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Do you live /lived in Israel? We are considering Aliya
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Move2Israel




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 03 2008, 4:32 pm
My Dh & I have broached the idea of making aliya recently and we are currently in research mode of the posibillity. We have a number of questions in random order that we would love answered by people who live in Israel before we make a pilot trip. A little about us: We are more of a modern style chabad family. My husband speaks fluent hebrew and I speak enough to get by but we are looking for more of a chabad / american community.
How much does a family of 4 need to earn to make a decent living?
How much do houses in such communities cost to buy? Rent?
What is the normal work day / week like?
What is the cost of kids going to school?
What is the cost for medical insurance?
What is considered a decent salary?
Is it hard to get a job?
Whats our options as far as communities to live in?
We saw in a post that Beitar has a large chabad community. I heard that there is a tzniyus board that one had to be approved by to live there is that true? Will we have issues with me wearing denim? What kind of rules do they have? More questions to come.
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Marion




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 03 2008, 4:47 pm
I can't answer ALL your questions, but here's my best shot at what I can.

1. What's your definition of "decent living". By American standards or Israeli?

3. "Normal" work week (government or private industry) is Sunday to Thursday. Teachers, retail (cashiers), postal clerks, and various other public industries frequently work a half day (until 1) on Fridays as well.

4. Cost of school depends on whether you send to public (includes public-religious) or private (like cheder/Talmud Torah, BY). Regardless, you're talking in hundreds of shekels, not thousands of dollars.

5. Basic health insurance is "free". As in, a "health tax" deduction is taken (0.5%?) off your payroll, and the government forwards x amount to your health insurer (kupat cholim). You MAY choose to "upgrade" your insurance. All kupot have family plans; usually once it's 2 adults and 2 kids it's the same no matter how many more kids there are. A level 1 upgrade is usually around 85 shekel a month (family); a level 2 upgrade might go up to 175.

6. What's your definition of "decent"? Minimum wage is just over 19 shekel an hour (about 3500 shekel a month). The average salary is just under 8000 shekel a month. MKs (Members of Knesset) make some absurd amount over 30,000 shekel a month. Most families need at least the equivalent of one "average" salary (or 2 minimum wage ones) to make ends meet. Depending on the size of the family, many need much more.

7. How hard it is to get a job depends on your field, your training, your language skills, and how willing you are to travel (commute) or do something outside your field "in the meantime".
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mandksima




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 03 2008, 4:59 pm
These are great questions. I can't answer all of them but I'll tell you what I can.

First of all, I see this is your first post, so WELCOME! Second, maybe you want to pick a different name now so you don't have to change it when you make aliyah? I'm not one to talk though as I'm still MandKsIma when I'm really MandKandGsIma now. I didn't realize when I joined how a name sticks with you and I hate it when posters change their screename after I've known thema while. It's like when your best friend Alice asks you to call her Susan. Anyway...

How much does a family of 4 need to earn to make a decent living? People live on 5000 to 10000 shekels a month. That's with no luxeries and it depends on your rent. More money is better but jobs don't pay the same as in Chul.

How much do houses in such communities cost to buy? Rent? This is too broad a question. Narrow down a community first. Awa from city centers are cheaper.

What is the normal work day / week like? Most people work Sundays and are off Fridays. My DH just got permission to work Friday from home and have off Sunday - that's great as the kids still have school and businesses are open so we have an entire day without the kids home to do stuff.

What is the cost of kids going to school? In maon, age baby to 3 or so, costs a bit. Usually only makes sense if you're working part time. Age 4-5 in gan is free near me and we pay maybe 500 shekels a year for fees. Regular school is free except for fees and uniforms and books. High school costs depending where they go. Talmud Torahs I don't know about, maybe someone else will answer. Do you want only Chabad schools?

What is the cost for medical insurance? We pay around 200 shekels a month for the top plan in Leumit, one of the 4 choices. We pay a percentage for medications and specialist visits. Nothing for regular doctor visits.

What is considered a decent salary? Wrote above. Depends what you're used to. Many can't get used to less than 20000 a month and sometimes both spouses must work to bring that in. Every occupation is different.

Is it hard to get a job? You really can't look until you get here and know where you'll be living. What field are you looking in? A rebbe - that's hard.

Whats our options as far as communities to live in? so many, look at the other thread that talked about it.

We saw in a post that Beitar has a large chabad community. I heard that there is a tzniyus board that one had to be approved by to live there is that true? Will we have issues with me wearing denim? What kind of rules do they have? PM MiriamNechama or Mamacita. There are some more ladies from there I think.

