Money and Self-Esteem

amother

Thu, Dec 22 2005, 1:55 am

There seems to be a large connection with money and self-esteem. I have experienced this phenomenon myself. Years ago when my family was struggling and we barely had to coins to scrape together, I felt ashamed of our situation and would avoid social gatherings (part of the avoidance was not having any money to socialize!). When things picked up (not talking about being rich, just being able to pay standard bills without worry), I felt I could hold my head higher and be part of community life again. Poverty is alive and kicking in the frum community. I see the difference in the postures of the haves and have-nots. I know that money is not the end-all be-all. However, I now realize that poverty has other effects besides not being able to pay bills. It takes a terrible toll on self-esteem. I am redoubling my efforts to give tzedaka and raise tzedaka for the poor in my community.

What do you all think about the correlation between money and mental health/well-being/self-esteem?

willow

Thu, Dec 22 2005, 5:10 am

I do not think that lack of money can influence good self-esteem. My husband and I are def in the red and we are very confident and happy ppl. We live in the smallest apartment that you have ever saw and all the time ppl say to us " you live there!???" or" when I was looking for an apartment I saw that I walked in and walked right out". But we smile and tell them that we love it. And we really do. We know we can't afford more and we try to make our little place a happy little beis hamikdosh. I think like anything in life its about attitude and trusting in H-shem.

hardwrknmom

Thu, Dec 22 2005, 12:33 pm

Amother thats beautiful. When a person struggles and then can step up on the field once again just barely, to give charity, its really nice. Because one knows the struggle. I personally think the community I live in is poor. There are a few rich people here and there. Besides that, housing, schools, and just buying day -to-day things are expensive.

I try not to look at money, just happy with what I have. When I look at my children and they're healthy bh bh that means all the money to me in the world Smile

Blossom

Thu, Dec 22 2005, 2:28 pm

Of course having money feels good but that doesn't necessarily empower or vice versa. Self esteem is from within. Something that you (or parents) give into yourself. People want to feel accepted for who they are not for what they have and that is only accomplished thru self esteem. So if someone who is poor tells themselves I have b''h many accomplishments. I am proud of myself, I have this and this going for me. I might not have money but have many other things and feel so good about myself and I thank Hashem for everything and ask him to further help me. That is called empowering oneself. You don't need the money for self esteem, you need the POSITIVE personality!!!!!!

amother

Thu, Dec 22 2005, 7:02 pm

What if your friends are always getting together for coffee or manicures and you have to make up excuses why you can't join, because you can't afford it? How about when everyone around you seems to be walking around in nice clothes and you feel like a shlump in your old worn-out coat? I am not talking from experience here but I see these things around me unfortunately and however idealistic people like to be such as "money can't buy happiness etc" , I agree with amother #1 and I think money does contribute to self-esteem especially here in North America. You say people want to feel accepted for what they are and not what they have, but the first thing people say when they meet someone new is: "what do you do?" (or "what does your husband do?" if you re a woman).

amother

Thu, Dec 22 2005, 7:20 pm

I grew up in a family that struggled most of the time for money. I never had nice, trendy clothes like my classmates and my parents never hid from us how much they struggled. Sure it effected my self esteem. I certainly did not feel like I could fit in with the other girls if I didn't have the "stuff" they had and it didnt help that my parents included us in their financial situation. When my husband and I first got married we lived in a realy rich community and I remember people asking me how much he made, I couldnt beleive the nerve!! Now B"H we are very comfortable, and it amazes me how people treat me so well. Not realy at first for who I am but because we have a "status" It makes me kind of sick sometimes.
I don't think money helps build self esteem, for me it actualy can work the other way sometime, making me think they are only treating me like this because I have money.

And another thing I know plenty of families (both friends and family) that find it very hard to stretch the paycheck til the end of the month but they don't let that consume them and their kids happen to have plenty of self esteem because they know that they have such great qualities, I dont think that the lack of "gelt" takes away from that at all.

Blossom

Thu, Dec 22 2005, 9:18 pm

To answer those particular questions of what excuses to give about not being able to afford what your other friends are affording.

First I wouldn't call it an excuse, I'd call it my reason. And I'd say it with pride. #1-We are actually saving up for a whatever whatever and although I can join you once in a while for coffee whatever I really set my priority on putting away money for that. or #2 DH and I think often about the future and we both like the idea of saving whatever we can.
You can give many reasons and they are the truth you are saving what you can.
I also think that you are so much into thinking that money makes you confident that you base your self esteem on that. Oh I'm accepted now b/c I have money.... Or vice versa. Feeling that you're accepted regarding your status or feeling that I'm somebody I have money is absolutely not considered self esteem b/c you are basing your good feeling about yourself on how others view you. Confidence is when you are happy with yourself from your own veiw. I feel accomplished. I did this and that and that's really impressive. I am so proud of myself for being this or doing that. It's all about YOU!!!

carrot

Thu, Dec 22 2005, 9:57 pm

I disagree that you can look just as good without money. Maybe you don't need to be a millionaire but you need money. If you want well-fitting clothes. If you want to have your shaitel done professionally, even occasionally. If you want to be able to buy good stockings and not worry when one rips. Every little thing costs money. Even the subway to get to the store, or shipping from an on-line store. Not to mention braces or electrolysis or even acne medication. Nothing is free.

Time Magazine or one of those magazines had a very famous picture of a girl in Afghanistan years ago. Recently they went back and found the same person, aged I don't know how many years. You look at the two pictures side by side and you cannot believe how worn down she looks. I bet you if she had money she would look fantastic.

In general I think the older you are the more money you need to look good. (What baby isn't cute no matter what they wear? Doesn't apply anymore once you're an adult.)

