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Does marrying a Learning Boy lead to a more Toradik home?



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amother


 

Post Sun, Aug 31 2008, 2:49 pm
Those of us that are married 20+ years, and see the before and after lives of friends and acquaintances that married Kollel boys (besides boys who chose to go into Chinuch or Kiruv, bec. those automatically have more Toradik homes) and those that marry non-Kollel boys, is there a disctinct difference in the Torah atmosphere of their homes?
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Chocoholic




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Aug 31 2008, 3:04 pm
I think it depends of the guy, rather than his profession.
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e1234




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Sep 01 2008, 2:28 am
it really depends on why they are learning and what there they really want in their life.
Unfortunately, in todays day there are many learning just for the shidduch... not sure if that will really continue into the home..
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Sep 01 2008, 10:13 pm
amother wrote:
(besides boys who chose to go into Chinuch or Kiruv, bec. those automatically have more Toradik homes)


I don't agree with this statement. I think the torahdik quality of the home stems from what a man does within his home. obviously his outside activities affect the atmosphere, but a man being in chinuch or kiruv does not automatically make his home any more torahdik than that of a plain but holy accountant.
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shnitzel




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Sep 01 2008, 10:22 pm
Maybe their homes are more torahdik not b/c of their job but b/c of the type of boy who is going to do a job like that. I am newly married and now DH is working in chinuch, kiruv and for a shul and the qualities that make him want to do that are what I (hope) will bring torah into the home. He didn't just happen to end up in these positions - no one does jobs like these (or kollel for that matter) for the money.
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apple24




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Sep 01 2008, 10:31 pm
"besides boys who chose to go into Chinuch or Kiruv, bec. those automatically have more Toradik homes"

My husband is now in Chinuch/Kiruv and we bth feel that our home was more "Torahdik" when he was learning full time. In the Kiruv world, your husband gets exposed to VERY untzniusdik women and cultures on a dail basis... plus yur kids are classmates with non-frum kids, who can also have an influence on your children....
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octopus




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Sep 01 2008, 10:37 pm
the atmosphere in the home is created by the parents. If the kids hear the parents ONLY talk about clothes, cars, and every gadget under the sun, then they have created a very materialistic environment. It doesn't matter what the parent's do (or don't do).

If the kids see the father open up a sefer (regardless of learning full time or working), they automatically see what is important.

A learning boy does not guarantee a more torahdik home. In theory, it should, I suppose. Unfortunately it is not the case. There are learning people out there that are very "into" some very materialistic things. And there are working people that are "into" very materialistic things. I really think it depends what is truly valued in the home.
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Ruchel




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Sep 02 2008, 5:56 am
Quote:
their homes are more torahdik not b/c of their job but b/c of the type of boy who is going to do a job like that.


Yes.
Kiruv, rabbi, car repair... the house will be torahdik depending on the personality.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Sep 03 2008, 1:23 am
shnitzel wrote:
- no one does jobs like these (or kollel for that matter) for the money.
This ought to have an opinion poll- with choices of true or false.

Are there people that go to Kollel for the money? I think not for the money that Kollel doles out, but very definitely yes some stay in Learning for the very generous financial arrangements offered by fathers in law.
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shnitzel




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Sep 03 2008, 1:28 am
My experience is with chinuch and kiruv and those don't often have rich f-I-l's backing them as important to klal yisrael as they are. I agree with kollel but if one is learning in kollel b/c its easy money from their f-I-l (not someone whose heart is really in it and happens to be from a wealthy background) then I don't think there home is likely to be more torahdik. My friends who are like that tend to be more focused on material things then torah things.
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Ruchel




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Sep 03 2008, 8:21 am
amother wrote:
shnitzel wrote:
- no one does jobs like these (or kollel for that matter) for the money.
This ought to have an opinion poll- with choices of true or false.