Now is the time to come as the world is being turned upside down. We are waiting for you.

Are you planning a pilot trip?
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Move2Israel




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 03 2008, 5:05 pm
Thank you for your reply, we would like to maintain our current standard of living. My husband works in grocery retail management, and has an overall good business sense. He currently earns a drop over $50K /year. We would have to afford me being able to come back to the states once a year to visit my family.
For schools we would be looking for a chabad school.
How much is the typical rent?
And what is the cost for ownership?
Thanks again for all the info you are able to provide
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Marion




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 04 2008, 1:47 am
1. First tip: no one will quote you an annual salary. $50K is roughly 16 000 shekel a month. That's a lot, unless he finds something in management. And that's gross, and doesn't include benefits (there are mandatory benefits for certain things in Israel) or deductions.

3. The only thing "typical" about rents is that they're going up. Everywhere. In the city is more expensive than out of the city. If I'm not mistaken, rents (and prices) are no longer quoted in dollars, so at least you know how much you're spending. Don't forget to add to the cost of rent the municipal tax ("arnona"), utilities (water, electric, gas), and RENTER'S INSURANCE (very important).

4. Again, we can't tell you the cost of ownership. We CAN tell you that one of the "rights" you'd have as an oleh is a preferential (mildly) rate on part of your mortgage. We can tell you that if you buy you have a tax discount on the purchase tax (normally up to 5%, for an oleh it's 0.5% - usually). Also that lawyer's fees and broker's fees (if you use them) range from 0.5%-2% of the price -- each. We can also tell you that you can NOT buy a house/apartment for 5% down. Try 40-50%. Most banks will not give you a mortgage for more than that. For ownership you also need to have an insurance policy (two actually) that names the mortgage bank as the SOLE beneficiary. One policy is a life insurance policy, the other is a property insurance (building) policy. If your DH doesn't find a job that gives him "tnaim socialim" (managers' insurance), you may want to take out a 2nd insurance policy that names your spouse as the beneficiary so the bank doesn't get everything.
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Tamiri




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 04 2008, 2:56 am
Move2Israel wrote:
My Dh & I have broached the idea of making aliya recently and we are currently in research mode of the posibillity. We have a number of questions in random order that we would love answered by people who live in Israel before we make a pilot trip. A little about us: We are more of a modern style chabad family. My husband speaks fluent hebrew and I speak enough to get by but we are looking for more of a chabad / american community.
How much does a family of 4 need to earn to make a decent living?
How much do houses in such communities cost to buy? Rent?
What is the normal work day / week like?
What is the cost of kids going to school?
What is the cost for medical insurance?
What is considered a decent salary?
Is it hard to get a job?
Whats our options as far as communities to live in?
We saw in a post that Beitar has a large chabad community. I heard that there is a tzniyus board that one had to be approved by to live there is that true? Will we have issues with me wearing denim? What kind of rules do they have? More questions to come.

*Wonderful that you are considering Israel, and even better that you already have language skills. That's a biggie.
*You ask about how much a family of 4 "needs" to make a decent living, which would include at least one ticket (let's say $1500/roughly 6000 nis) per year. You also quoted your current earning as $50k. You don't mention where you live on that amount, but I can't envision you are living "the high life" on that salary. Meaning, you are most likely a frugal family as it is, and not used to too many luxuries. If that is the case, I would say that a family of your size which nets 8000 nis/month would probably be fine. You would probably need to rent somewhere inexpensive (not the heart of Jerusalem, for example) and car ownership would probably strain the budget. If you got around without a car, you could probably even save some money on that income. For the ticket. You would eat simply, as people on a budget do, and not take fancy vacations. Would this be any different than your current living standard?
*A "normal" work week is generally 5 days. Most people have Friday and Shabbat off, but employees such as teachers, bank workers etc. get a different day off a week. Everyone (barring the rare exception) has Shabbat off. Friday is 1/2 day. Erev Yom Tov is 1/2 day. All holidays are paid. Chol HaMoed is usually a full work day, but there are places where there is no work, part day work etc. It depends on the employer.
*Kids going to school: I think semi-private places can charge a few hundred shekels (150-200 nis?) and private can go as high as 600 nis. Religious pay for thier kids' school from 7th grade and on. I pay 8100 nis/year for an 8th grader. However, if you live in a Chabad area with it's own school, it may be heavily subsidized. You would have to come here and check out the options. For my 4th grader in Religious Public School (government run) we pay a few hundred shekels/year for trips, activities etc. Oh, and books are not included in either government schools or private ones - parents have to supply those. There is a lively school-book resale industry here. For day care, I believe costs are in the 1700 nis range. For age 3 and 4, you can send the children to a city-run gan and the cost, if you don't live in a subsidized area, is around 800 nis/month. From age 5 it's free, mandatory schooling.
*Medical insurance comes off your salary, as Marion wrote. Each family pays according to income. No one is without basic insurance. No deductible. No co-pay when you see your primary doctor. Specialists are 13 nis per visit. Procedures such as x-ray, heart cardiogram etc., 25 nis. Meds are generally 12 nis per prescription. Things like having a baby or a pacemaker inserted don't cost anything.
*Is it hard to get a job? Only for the people who don't have one.

