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Kids who don’t take no for an answer
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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 2:40 pm
DD 8 doesn’t take no for an answer. She will always pester nonstop and try to change my mind.
Also, in a similar vain, if she wants a specific thing at a specific time and I explain why a different thing or a different time is better she’ll ask me again and again. It’s like she didn’t hear what I just said.
Almost like she just wants me to repeat it again. She sometimes even claims that she forgot what I said.
If she’d be older I’d worry if she has some kind of anxiety or OCD but I know you’re not supposed to label or diagnose this young.
Anyone have a clue what I mean and can advise? She’s not my first and I don’t think it’s regular behavior. It might be normal with toddlers but not with this age. It gets exhausting to have to repeat things like a broken record every day.
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amother
Moccasin


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 2:48 pm
I have a kid like this. I am very firm. I say I said no and I won't be discussing this further. I then ignore it as if I can't hear.
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amother
Valerian


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 2:56 pm
Oy my husband is like this! And his mom!
Pls teach her when young
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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 2:58 pm
amother Valerian wrote:
Oy my husband is like this! And his mom!
Pls teach her when young

I know some older people like this and they are annoying as ever. Do they have some kind of diagnosis or are just pests?
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amother
Dustypink


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 3:00 pm
amother OP wrote:
DD 8 doesn’t take no for an answer. She will always pester nonstop and try to change my mind.
Also, in a similar vain, if she wants a specific thing at a specific time and I explain why a different thing or a different time is better she’ll ask me again and again. It’s like she didn’t hear what I just said.
Almost like she just wants me to repeat it again. She sometimes even claims that she forgot what I said.
If she’d be older I’d worry if she has some kind of anxiety or OCD but I know you’re not supposed to label or diagnose this young.
Anyone have a clue what I mean and can advise? She’s not my first and I don’t think it’s regular behavior. It might be normal with toddlers but not with this age. It gets exhausting to have to repeat things like a broken record every day.


Please stop explaining to her. When she wants something, reason will not work, because her wants are not logical, they are emotional. Just tell her firmly no. Don't give reasons, she sees it as excuses and weakness....

'Chana, mommy said no'
'I know you want, but I said no'
'you can go out and jump rope now, or play with Esty, because mommy said no'
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amother
Valerian


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 3:00 pm
amother OP wrote:
I know some older people like this and they are annoying as ever. Do they have some kind of diagnosis or are just pests?
I don't know? They're both quite Impulsive, possibly adhd?
But she raised her kids to never say no to them so I think they weren't brought up too..
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amother
Dustypink


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 3:05 pm
amother OP wrote:
I know some older people like this and they are annoying as ever. Do they have some kind of diagnosis or are just pests?


They just need firm boundaries. She needs a straight no, once you start explaining, it's as if you're already in the middle of changing your mind, so she wil continue until you give up. Or she might do the thing, and then you won't have any power, because she did it already. Look upthread.

Please don't refer to people as pests. They need more patience and very clear cut rules. But the good news is that you as her mother can give her that.


Does she listen when it comes to non-negotioables, like kosher or tzniu boundaries? Think about how you tell her when she tries to eat milchig after fleishig. Do you also explain or just keep it simple?
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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 3:24 pm
Thank you Dustypink. I agree that your method would work but I thought that it’s kinder to give an explanation. That’s why I’m doing it. I usually try to explain to my kids why I say no. With this one it doesn’t work but I’d hate to be curt with her.
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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 3:27 pm
amother Dustypink wrote:
They just need firm boundaries. She needs a straight no, once you start explaining, it's as if you're already in the middle of changing your mind, so she wil continue until you give up. Or she might do the thing, and then you won't have any power, because she did it already. Look upthread.

Please don't refer to people as pests. They need more patience and very clear cut rules. But the good news is that you as her mother can give her that.


Does she listen when it comes to non-negotioables, like kosher or tzniu boundaries? Think about how you tell her when she tries to eat milchig after fleishig. Do you also explain or just keep it simple?

The thing is that my explaining comes from being patient. You’re saying I shouldn’t explain. That’s a bit nasty and impatient. It would work but I’m not looking for something just to “work” if I hurt her in the process.
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amother
Wandflower


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 3:42 pm
You can make a rule "ask twice and then stop". And then enforce it like any other rule or boundary.