Are there people that go to Kollel for the money? I think not for the money that Kollel doles out, but very definitely yes some stay in Learning for the very generous financial arrangements offered by fathers in law.


or to just not work!
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queen




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Sep 03 2008, 1:38 pm
all depends on kind of people husband and wife are, and what they want.
You have it both ways- kollel couples totally not living in a toradik'a fashion... and the working folk that have homes that are exemplary and role models for others.
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gonewiththewind




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Sep 07 2008, 1:16 am
amother wrote:
shnitzel wrote:
- no one does jobs like these (or kollel for that matter) for the money.
This ought to have an opinion poll- with choices of true or false.

Are there people that go to Kollel for the money? I think not for the money that Kollel doles out, but very definitely yes some stay in Learning for the very generous financial arrangements offered by fathers in law.


That's so sweet to assume the worst of people.
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amother


 

Post Sun, Sep 07 2008, 1:42 am
It all depends upon whether the person thinks he is so torahdik that he almost believes he is a god. Now that'll shove God right out of any home whether or not there is an atmosphere.
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gonewiththewind




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Sep 07 2008, 1:46 am
amother wrote:
It all depends upon whether the person thinks he is so torahdik that he almost believes he is a god. Now that'll shove God right out of any home whether or not there is an atmosphere.

If you marry someone who thinks he is g-d you will have a heck of a lot of problems over and above not having a torahdik home. Hashem hates baalei gaavah and so do most people also.
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mummiedearest




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Sep 07 2008, 2:55 am
I think also that the yeshivas these days do not emphasize enough the importance of bein adam l'chaveiro, rather talmud torah knegged kulam. I have seen bachurim who would not come home for shabbos at their mother's request (for a valid reason beyond "I miss you") because learning seder was more important than kibud em. these were serious learners with good heads on their shoulders and the best of intentions-- they truly believed it best to ignore mom's request rather than have to learn sans chavrusa for one shabbos. I think that a bochur with such an attitude may not be the best to establish a torahdik atmosphere in the home, no matter what the intentions. because though he may learn beautifully in kollel all day, will he learn to help his wife/watch the kids/take out the garbage/occasionally compromise for the sake of the family?
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octopus




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Sep 07 2008, 8:40 am
I agree, mummiedearest.

There are a lot of factors to a toradik home besides torah learning. It is how the spouses interact with one another. You can be a really good learner with bad middos (I am not saying talmid chachom in this example. a talmid chachom is someone who ALSO has good middos besides knowing how to learn.).

So maybe if your tital read: Does marrying a talmid chochom lead to more toradik home? I would've said yes to that. Because talmidei chachamim (to earn the title) must have torah and good middos. And then I would be assuming the husband is really nice to he wife, and the whole atmosphere of the home is that of torah and being nice to eachother.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Nov 19 2008, 2:34 am
octopus wrote:
I agree, mummiedearest.

There are a lot of factors to a toradik home besides torah learning. It is how the spouses interact with one another. You can be a really good learner with bad middos (I am not saying talmid chachom in this example. a talmid chachom is someone who ALSO has good middos besides knowing how to learn.).

So maybe if your tital read: Does marrying a talmid chochom lead to more toradik home? I would've said yes to that. Because talmidei chachamim (to earn the title) must have torah and good middos. And then I would be assuming the husband is really nice to he wife, and the whole atmosphere of the home is that of torah and being nice to eachother.
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amother


 

Post Wed, Nov 19 2008, 2:40 am
sorry pressed submit before adding my response....


I AGREE 100000% WITH OCTOPUS....... my dh is exemplifies the type that is harif and a sharp learner but is domineering at home and is turning the children off to yiddishkeit!

He's not learning full time anymore, but does learn after shacharis. He always complains about the poor middot of the kehilla, so I suggested that they learn some mussar. "We do" he replied. I would not have known if I were base it on his behavior at home. He is Verbally abusive and blames his anger on me. embarrassed Sad
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Marion




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 19 2008, 2:54 am
Only if the learning translates to action. I can think of many (unfortunately) who are book wise but street (action) poor.
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