HTH
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Imaonwheels




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 04 2008, 3:04 am
The most American Chabad communities are Rechovot and Tzfas. Rechovot has a Canadian Rav, Rav Gluckowsky (but a Russian rebetzin who less understands Americans) and an active English speaking Nashei. They have all of the chinuch as well. There is also a significant Temeni community within the kehilla and a BT group around the yeshiva of R' Yitzchak Arad on the other side of town.

There are some things that will not be American style in any Israeli Chabad community. The type of chinuch is one of the most significant. The chinuch in Israel is built more on the Rebbe's direct horaos than any secular authority.

Tzfas is a very large community. The rav is the son of American shluchim. It is more out of the way but much cheaper. IT has even more mosdos to choose from. The kehilla is very active in mivtzoim and such as they have more or less taken responsibility for the entire north and Golan.

There are Anglo Lubavitchers in large numbers in Y-m but they are spread out over the city. If you are looking for "modern" type schools then Y-m is not for you.

Chinuch in Chabad is one of the cheapest of all of the religious options. I paid $15/mo girls HS. Yeshiva: regular around $150/mo and special about $250. Girls' dorm (7-8 grade) $180 and all boys yeshivot (katana or gedola) include dorm because there are no Chabad yeshivas that are not dorm only.
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 04 2008, 3:23 am
I think a take-home salary of NIS 7,500 a month (after daycare) would allow a family of four to rent a nice apartment in an English-speaking neighborhood, pay the bills, save NIS 500 a month towards a trip to America, and have a small bit to spare for the occasional date or other treat. It wouldn't allow you to live in a major city like Jerusalem or own a car, and you would probably have to choose between two bedrooms in the heart of an anglo area and three bedrooms within walking distance.

Since your husband is a manager (something people look for fairly often, if the classified ads are to be trusted) and speaks fluent Hebrew, he should be able to get a job that pays a decent salary. However, depending on his experience and whether or not he knows anyone in his field here, he might have to spend some time working his way up. I have a friend in retail who was offered a management position after about 18 months, and another who wasn't offered and ended up leaving. It really depends on the store.

It's impossible to say how much rent or home ownership would cost without a better idea where you want to live, since prices vary wildly based on location. The same 3-bedroom apartment could cost $250,000 in Jerusalem, $200,000 in Ramat Beit Shemesh, $150,000 in "regular" Beit Shemesh, $100,000 in Be'er Sheva, and less in small towns or in certain yishuvim, for example. In general anglo areas are more expensive.

It's hard to suggest a place to live without a bit more information. You say you're anglo, Chabad, and "modern style." What's most important to you? For example, Efrat is very anglo and "modern" but I don't think there are many Chabad families, while Beitar has Chabad (from what I hear) but the anglo population is smaller and the "modern" is not encouraged. If you had to choose between a relatively cheap Israeli Chabad community and a moderately-priced Anglo community with only a few Chabad families, what would you prefer?

Once you pick a community it will be easy to figure out prices.

Your work week will depend on profession. Managers often work long, irregular hours. Teachers and social workers have regular hours but usually not enough of them. Midwives have long shifts that change based on the week. Etc. As Tamiri said, Shabbat and chagim are off, chol hamoed is usually on (although in some place more lenient). People work 5-5.5 days a week.

What does your idea of "decent living" include? Car ownership? A private home (as opposed to apartment)? A "nice" neighborhood? Activities for the kids? The ability to eat out occasionally without worrying about price? A certain number of bedrooms and bathrooms in your apartment? If you give specifics, it'll be easier to say what kind of money you need to make.

