Gifted kids- parents please respond

amother

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 6:33 am

Do you have kids that have officially been labeled as "gifted kids"? Or kids that havent been labeled yet, but you know for certain that they will be labeled as gifted when they're a drop older?

I was reading a book on gifted kids and the difference in parenting them from regular kids, and was looking for parents who are in the same boat as myself, parents of gifted kids that I'd be able to talk to.

Or even if you dont have kids yet, if you were labeled as gifted growing up and would be able to contribute, speak up.

Maybe we can have a thread on this, if there are any people interested?

And if there is enough interest, maybe even a subforum, parallel to the "special needs child" forum, as gifted children also need special education, in the opposite extreme.

I'm anon because people have so many biases against gifted kids and gifted adults, number one that they're bragging, sickening, showoffs. If I see enough response maybe we can ask yael for such a forum so we dont need to be anon.

amother

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 7:51 am

I have at least one gifted child, who I have been told repeatedly by teachers is way ahead of the class. She is already in her teens, and I have never given her anything special, apart from sending her to more out of school activities. I encourage her to participate in lots of activities, read, discover things, organize events etc. But it is more important to me not to make her into anything weird, and I have found little problem with that.

There were more problems when she was younger in school, but further up (from around 5th grade) the teachers allowed her to contribute more and use her talents. I don't think the child gains anything from being different from his peers, and I would rather have a happy, well-adjusted child who has a little less knowledge than a weird genius without friends.

cubbie

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 8:33 am

amother wrote:

Whilst I agree with what you are saying in big, it doesn't always pan out like that, I know as I grew up in a house with a gifted child, my brother, no matter what my parents would or wouldn't have done he would still have been a "weird genius without friends" until he went to university and met people of his acadamic ability. So my parents recognising his giftedness (and believe me he really is a genius - he's a scientist with first degree from cambridge Phd from Oxford, works in academia and has written books that I don't understand the title of) meant that at least he could be a friendless kid in an enviroment that he could excell academically as apposed to an enviroment where he's both friendless and bored.
Having grown up in a home with a brother like that when I had kids, my biggest wish for them was to be average, not too smart, not too dumb, not to pretty, not too ugly - sounds strange I know but fitting in is such an important aspect of growing up and my brother missed out on so much by being gifted and to this day finds friendships and relationships difficult, and that wouldn't have been changed by the way my parents reacted to him. He also has difficulty in dealing with situations and things that don't come naturally to him, and will push himself to succeed even if it means coming close to breakdown, because in his eyes 99% is faliure only 100% will do.

Imaonwheels

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 8:44 am

I have a gifted child and was classified myself as one. I was lucky to go to schools were the academic level was very high and I was able to participate in college level AP courses and one of the best HS music programs in the country.

One of the problems is that in some ways I was expected by adults to be somewhat on their level and more mature than my years. DS is less mature than most kids his age. It has def caused problems.

Also just because a child is gifted does not mean that he will be gifted in everything. I had to become a behavior problem in 7th-8th grade for them to chop my weakness. They were wise enough to let me get by there with the minimum and emphasize my talents. Both I and ds had a tendency to use less than healthy methods to gain social acceptance. This aspect in my opinion is the most important.

Here in Israel they wanted to move ds up a grade. Not only did I have 2 other children in the higher grade but one had been held back and has learning difficulties. The embarrassment for him to be the weakest in the class while the other at 2 years younger the strongest would have been unbearable on all 3 of them. No we do not have another school here. An expert I consulted said moving the child ahead is almost never the answer as the child needs to learn all of that material. She said instead the teacher should give him assignments on a higher level on the same material. The school never cooperated on this though even though there were less than 20 kids in the class.

amother

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 8:54 am

I was a gifted child who apparently was a handful for the teachers in early elementary (would do my work in 2 seconds but would protest vigorously if given additional work designed to keep me in my seat not disrupting the class). The school wanted to skip me, but my parents instead took me to a child psychologist who found I had a very high IQ, and who recommended a particular school geared to gifted students. So I changed schools and suddenly found myself working a LOT harder! In high school (at this same school) I did end up skipping my senior year to go to college. I was first in my class but had worked very hard to get there.

I hated school. The social aspects of school were miserable. I was one of the outcasts of my class all the way through. I did have a couple of friends (also outcasts), so that was the only positive point. The classes were a mixed bag. Some of the most outstanding teachers I've ever had were in high school, but most just slopped along having us memorize and regurgitate a bunch of facts without ever putting things into a larger context or encouraging independent research or thinking, outside of a term paper (nearly every class had a term paper requirement.)

College was much better. I took a lot of independent study courses (one on one, meeting with the professor once a week to discuss the course) and was able to delve much more deeply into the topics which interested me. I ended up learning much more about my area in college than I did in graduate school...

DS1 is in a gifted program at his yeshiva ketana. I see some similarities in his struggles to fit in with his classmates and have tried to help him to integrate better than I did. He has been diagnosed with mild Asperger's; in retrospect, I wonder if that diagnosis might have applied to me as well. His IQ is extremely high - he tested over 150, and yet, contrary to me, he does not apply himself in school as he should. A couple of years ago his rebbe said that "maybe he just doesn't have the smarts for this - not every boy is bright enough." He was completely flabbergasted when DH pulled out a copy of DS's psychological writeup, including his IQ score. On the other hand, in limudei chol, which is pathetically easy, he makes straight A's but without really trying. This year, B'H, he's made strides in limudei kodesh (all A's and B's), but he really just doesn't put forth the effort to do rote memorization, which is a big part of success. I wish that I knew of a yeshiva which taught differently, in a way that would engage him, but we're out of town and there are limited options for us here.

