Using Sons Bar Mitzvah money to pay for his sefarim....

amother

Wed, Sep 10 2008, 1:16 am

I wish we would have clarified to him before the bar mitzvah that gifts/money received go to pay for the bar mitzvah. He even told us a story about his own Rebbe, that all money received went to his parents. Before hand I thought, that's not nice...now I totally understand them.

As far as the bas mitzvahs, we won't be doing the same type of event for her, she's not going to bring in that kind of money. It's not really fair. I wish I would have clarified more with him that the money will go to but sefarim.

And $100 for sefarim, that's not as bad as my $300!!

As for jobs, when do they find the time? When I hear about their schedule, I wonder when he will find time to wash his clothes!

shalhevet

Wed, Sep 10 2008, 2:27 am

MOE wrote:

my dh was able to invest his bar mitzvah money and from it he bought me my engagement ring his first car, and the down payment on our first home this is just food for thought.

lets say your son only ended up with 50 bucks from his bar mitzvah in gifts would you ask him to go out and get a job and pay for the difference so he can have his sforim for school....remember your the one sending him to hebrew school if you didn't he wouldnt need to use his bar mitzvah money to buy the sforim

Quote:

but you wouldnt send them to public school...the parents are the ones who choose to send their kids to yeshiva....send them away pay the high costs of tuition we choose it not them we send them on the path not them so why make them pay for their sforim....our job is to give them the tools so they can follow the path "we" put them on.....and working in yeshiva to pay for there day to day expensises like some candy is not the same as taking their money to buy sforim.

Your first post basically explains your views in your second. Since you may have less of a struggle for parnassa than other people, and your husband (at least) comes from a wealthy family, you are talking theoretically rather than practically. The OP is only considering this because she is having financial difficulties. For many people it is not a matter of choice or ideals, but simply necessity. It is very nice that you have the money to provide your children with everything they need, but not everyone does.

I would also disagree that parents 'choose' to send their sons to yeshiva. Would you argue that parents 'choose' to give their children food? Teaching Torah is a chiyuv (obligation), as is proper chinuch.

amother

Wed, Sep 10 2008, 11:22 am

Original OP here. If money wasn't such an issue here, of course I wouldn't even be considering it. But, money is very tight, and we have to fundraise just to pay the tuition.

As for bar mitzvah money we're not talking a lot. At least compared to others standards. I mean I consider it a lot, others would consider it bubkes. He has $1200 in the bank, and that's after buying himself an ipod. (Don't know how smart of an idea that was!) He was telling me some of his friends took in $6,000! Not, like this really matters. The point is he has money and we don't.

And again I want to do the right thing here. Maybe we can talk about having him help pay, at least for the sefarim he should/would want to keep for himself. I'll have to talk it out with him. I know he likes that amount in his bank account, and doesn't want to see it go down.

Motek

Thu, Sep 11 2008, 12:58 pm

amother wrote:

And again I want to do the right thing here. Maybe we can talk about having him help pay, at least for the sefarim he should/would want to keep for himself. I'll have to talk it out with him. I know he likes that amount in his bank account, and doesn't want to see it go down.

To talk about it after the fact, is bad timing, I'm afraid. It may not be worth the $100 you would like to have for the sefarim.

amother

Thu, Sep 11 2008, 1:47 pm

Yes after the fact is not the right time to be discussing it. Actually, the sefarim were well over $300. And now with him requesting some english translations to help outside of class it's reached over $400. We most likely won't be taking from him at this point. Just wish I would have made some expectations about that BM money with him at the time.

MOE

Thu, Sep 11 2008, 4:38 pm

if your going to send your kids to yeshivah you need to provide them with the tools.....he should be able to do with the money what he wishes he is not a source of income...maybe you should take the money to buy him food he needs that also.....that $1200 should not be sitting in an account it should be in some high intrest account locked in making money for him so knobody can touch it....what if he only made $50 for his bar mitzvah where would you get the money for his sforim now...

amother

Thu, Sep 11 2008, 4:55 pm

Same place...our credit card!