And what kind of community do you picture yourself living in? Do you want a major city? A city with 30,000 to 100,000 people? A smaller city like Tzfat or Arad? A yishuv? Do you want an area where many people speak English (20% or more) or is it enough for you if there are several English-speaking families?
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mamacita




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 04 2008, 6:47 am
Hi! I'll try to answer what questions I can, I don't have too much to add since my lovely Israeli sisters have added a lot!

How much do houses in such communities cost to buy? Rent?
My rent is $600/mo for a 3br in Beitar. Prices are going up all over, so you have to keep an eye out and be up-to-date

What is the normal work day / week like?
When dh was working he worked Sun-Thurs, right up until erev YT, including Pesach (ack!), and took chol hamoed off which only counted against his vacation as half days each. Gan is from roughly 8am-1pm. Older kids depend on age, gender and school.

What is the cost of kids going to school?
I pay about 460shek/month for gan. Beyond that, I have no idea Smile

What is the cost for medical insurance?
to add to what others have said: for prescriptions I pay about 12shek to have them filled, and ultrasounds when I was pg was also very cheap (I forget, it's been awhile!)

Is it hard to get a job?
This depends on your personal situation. Hashem decides who has a hard time and who doesn't. We know people on both sides.

Whats our options as far as communities to live in?
Check out Nefesh B'Nefesh's community profiles. They are pretty thorough.
We saw in a post that Beitar has a large chabad community. I heard that there is a tzniyus board that one had to be approved by to live there is that true? Will we have issues with me wearing denim? What kind of rules do they have? More questions to come. There isn't a specific tznius board. There is (or isn't, it keeps changing) a vaad who reviews applications for potential residents. They are mostly concerned with people who have many visitors who would be openly mchalel shabbos or parade about untzniusly. If you have non-frum friends or family visit, just tell them not to parade, hehe. The application basically asks where you and dh were born, dh's yeshiva, your sem, name of rav, references, etc.

I have seen denim once or twice since I've lived here. I personally don't wear it, except for Purim when I break out my denim skirt to match dh's jeans. Not sure the the BY's have in their dresscode that mom's shouldn't wear denim like they do in other places, we're not in that parsha.
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HooRYou




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 04 2008, 7:12 am
Good Job Mamacita. you should mention that you are paying for private gan and tat the gans run by a school can be a little chaper. Also, prescriptions depend on what you are getting. Standard things like Acamoli (baby Tylenol) are 12, but I have payed a lot more for things that are not so standard (may none of you ever have usch needs).
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Imaonwheels




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 05 2008, 1:54 am
Except NBN profiles are one sided and if you belong to a different community than the poster you will not get an accurate picture. I lived in Rechovot for 10 years and I can tell by whats written what shul he davens in. The bulk of the frum community is not covered. I would try to get some potentials and then contact someone from that comkmunity. Us Israelis can help with that.
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mugsisme




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 09 2008, 12:33 pm
What about cars? My dh was very upset today when he saw that the tax on a new car is 100%. Do you need one to get around? Can you get by without one? Will it be a huge shock coming from a small community where you MUST have a car to get around? (We had a car even when we lived in NY.)

When you move, do you just sell off all your appliances and buy all new?

And what about Ulpan? How do you attend ulpan for 5 days a week/5 hours a day if you have a job? Do people not take a job in the beginning?

Finally, I sew/quilt/embroider. Do you think that is something I can do on the side to make money? I do have a commercial machine that I would want to bring with me. I am greatly concerned as we live in a 5 bedroom/3 bathroom house (just under 2000 sq ft), and realize that I will have to greatly down size. I have my own sewing room, and would dread having to give it up. (Although not enough not to come.) How big are houses in Israel? Are the house set apart, or are they like condos?
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Tamiri




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 09 2008, 12:43 pm
mugsisme wrote:
What about cars? My dh was very upset today when he saw that the tax on a new car is 100%. Do you need one to get around? Can you get by without one? Will it be a huge shock coming from a small community where you MUST have a car to get around? (We had a car even when we lived in NY.)
It depends on your income and ability to buy a car, maintain it, and fill it with gas. People do live without cars. You have to decide based on where you live and what I wrote.

mugsisme wrote:
When you move, do you just sell off all your appliances and buy all new?
Small appliances will run well on a good, strong transformer. Larger ones can be a problem. People usually either bring new appliances on a lift with them or buy new/used when they get here and they see where they are living. Homes here are small, so many times your American washer won't fit in the space allotted it in an Israeli apartment. Ditto fridge.[/quote]

mugsisme wrote:
And what about Ulpan? How do you attend ulpan for 5 days a week/5 hours a day if you have a job? Do people not take a job in the beginning?
Many don't work while they are at ulpan, and many work and don't do ulpan.

