me in your post which is the distaste for reading. I'd want to check that with an expert reading specialist. It's very unusual in the gifted world.

    There are no frum schools who really have facility for helping with 2E kids.

    It's essential that he does something which he feels passionate about - even if it's standing on his head. A person who lives without passion is on a dangerous road. Maybe passion is the wrong word but something which he wants to do and is prepared to put effort into. A person who never puts effort into anything is at risk.

    You need to focus not on academic learning but on teaching him life skills. Things like doing things even if they're boring etc.

    In terms of school: you need to flip the outlook for him. He isn't going to school to learn math. He is going to school to (fill in the gap).

    Challenge him with physical activities that need brainpower as well as physical prowess. eg. karate, tightrope walking etc.


You can contact me through my website - I give an initial 30 minute free consultation.


I actually signed him up for Taekwondo for this exact reason, except he "hates it"--probably because the life skills are out of his comfort zone.
Back to top

amother
Amaryllis


 

Post Tue, Feb 14 2023, 4:47 pm
Sounds like me as a kid.

I didn't like reading, didn't like writing, didn't like subjects I wasn't interested in. Was mildly disruptive, mostly just did my own thing in class. I had zero interest in working hard.

But I was gifted, got excellent grades. And was diagnosed on the later end with ADHD.

Gifted - many gifted kids actually don't know how to put in work and effort. They breeze by on their strengths alone without trying. And as they get older, the lack of ability to work hard shows up more in the classroom and out (e.g., homework, studying). He may need help learning study skills, classwork/homework skills, and understanding why hard work is even useful or desirable. Also, kids who are gifted sometimes act out in class, try to brainstorm with him about other things he can do instead if he is bored - getting him in on it will help with ideas that are actually relevant for him and make him more likely to try his ideas than yours.

ADHD - Many ADHD kids just are not interested in anything that requires sustained attention or effort - that includes things like reading, writing, and working hard. I didn't take medication until I was older, but it helped my attention span and impulsive behavior in class. I learned other strategies as well - little things to play with during class to help me focus, taking breaks as often as needed, looking up periodically as a break (also helps eyes), being allowed to go to the water fountain or bathroom when I needed to give myself a break from paying attention. These helped my behavior because I wasn't holding it all in until it just exploded out. Edited to add - also learning to break things down into smaller tasks or steps also makes everything more approachable - reading a book, writing an essay, homework, studying, paying attention to the teacher, etc., so use this strategy as well.
Back to top

amother
Aqua


 

Post Tue, Feb 14 2023, 4:52 pm
Has he read Harry Poter
A lot of kids get I to reading with this book
I don’t know what it has that other books don’t but it works.
As long as he’s not easily scared
Back to top

salt




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Feb 15 2023, 2:30 am
Why does he have to read books?
If he is smart and doesn't need extra lessons or to study hard for tests, let him play sports in his spare time. Let him get out and run around, cycle, and kick a ball.
Back to top
Page 1 of 1 Recent Topics




Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forum -> Parenting our children

Related Topics Replies Last Post
Want to get rid of my smart phone
by amother
24 Today at 1:04 am View last post
When one kid ruins the whole tone of the class
by amother
24 Wed, Mar 20 2024, 11:30 pm View last post
Chambray kid outlet Monsey
by amother
4 Sun, Mar 17 2024, 8:06 pm View last post
Mitzvah Note for a VERY challenging kid
by amother
43 Thu, Mar 07 2024, 12:25 pm View last post
Keeping one kid out & Allowing one kid in.
by amother
14 Sun, Mar 03 2024, 10:19 pm View last post