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HS Girl Clothing Shopping
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amother
Narcissus


 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 5:51 pm
amother OP wrote:
I am speechless.

I keep trying to organize my thoughts but they are a blindsided, jumbled mess.

What would my “letter to the editor” even say?

Teen girl clothing shopping has gotten completely out of hand. I am a long-time member here, joined when my oldest teen was just a baby! I have seen the rant evolution and every time I think it’s all going to be ok. Someone will put an end to this madness. But it just keeps getting worse.

There is a big problem with the frum clothing shopping in our American communities, especially for girls, and it needs to stop. The prices are insanely high; the girls expect new things every season. If your temimusdik/tomboy/yehupitz daughter is the exception then good for you.

But for the rest of us…

Yes, I want my daughters to be happy and comfortable BUT I also want them to understand that this kind of spending is just not normal!!! $190 for a dress? $79 for a skirt? $112 for shoes? $60 for a top? Does this make sense?!?

How?

Any ideas?

Thank you all for “listening.”

This has been bubbling beneath the surface for a long time and it feels good to unload.

I want to be a part of a sustainable solution.


If you live in Brooklyn or Lakewood- Clover is a great store!! They sell the clothing of last year, which makes it wayyyy more affordable
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amother
Jade


 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 6:06 pm
amother Hyssop wrote:
I only read the OP, and skimmed the rest of the posts, so forgive me if I'm repetitive.
A few things:
1) Today, it's expected that you'll wear clothing that are "in" and "trendy" (if you're a teen or twentysomething), so the idea that you "build" a wardrobe, as I did in my late teens/early twenties doesn't work anymore. This is a terrible shame. At that time, I would buy carefully chosen "pieces" that made up a capsule wardrobe that I wore for years and years, and I would buy one or two small things each season to keep things updated or freshen up an outfit.
2)The idea of having a signature "look" is also out. I look good in tailored clothing in neutral colors, so that's what I buy, keep, and wear. Nowadays everyone has to wear whatever the influencers are showing, regardless how hideous it looks on you.
3) Shopping and grooming have become THE activity of choice for girls and young women. Why? Nearly everything else has been banned/made off limits.
It makes me sick. And then the same girls who have to have three or four $200 outfits per season, and shoes to match, sigh about how they want to marry a long term learner and they're willing to sacrifice for Torah. Let's see how long that lasts when they realize the YT shopping budget is, um, zero?

I don't know how realistic the bolded is for most people. I changed sizes quite a bit between my late teens and early/mid 20s, certainly by my upper 20s. No way did I fit into stuff I wore at 17 or 18 just a few years later. It's not even that I gained that much weight, I just developed more. No, not from pregnancy (I was single throughout my 20s), but a lot of girls are still developing at that age. And of course, pregnancy can also be a big factor in body changes after one's teens.

BTW, who said shopping has suddenly become the activity of choice? If you grew up in the 90s like I did, you know that most people's motzei shabbos or sunday afternoon activity was shopping at the mall. There wasn't much else to do, no internet in those days, no TV was acceptable (not like nowadays when most frum people except for a few of the frummest stream stuff or watch online), teens didn't go out to eat much unless they were with their families, there were fewer clubs or extracurricular stuff available, etc. Even if you didn't buy, you browsed and window shopped. You could make a whole afternoon of it, testing out samples in Bath and Body Works and make up samples at department store counters.

(Also, most of the girls that want truly long term learners (not short term or a guy "with a plan") these days either come from wealthier backgrounds or are the very frugal type who'd never dream of spending that kind of money on clothing. )
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amother
Feverfew


 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 6:19 pm
amother Jade wrote:
I don't know how realistic the bolded is for most people. I changed sizes quite a bit between my late teens and early/mid 20s, certainly by my upper 20s. No way did I fit into stuff I wore at 17 or 18 just a few years later. It's not even that I gained that much weight, I just developed more. No, not from pregnancy (I was single throughout my 20s), but a lot of girls are still developing at that age. And of course, pregnancy can also be a big factor in body changes after one's teens.

BTW, who said shopping has suddenly become the activity of choice? If you grew up in the 90s like I did, you know that most people's motzei shabbos or sunday afternoon activity was shopping at the mall. There wasn't much else to do, no internet in those days, no TV was acceptable (not like nowadays when most frum people except for a few of the frummest stream stuff or watch online), teens didn't go out to eat much unless they were with their families, there were fewer clubs or extracurricular stuff available, etc. Even if you didn't buy, you browsed and window shopped. You could make a whole afternoon of it, testing out samples in Bath and Body Works and make up samples at department store counters.

(Also, most of the girls that want truly long term learners (not short term or a guy "with a plan") these days either come from wealthier backgrounds or are the very frugal type who'd never dream of spending that kind of money on clothing. )


My husband was not a learner. He went to law school. We’re married ten years and I cannot afford to pay these prices for myself and all my kids. I’m glad I know how to budget etc and how to be happy with what I have instead of always needing designer
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amother
Goldenrod


 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 6:39 pm
I don't have teens yet,

But this definitely is not a new thing. I'm 35 & growing up the adults would rant exactly as you did in your op. Shopping was the Sunday activity of choice. Shoes started at $60, shabbos dresses were in the $100's.