mugsisme wrote:
Finally, I sew/quilt/embroider. Do you think that is something I can do on the side to make money? I do have a commercial machine that I would want to bring with me. I am greatly concerned as we live in a 5 bedroom/3 bathroom house (just under 2000 sq ft), and realize that I will have to greatly down size. I have my own sewing room, and would dread having to give it up. (Although not enough not to come.) How big are houses in Israel? Are the house set apart, or are they like condos?
Most Israelis live in apartments around 800-1000 sq feet, and don't have sewing rooms. Unless it's, say, a 3 br apt and you only have 1-2 kids. That sort of thing. My parents have a 3 br and 3 children, and my mother had her sewing machine set up on the mirpesset, which is a balcony. Not the best set up, but it worked. If you lived in my Yishuv, you could find a home the size of the one you live in, but you would have to want to live out in the sticks. In general, single homes don't really exist in town except for the very wealthy (think mansions in NYC). There are row houses/town houses here and there but usually it's apt. dwelling. There are agricultural communities, Moshavim and Kibbutzim, where there are homes on land but it's not cheap and hard to find a good "fit" if you are observant.
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hila




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 09 2008, 12:49 pm
mugsisme wrote:
What about cars? My dh was very upset today when he saw that the tax on a new car is 100%. Do you need one to get around? Can you get by without one? Will it be a huge shock coming from a small community where you MUST have a car to get around? (We had a car even when we lived in NY.)

You CAn get by without one. You can also buy second hand. As an Oleh there was a tax break on new cars , I think there still is. The bus service in most places is excellent.

Quote:
When you move, do you just sell off all your appliances and buy all new?


The electricity here is 220v asoppose to 110v. Yu can run some things on transformers but we have not had good experience with that except for very small appliances. I would recommend you buy a fridge, wahser and dryer and stove here. Or get 220v Amercan appliances.
At least if you buy here the service contract is here . However there are people who specialise in servicing American appliances.
Quote:

And what about Ulpan? How do you attend ulpan for 5 days a week/5 hours a day if you have a job? Do people not take a job in the beginning?


You may have to factor in that you will need to invest time to learn the language. So maybe put off working for six months, or alternatively - learn a LOT before you come and learn Hebrew on teh job. The more you learn now the easier your aliya will be. Or you can be like some of teh olim here in Efrat who never learn hebrew well.
Quote:

Finally, I sew/quilt/embroider. Do you think that is something I can do on the side to make money? I do have a commercial machine that I would want to bring with me. I am greatly concerned as we live in a 5 bedroom/3 bathroom house (just under 2000 sq ft), and realize that I will have to greatly down size. I have my own sewing room, and would dread having to give it up. (Although not enough not to come.) How big are houses in Israel? Are the house set apart, or are they like condos?


Depends where you live. In my son's yishuv you can buy a large house for 100,000sh . However most people amy not want to be in Otniel.

And check if your machine will work 220v ?

Most israelis live in apartments in towns. Im the yishuvim they live in houses. Mine is attached on both sides and has small rooms . It was originally 100m (about 1000sq ft I think) and we added on a basement floor. We have about 150m now .
We also have a small garden.

there are much larger houses on our yishuv.

I guess it depends on how much you can get for your house what you can afford here.

I suggest you rent for the first year. Then decide where you want to be, unles you aready have a definite idea.
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catonmylap




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 09 2008, 12:53 pm
mugsisme wrote:
What about cars? My dh was very upset today when he saw that the tax on a new car is 100%. Do you need one to get around? Can you get by without one? Will it be a huge shock coming from a small community where you MUST have a car to get around? (We had a car even when we lived in NY.)

When you move, do you just sell off all your appliances and buy all new?

And what about Ulpan? How do you attend ulpan for 5 days a week/5 hours a day if you have a job? Do people not take a job in the beginning?

Finally, I sew/quilt/embroider. Do you think that is something I can do on the side to make money? I do have a commercial machine that I would want to bring with me. I am greatly concerned as we live in a 5 bedroom/3 bathroom house (just under 2000 sq ft), and realize that I will have to greatly down size. I have my own sewing room, and would dread having to give it up. (Although not enough not to come.) How big are houses in Israel? Are the house set apart, or are they like condos?