DS2 is adorable and artistic and has a lot of emotional intelligence, but is not gifted academically.

DS3 is also in the gifted program, but a real people-pleaser, and seems to be skating through school with no issues.

DS4 is in kindergarten. I think he may be the most gifted of all of the children. He can be a little difficult to handle (more at school than at home), but he's also very sweet. He catches onto everything very quickly (he learned how to read from his older brothers when he was 3), and he just cannot stay still when the class is doing something, and he's already finished. Socially, he's just fine. He's a little bit of the class clown (honestly, you've never seen such a funny 5 year old), and he seems to be well-liked by his classmates.

amother

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 10:16 am

when ds was in kita alef, he would act up, crazy. the teachers couldn't handle him. my mother skipped two grades, "gifted" and all and we got ds tested. he has a high IQ in his math skills but then, he had very little hebrew vocabulary. BH, he has discovered the world of reading since he's been in kita bet and now, has a good command of hebrew. we were told to get him extra books for class because he would finish his work books when the class had just started them. we have to be strict with him now, he is not allowed to skip ahead, and when he is finished, he is allowed to read. he has the type of personality of either he wants to get perfect on a test or doesnt care if he doesnt know anything. we know he is smart and he knows that he is smart and he knows that we know that he is smart. nothing gets passed him. we have to keep on top of him, and keep him challenged.

avigailmiriam

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 10:41 am

marina wrote:

Here's my two cents.

Many people disagree with skipping grades for gifted kids. However, recent research shows that it is actually has many benefits to skip kids and unfortunately, many educators are not aware of this. They assume the child will be stunted emotionally, etc, but it is just not accurate for many kids.

Yes, grade skipping goes in and out of fashion. I was allowed to skip once (plus leave high school after my junior year), my brother, 3 grades below me and in the same school system, was not. I understand that it stopped being acceptable educational practice in the late eighties and nineties and is now becoming acceptable again.

When I did skip, I had to go and get a lengthy psych evaluation. Or, at least, that's what I'm told it was. I thought a nice man had just come to play with me for a couple of hours.

avigailmiriam

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 10:48 am

Tzippora wrote:

I didn't skip, technically - I just started kindergarten a grade early.

I was also apparently assigned the school psychologist, but just enjoyed the nice lady who would talk to me about whatever I was interested in.

The hard part was knowing things better than teachers, not necessarily being ahead of other kids. But when I can spell better and speak English better than my teacher in 5th grade - that was a problem.

And that's why 19 year olds should not be teachers, even in Bais Yaakovs.

I had an obnoxious habit of arguing with the teacher. At least in college, that was usually encouraged.

I was skipped out of first grade in a week when it was discovered I was reading at a sixth grade level.

Tzippora

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 10:55 am

avigailmiriam wrote:

Tzippora wrote:

First thing I learned to read was Gilbert and Sullivan - my dad sat my down in front of a video and handed me the lyrics and told me to read. You ended up with a 3 year old asking absurd questions like "Daddy, what's a quandary?" And I was doing fractions by the time I started 1st grade.

I still like to argue with the teacher. Didn't go over well in Bais Yaakov or in Stern. But it didn't help that my teacher in 5th and 6th grade was Satmar and was speaking English as a second language - and was teaching history out of the book, one chapter ahead of the class.

avigailmiriam

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 10:57 am

Tzippora wrote:

avigailmiriam wrote:

Tzippora wrote:

I used to drive my mother absolutely crazy because when I was 10 or so, I was reading at a college level. Of course, I still had the maturity of a 10 year old, so my mom wouldn't give me adult books to read. She ended up giving me a list of the 100 great books and told me to read them. Even then, it was only in reading many of them in college that I got that Shakespeare was bawdy or why is was SUCH problem that Lydia ran away with Mr. Whickam.

Tzippora

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 11:01 am

avigailmiriam wrote:

Tzippora wrote:

avigailmiriam wrote:

Tzippora wrote:

I used to go to Shakespeare in the park and Shakespeare in the parking lot all the time, so they made sure you knew what was bawdy. My father tried to bowdlerize my reading material a little bit, but it only kind of worked.

But I'm relieved I'm not the only one who didn't quite get why Lydia Bennett was such a problem child. Lots of references missed, and many subtleties lost. Ah, youth!

avigailmiriam

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 11:03 am

Tzippora wrote:

avigailmiriam wrote:

Tzippora wrote:

avigailmiriam wrote:

Tzippora wrote:

I remember asking my mother about it and she said, "AM, do you know what a virgin is?" I was 9 or so at the time? The explanation was so awkward that I never brought up the subject again. And I still didn't see what the fuss was.

Tzippora

Sun, Dec 28 2008, 11:15 am

avigailmiriam wrote:

Tzippora wrote:

avigailmiriam wrote:

Tzippora wrote:

avigailmiriam wrote:

Tzippora wrote:

My father's theory was to be completely honest and upfront once he knew that I had the facts of life. So learning chumash with him would include translations like "and if a man rapes a virgin...." Suited me, I abhor obfuscation Smile