What I'm always surprised on this site is the quantities that people buy. Why does a girl need 3 new shabbos dresses?
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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 6:45 pm
amother Goldenrod wrote:
I don't have teens yet,

But this definitely is not a new thing. I'm 35 & growing up the adults would rant exactly as you did in your op. Shopping was the Sunday activity of choice. Shoes started at $60, shabbos dresses were in the $100's.

What I'm always surprised on this site is the quantities that people buy. Why does a girl need 3 new shabbos dresses?


No it is different. I am in my older 30s and

1. We shopped with our own money.
2. We did not fill our wardrobe with $200+ dresses, maybe in the $100 range?
3. If we did buy those dresses, they were gems from Neiman’s that we’d wear happily for at least a few years. Not a single season. Or they were “simchawear,” or from very obviously splurgey stores like Brenda’s.
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amother
Goldenrod


 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 8:40 pm
amother OP wrote:
No it is different. I am in my older 30s and

1. We shopped with our own money.
2. We did not fill our wardrobe with $200+ dresses, maybe in the $100 range?
3. If we did buy those dresses, they were gems from Neiman’s that we’d wear happily for at least a few years. Not a single season. Or they were “simchawear,” or from very obviously splurgey stores like Brenda’s.


I guess we grew up differently. We did wear things for as many seasons as it fit/ held up as I still do now.

By $100's I meant over $100, under $200.
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synthy




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 9:07 pm
$100 in 1990 is like $230 today.
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amother
Teal


 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 9:15 pm
I have 2 hs girls bh and I took them shopping with cash. I told them this is what we have to spend for before pesach. They were very aware of the spending and the dwindling money and chose not to buy the $340 dress knowing it’ll go on sale after pesach before Shavuos. But one really loved a $150 skirt and knows she’ll be wearing it a lot with diff type of tops to make it look different. Shopping with cash really worked out well and will iyh only be shopping like this for now on. It really showed my girls when to spend more on an item and when not to. The prices in many many stores were ridiculous! Zara had a few stuff but honestly the Jewish stores have the most tznius don’t need alterations clothing. I didn’t check jcrew they usually have stuff.
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amother
Feverfew


 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 10:12 pm
amother OP wrote:
No it is different. I am in my older 30s and

1. We shopped with our own money.
2. We did not fill our wardrobe with $200+ dresses, maybe in the $100 range?
3. If we did buy those dresses, they were gems from Neiman’s that we’d wear happily for at least a few years. Not a single season. Or they were “simchawear,” or from very obviously splurgey stores like Brenda’s.


I grew up more similar to you. We got one or two new outfits and if we wanted a more expensive one we paid for it ourselves but I usually didn’t. Luckily the pressure was way way less in those days. No one had Gucci anything and no one wore $200 shoes, rarely even $100 shoes. Juicy couture was in 😂 and maybe a Pink sweatshirt lol

There was definitely still peer pressure but not like today. Literally no one wore $500 coats.
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MindOverMatter




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 10:49 pm
amother Lemonlime wrote:
Little neshamala, we definitely don’t buy name brands. We are not talking about that here at all. We go to regular women’s/teens frum clothing stores. The prices are just very high.
One of my daughters asked to look on the shein website. Honestly as soon as the homepage downloaded I felt sick that she saw the images that appeared. And that’s with a filter! I know you can save a lot of money but there is another price to pay for that. We did make one shein order last year but all the necklines were too wide and the tops were too form fitting- even for my daughter who is a size 0! Everything went back and we decided to shop in stores that sell tznius clothing. Definitely not name brands.

I was the type who used to buy clothing for my kids at Walmart and Target. Sometimes I found discounted previous seasons sales. I can’t do that to my kids anymore. Fitting in socially is extremely important. Sure we might find a random top or sweater at target but in general it’s not what the girls are wearing. Being socially accepted for a teen is extremely important. No one has to buy 10 shabbos dresses for their daughter but at least 3 is something they deserve.
If we were living alone on a deserted island it really wouldn’t matter what they wore but we are BH part of a thriving frum community that has its norms.


Yes! This!
When I look around at what the secular kids are wearing (we live OOT, so we see a lot) how teenage girls are dressing, I want to cry or yell or both.

That my girls Want to dress like a tzinua, that they feel proud of what they are wearing, that they feel "with it" and lovely . . . It's such bracha. When I see them, each of them a true bas melech . . . I feel so blessed. so, I say yes, and buy the ridiculously priced wardrobe. The act of spending so much money, you're right, it's not good chinuch. BUT the act of showing them that I'm proud of who they are becoming, as frum young women, making proper choices about what they should be wearing (That remaining a tzinuah is worth A Lot) . . B"H. And I believe that's good chinuch as well.