Car-you can buy a car with lessened taxes with you olim rights

appliances-you sell the ones you have, its easiest to sell them with the house. You can buy appliances for Israel there and have them shipped with your lift

ulpan-I made aliya as a single so I did ulpan. dh never did ulpan-he didn't need it. My sil is in ulpan now, but bil went straight to work so he is "learning on the job"

I think you could do something with the sewing.

Houses vary in size. The average home is an apartment here and much smaller, but there are larger homes as well that are American sized.
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Marion




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 09 2008, 3:19 pm
I never bothered with ulpan. You say you already have language skills...so find out if you really need ulpan.

My sewing machine is on a fold down table in the currently "spare" room that houses a lot of storage and my son's crib & nursing chair.

We have GROSS 140 square metres. And we have relatively large rooms, considering there are 4 bedrooms. We're in a townhouse, and not in any of the large cities. However we are also house poor, but that was a decision we made.

Cars are EXPENSIVE, and olim don't get the same tax breaks they used to. A lot of people only have cars because it's part of their employment package. Whether or not you NEED a car depends on where you live, and was a huge factor for us when we made that decision. If you do buy a car, know that they retain their value a lot better than in the U.S. Like they don't lose 50% of their value the minute you drive them off the lot. People here literally drive their cars into the ground before replacing them.
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raspberry tea




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 10 2008, 12:59 am
NbN advises if you can get a job, do that over ulpan. Unless of course you are very wealthy and don't need to rely on that income.

From what we have seen apt's are very very small. I live in a very small 1 bathroom and 4 teny tiny bedroom house now. The apts that we were looking at in EY were even smaller. I thought I had it bad here. My house is a mansion compared to how families do it there.

Doesn't a mini-van cost like 50k in EY? Plus the tax, which brings it up to 100k!

RBS has a "modern" chabad community. It's pretty exspensive to live there though. Of course not according to American income, but according to Israeli income it was steep.
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hila




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 10 2008, 1:13 am
yuki wrote:
NbN advises if you can get a job, do that over ulpan. Unless of course you are very wealthy and don't need to rely on that income.

From what we have seen apt's are very very small. I live in a very small 1 bathroom and 4 teny tiny bedroom house now. The apts that we were looking at in EY were even smaller. I thought I had it bad here. My house is a mansion compared to how families do it there.

Doesn't a mini-van cost like 50k in EY? Plus the tax, which brings it up to 100k!

RBS has a "modern" chabad community. It's pretty exspensive to live there though. Of course not according to American income, but according to Israeli income it was steep.


Yoki
Did you come here and find out fact for yourself ?
If you eant to live in Meah Shearim then the appartments are small and poky. If you live in Maale Adumim, Har Choma, or any yishuv, the rooms are larger. The further out of a major town , the larger the rooms.

And a minivan for 100K (maybe if you want a Mercedes bus) . Our car with olim rights (a Mazda 5 - small van with place for 7 just about) cost about $30k two years ago. With teh fall of teh dollar it may be more now, but not $50k

if you are not going to be doing Ulpan - I would recommend investing time before aliya to learn some hebrew. It is not easy to manage without. Possible, but harder.

there are Chabad communities in almost every town. Akeres had a good post about it. In Efrat, where I live, there is an active Bet Chabad. But remember, most families in a small town in the US need Chabad because tehya re the source of frumkeit. In most towns in Israel there are shiurim, shuls and mikvas anyway. This is not supposed to be an anti-chabad statement, just saying tha the functions Chabad fills in small US communities is not so needed in Israel.
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Tamiri




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 10 2008, 1:29 am
Regarding the sewing machine: my mother had/has hers on a transformer. The machine is probably almost as old as I am, maybe 40+ (I am 46). Still working, I think.
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raspberry tea




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Nov 10 2008, 1:43 am
Hila....yes that was first hand info, visiting a few months back. Maybe I was off on the price of the van. That's 30k for the van plus 30k in taxes...$60k total??? Maybe I'm wrong....

All I know is that it was a really really crazy price. If we wanted a vehichle it would have to be a jalopy...if we could even swing that.

We even considered bringing our vehicle. If I wanted to bring my 2001, 8 passenger van over. Even though we only paid 10k for it when it was a few years old. I would have to pay much more than that NOW if I wanted to take it in to the country. Not including the shipping. Even though it has depreciated to about 2-3k.

We still want to come....we'll just be without a car!
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