But yeah, 8 is definitely not too young for anxiety. Even OCD, especially if family history.
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amother
Ruby


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 3:49 pm
its possible you are onto something with the anxiety. I've had kids that struggled with 'no' as well. the book 'how to listen so kids can talk,and how to talk so kids will listen' had a lot of helpful tools that helped me navigate that stage. it's really really important for your child to learn to accept a no. it'll only get worse if you don't stick to your no's now when they get older and their manipulation gets way worse. the book helped me have clarity when I should stick to my no's, a good way to negotiate (repeat what she wants out loud validates it and then somehow they listen 'I see you really want to go to your friend right now' etc.)
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amother
Dustypink


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 4:20 pm
amother OP wrote:
Thank you Dustypink. I agree that your method would work but I thought that it’s kinder to give an explanation. That’s why I’m doing it. I usually try to explain to my kids why I say no. With this one it doesn’t work but I’d hate to be curt with her.


Here is my short answer after a long one I deleted before I sent it, because I was too rude to you. I am very passionate about this topic.

When you explain, you in fact, make her more insecure. That can cause anxiety in this type of children. When you are firm, she sees you as a backbone and as a strength and it will heal her and be calming.

Shlomo haMelech says to teach each child in their ways. This is her way.

Please try for a week to do this:
1.Don't explain, look at my example upthread
2. if she doesn't listen, give her a consequence, not a punishment(!), that is small and has to do with what she did wrong.
and example of that would be that she takes an apple after you said no, so you take it away from her or make her throw it out/save it for another time while you say "mommy told you not to take" and you don't continue the sentence where you usually would tell her "because we are having dinner and you won't be hungry if you eat all the apples now a half hour before dinner, and then you will be hungry when you're in bed and I will not give you food, because you didn't listen to mommy and.... rant continues..... "

You just stop."Mommy said no"
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Aronov




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 4:23 pm
I would highly recommend the book "123 magic".
Look into it, it's a world changer.
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amother
Dustypink


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 4:28 pm
Please tell me if you see any changes after a week.
I'd love to discuss this more.

you might think that you are hurting her in the process', but this method is what really makes some kids thrive.
As for diagnosis, I know that some neurodivergent people need this approach. Don't stress it and don't fret, I'm sure that she will solve problems in a different way than the rest of you because of her unique way of thinking. She will add a lot of good perspective.
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amother
Moccasin


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 4:34 pm
amother OP wrote:
The thing is that my explaining comes from being patient. You’re saying I shouldn’t explain. That’s a bit nasty and impatient. It would work but I’m not looking for something just to “work” if I hurt her in the process.


That's fine if it's your priority but you are also giving her the message that you are open to her driving you crazy about your answer. So then you need to accept this is part of your parenting and that's part of it. I'm not so sure there is anything wrong with her at all. Kids that feel the parent is open to hearing why they should change their answer will just keep pushing that boundary. You can either put your foot down or just keep the pattern in which you aren't firm with your no and she keeps challenging you.
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amother
Valerian


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 4:37 pm
amother Dustypink wrote:
Please tell me if you ......
I'm sure that she will solve problems in a different way than the rest of you because of her unique way of thinking. She will add a lot of good perspective.

Since my inlaws are like this I'm interested what are the benefits?
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amother
White


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 4:41 pm
Dusty pink I think I need to start a thread about my four year old kid.
What’s interesting is that I definitely talk too much. It’s just how I am. It would be work to talk less and this particular daughter needs more boundaries than the other ones did (I know because whatever I do naturally isn’t working) and I need to consciously set boundaries. I need to talk less. I have no clue how to set a consequence my other daughters at four didn’t really need a consequence whereas she is constantly “misbehaving”- slapping the other kids, making huge mess, telling me “no”….
My sense is that my parenting needs to change.
All in all to say I like your post!
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amother
White


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 4:42 pm
amother Dustypink wrote:
Please tell me if you see any changes after a week.
I'd love to discuss this more.

you might think that you are hurting her in the process', but this method is what really makes some kids thrive.
As for diagnosis, I know that some neurodivergent people need this approach. Don't stress it and don't fret, I'm sure that she will solve problems in a different way than the rest of you because of her unique way of thinking. She will add a lot of good perspective.

I definitely wonder if my four year old is neurodiverse somehow. Does every parent wonder that with their most challenging child?
The other one that pushed my buttons probably has ADHD although I don’t think it’s connected.
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amother
Strawberry


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 4:49 pm
It is a form of anxiety and it's part of regulating emotions. This is common for kids who need help learning how to regulate.
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amother
Moonstone


 

Post Tue, Dec 05 2023, 5:01 pm
In what way does the child ask again? Is it literally word for word? Or is it arguing against your no with reasons why you should change your mind?

If it’s arguing with reasons then I would discuss it until they understand my reasoning or I am convinced that it is more important than I originally thought.

If it’s just word for word again and again I would repeat my no again and again and then distract them.
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