I Never thought that I would condone these kinds of purchases, and I certainly think something is very wrong with pricing things so high, but I"m doing it, and on some level, feel incredibly grateful

(Btw, my girls have limits. If anything falls outside of those limits, they can choose to pay the difference or to let it go. If they want something that they already have enough of, it's up to them, but it's with their own money)
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giftedmom




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Mar 28 2023, 11:36 pm
little neshamala wrote:
We BH can afford to buy these clothes, and we davka dont.
Ive trained my kids (yes, teens too) from a young age that we dont wear obviously brand name clothing in order not to cause pain to those who cant afford it. (Can you tell I grew up very poor and hurting terribly in a class of spendy girls?) I will buy my kids brand name clothes for quality, but only if there is no obvious logo or name on it.
My kids are growing up with an inner confidence and self worth, and every so often this comes up-even with non brand name items, but just super expensive ones from frum stores, and I simply explain the situation to them.
"We can afford it, but this is pure waste. I can not condone such money wasting when there are so many people in our community who cant pay their electricity bills. We will not be shopping in these stores . Zehu."
We live in monsey ny, and my kids like looking good, but they get what im saying, and theyre happy. These stores are just not an option for us, on principle. We've gotten lucky on shein (order a humongous $900 order, and send about 2/3 of it back, still came out with loads of outfits that look very nice). Or we shop end of season sales, amazon prime, H&M, zara....
We buy cute hair accessories and jewelry, and dont even spend much. And they all look great BH.

My other (main) reason for doing this is to give my children the tools they will need later in their adult lives
, to be able to spend within their means and not feel the pressure to do what everyone else does. If I let them spend outrageous money on clothes "they have to have", what will train them to have the strength not to make the upsherin they cant afford, not to buy their kids clothes they cant afford, not to make a bar mitzvah they cant afford, not to lease a car they cant afford, not to buy a house they cant afford?
Tell me why is it that this generation has so many young couples with massive credit card debt??
Why is the organization Mesila, and other financial advisors, FULL of young couples who are drowning in debt with crazy spending habits?
Its very scary.
We need to teach our children when theyre young, by example-and honestly, pesach clothing shopping is a perfect opportunity.

I personally prefer to give my money to other Jewish families who are trying to make Pesach rather than woke corporations. I don’t view it as a waste at all.
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amother
Puce


 

Post Wed, Mar 29 2023, 12:52 am
My girls usually find 2 or 3 things each from frum stores, with nothing being over 120-130. After that, we order a ton of dresses, skirts and ribbed shirts on SheIn and we always do very well. For shoes, they order a few pairs from Amazon, SheIn, DSW or Zara to see what they like and what's good quality and then return the rest. One daughter just got two pairs from SheIn and decided to keep one, but after showing her someone's comment, she said "what I learned from this is that flats are in" and then went and ordered three gorgeous $15 pairs of ballet flats on Amazon. 😂😂. We will see which ones fit and look good. The others will be returned.
My girls know we have a budget (which somehow goes up drastically every year😂) and stick to it, and they always end up looking gorgeous.
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amother
Pistachio


 

Post Wed, Mar 29 2023, 1:31 am
Thanks for this thread! Now my girls are getting new clothes for Yom Tov. I initially felt uncomfortable spending anything, but after reading through this I decided that $80 per girl was quite reasonable. We got things for $15-$20 (clearance from Kidichic or Udel) and for $300 all of my girls will have something new for Pesach.
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amother
Goldenrod


 

Post Wed, Mar 29 2023, 9:54 am
giftedmom wrote:
I personally prefer to give my money to other Jewish families who are trying to make Pesach rather than woke corporations. I don’t view it as a waste at all.


This. It took me years to learn.
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Chayalle




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 29 2023, 10:48 am
amother Jade wrote:
(Also, most of the girls that want truly long term learners (not short term or a guy "with a plan") these days either come from wealthier backgrounds or are the very frugal type who'd never dream of spending that kind of money on clothing. )


Actually, my daughters' more yeshivish friends - the ones that want long-term learners - are the ones who spend more $$$ on clothes in the frum stores (and want Michelle watches). I think this is because a) they are more conformist, you have to wear a certain look to be in the box and b) they have limited online access, so no Shein, etc..... They think it's perfectly normal to spend $200-300 on a dress or outfit. However, they do have a limited-quantity wardrobe, and might get something classic and wear it for a while....
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Chayalle




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Mar 29 2023, 10:48 am
amother Pistachio wrote:
Thanks for this thread! Now my girls are getting new clothes for Yom Tov. I initially felt uncomfortable spending anything, but after reading through this I decided that $80 per girl was quite reasonable. We got things for $15-$20 (clearance from Kidichic or Udel) and for $300 all of my girls will have something new for Pesach.


my girls are perfectly happy to buy in Udele. I'm not sure why someone wrote that it's B'dieved. They have a very nice selection (if you go early enough to get your sizes!)
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