Also - when you really have no money you might be forced (out of desperation) to take a job that is humiliating.

So yes I agree self-esteem is affected by money.

He*Sings*To*Me

Thu, Dec 22 2005, 10:31 pm

Right now, my husband and I are struggling financially...he was a fourth generation business owner, and because of some bad financial advice and bad investing, we lost alot of money, and we really needed to sell...that could, in itself, be a novel. We sold to slightly larger company, whose owner and my father-in-law had known each other since boyhood. My husband negotiated the deal in such a way that ALL of our employees (some who'd been with the family for 20+ years) would go to work for the new owner. He wanted my dh to run the division of the company, more or less, is if he still owned it. Then......he hires a new company president and the climate of the entire operation changed. People who'd been there 12+ years start looking elsewhere for employment. He starts DEMANDING mandantory Shabbos meetings. He hassles my husband for taking off on Jewish Holidays. He orders pizza on staff birthdays, which is neither pas yisroel/cholov yisroel, and loaded with pepperoni, then drew attention to the fact that my husband was not eating...it was never ending.
Then, my mother-in-law passes away last Spring, and the guy NEVER whispers one word of condolence. He pops his head into my husband's office and asks to see him later. He bombards him with the fact his numbers were slipping! The chutzpah! Then, 40 days after my mother-in-law's death, my husband is informed that his position is being eliminated along with 3 other peoples' positions, as well...my husband had a 28% increase for the fiscal year in sales over the previous year's sales.
We have been without an earned income for half a year now...it is rough...we've had to go on W.I.C....no other assistance B"H....and, yes we do fret, but know G-D provides for us as long as my hubby diligently seeks for new employment
BUT WE FEEL SO HAPPY: our beautiful children are happy, we have heat, running water, a roof over our heads, good neighbors, our health for the most part...and, are better off than 3/4 of the rest of the world!
Yes, we keep the heat turned down low, and just wear warmer things to bed at night and lots of blankets. Yes, I have traded shopping at department stores for Target and Wal-Mart for myself.
I have learned that if you properly launder, then iron your clothing, and maintain good posture and SMILE...you can wear "discount" apparel in a fine way, and most will never know the difference!

zigi

Fri, Dec 23 2005, 12:45 pm

but what if you can't afford new clothing even at the cheap stores? what if you just had a baby and nothing fits?and don't have enough moeny to go to the laundromat or if you can't afford to have your sheitel done. and can't style it yourself? or if you don't have enough money for diapers or milk? money does make a differance for peace of mind life can get so much easier when you know that you have a few extra coins to rub together and its not the end of the world if dh bought something frivolous when you don't have enough money for milk.
I don't feel poor but I know that we have to struggle while my husband is in school. and that money from food will come from hashem when we need its true things work out.

He*Sings*To*Me

Fri, Dec 23 2005, 3:55 pm

What size(s) do you need, Zigi? I might be able to help you out as I have several size ranges of clothing, all tznius, of course. Every time I had a baby, I'd return to within 10 pounds of normal weight, but my abdomen is so flabby, I cannot fit into my old favorite denim skirts, Shabbos suits, etc. Rather than list them on eBay, I'd be happy to ship them to another Jewish mommy like yourself...we girls have to support one another, right? PM me about your sizes and style preferences...I'd realllllly like to help you out if I may, especially while you husband is learning!

Who else will/can come forward to help Zigi and anyone else?

amother

Sun, Dec 25 2005, 9:06 am

zigi, you made a really good point.. I think the point is that what happens when you can't even afford the basics?? What happens when a paycheck doesnt lzst till the end of the month?? Unfortunately I know many people in that kind of a situation.. We kvetch when we dont have money for extra things.. like new clothes for the kids at the GAP.. a sheitle wash ext.. while there are plenty of people (amongst us) who don't have money to buy diapers!!!
We are also struggling at the moment, Im working full time, and my DH is working from home ( a little here and there) and watching our baby..... I am so resentful of our situation that it is greatly impacting our marriage... Its been like this for a few months but all he says is Hashem will provide!!!! Yes, BH we have food on the table.. but its all because IM working!!!!!! What happens if I have another baby??/ How long can we go on lik this!!!!!

Tefila

Sun, Dec 25 2005, 9:13 am

Again I know it's easier said then done. But if we instill self confidance self and esteem into our children at a tender age. then money won't matter if one doesn't live up to the Joneses , since they will know their own self worth!!
I also find that acquiring material stuff can get addictive and we tend to lose focus on the ikar.
Rather if one has the money I would like to see it go to Tzedakah a lifelong investment.
That will not only help someone spiritually, but physically one feels like a million dollars! who cares if they don't have a custom sheital or the latest gadget on the market. To see a poor family smile because of what you helped them with, is worth more then all the material pleasures in this world!

shaina punim

Tue, Dec 27 2005, 4:34 pm

it defenitily effects self estem, at least mine, we dont have money a lot fo times to go food shopping or get nice things and my dh from time to time will get realy mad because we have bills comming up and we cant pay them, but always when I need something he gives me money or he will say not now in a few weeks u can go shopping or if he wants company over some how he comes up with the $ for nice food, now for chanukah we had two family chanukah parties that cost a lot of money and agan he gave me money for that, and my sister inlaw is getting married and my husband wants to make sheva brochas and I had to say yes because he wants it, I dont know where the money will come from but some how it does, and yes money does effect a marriage.some how when he wants to do something we have money but when bills come up or I want something he doesnt always have money,and I try to tell my dh that people who dont have money cant do take out or get a babysitter all the time, but he still wants to, so anyway at the end hashem gives.