I don't want to make a big debate, one way or the other.
But, just so you know, he wouldn't have that money if it weren't for the fact that we gave him the dinner. (With a smile, but also by stretching our means.)We didn't give him the dinner to make money, and he didn't have it to collect the gifts. We gave him the dinner to celebrate with friends. Like I said, his own rebbe who's parents are famous/well respected and known worldwide, by the Lubavitch world did the same thing. Or so says his rebbe/teacher. Why did he share this with the boys?? I think there was a reason behind sharing it. That if your parents say we are giving you this celebration, but if your parents need the money/gifts to cover the costs.That's how it's going to be.

I don't neccessarily think it's wrong. I agree it would have to be discussed beforehand, not after the fact like we are doing now. I don't know if people who don't have these type of financial struggles can really get it.

So where exactly do we put this money? I know nothing of this sort of thing...because as maybe you can gather we don't have any savings! Suggestions?? And please don't recommend a financial advisor...they cost money right??

MOE

Thu, Sep 11 2008, 5:12 pm

can u buy them through your shule and get a tax recipt for them u can save some money on your taxes at least....go to your bank talk to them I would go with somthing safe and somthing that matures every couple of years depending on the economy you would re invest it somehwere else......I dont think in todays economy to may people have savings.... I guess also if your son is willing to buy an ipod he should be willing to buy a safer you can say somthing buy an ipod also buy this gemarah (the one he needs for school)

amother

Thu, Sep 11 2008, 5:29 pm

Thanks, we should speak to our bank. And with regards to the ipod, I completely agree. At some point...I did say to him that he should use some money to buy sefarim. The bar mitzvah wasn't that long ago...I just never followed through with that comment I had made to him. Now, we have all these sefarim we are paying for ourselves....without the money to do it....it's on the credit card, I'm not making him do anything at this point. I wouldn't make him anyways...I would discuss it with him. It's not like I want to do this... use his money. I'm happy he's in yeshiva, I'm happy he's learning...I'm happy to pay for costs. It's just when we are really really struggling here to cover the daily exspenses of a large family. And we have to fundraise to cover his tuition. It makes me think to consider it. Just like I said from the beginning, I'm just looking for some advice.

smily

Thu, Sep 11 2008, 5:34 pm

I just wonder who does the $ belong to? I mean al pi halach. Also there is no reason not to have a healthy disscusion on buying seforim for himself. You could incourage him to buy sets of what will be needed over the years etc. and it would be his. It is healthy for a child to have some responsability and help out. Alot depends on how he will feel. You don't want him to be resentful, and he could be proud of owning and using his seforim.

greenfire

Thu, Sep 11 2008, 5:50 pm

it suddenly occurred to me ... what are you going to do for next years sefarim when there is no bar mitzva monies ... what about girls do they pay for their high school sefarim in your family ... as you cannot treat them differently ...

oh and btw I have no monies and did not ask kids for their monies ... I try to supply needs (or get help with them) ... wants they have to find themselves ...

amother

Thu, Sep 11 2008, 11:44 pm

Actually my MIL was very good and put his money in cds or something like that. But, then again she wasn't trying to figure out how to come up with 10k in yeshiva tuition, plus flights, plus sefarim! And then the tution for all the other kiddos, and all the other living expenses a family of our size has!! While at the same time considered by the governments standards as living at poverty! Btw, I'm not complaining! Wink

Really I'm not, just trying to figure this all out. That's why I came here...to get others thoughts.

And just to be clear, I'm still not saying were going to use his money. At this point it's all just discussions...with you ladies!!

Next year?? Who knows, one day at a time right! G-d willing next year our mazel will be better, and money won't be so tight??!!

Aidelmom

Sat, Sep 13 2008, 2:05 pm

Motek wrote:

MOE wrote:

legally its the parents money since the kids a minor and a dependent of the parents....

she asked "al pi halacha"
I would guess that since he is a gadol, anything given to him is his

But could be that since he is somech al shulchan av'v it belongs to his father. I know that my father-in-law had to specifically be makne the ring to my husband in order for it to be definitly his for this reason. I'm not 100% sure though about the money.

Last edited by Aidelmom on Sat, Sep 13 2008, 4:04 pm; edited 1 time in total