SAHM and cleaning ladies

amother

Wed, Jun 17 2009, 10:40 pm

I don't know that they were stronger than us, or just raised to do it all themselves, particularly those who came of age during the Depression as my parents and inlaws did. My MIL a"h raised ten children with no help whatsoever, was not strong physically, could have certainly used the assistance (especially with way more boys than girls, at least in those days that made a big difference). Would she still be around? I'm not going that far, but certainly there were a lot of martyr moms in the previous generations, and I don't know anyone who wants to emulate that. All my SIL's have help to one degree or another, and no one is wealthy, but they all saw what my MIL went through. And some have as many kids or even more, so these are not spoiled, weak women, just women who know how much they can handle, and where they want to put their greatest effort.

amother

Wed, Jun 17 2009, 10:57 pm

I have a cleaning lady on Friday and let me tell you, it does wonders for sholom bayis. There's never a lack of what to do, and it just makes me greet shabbos in such a nice way.
Ladies, no one should be made to feel guilty for having cleaning help. Including by husbands.
If a woman, doesn't feel like she wants it, thats ok too. But it goes a long way in helping me keep my sanity!

Mama Bear

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 10:58 am

chocolate moose, clean means different things to differnet people. also, I dont mean this offensively ch'v, but your kids are grown up, your house isnt that messy/dirty probably. when you have little children and youre busy with them all day, and are drained at night, when are you supposed to do the really big cleaning and washing up? Babies get underfoot, it's very stressful. the best thing is having someone else do it for you while you can do other things at the time like organizing a closet or mending pants.

Raisin

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 10:59 am

chocolate moose wrote:

I didn't grow up with cleaning help and see no reason to have a cleaning lady.

I wonder if the women here who have help, had it as a child. I should make a separate thread, with a poll.

I will probably manage without cleaning help when my kids are adults too. although when your kids were young and you were working full time I can imagine it must have been quite hard to juggle. I guess either you or dh like cleaning.

amother

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 11:03 am

I am a SAHM with cleaning help 18-20 hours a week. I know, I'll be bashed. However, I am preg with #8 and my oldest in 5th grade, almost 11. I am NOT good at scrubbing, and feel it is a waste of my time, when I can be doing other things around the house ans focusing on the kids that are home all day long. I have 2 kids home all day, and then the rest come home starting at 2 over the course of the day. In addition, dh has crazy hours, and is not home in the evenings, which means I need to save energy for the afternoon/evening routine. DH likes a VERY clean house, an I can't do that, so we decided to get a cleaning lady.

What do I do all day? There are plenty of porjects around the house that would never get done if I had to scrub. I love to cook and bake.I do massive amounts of laundry. And, most importantly, I play with my kids!

happymom

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 11:27 am

Of course it's a luxury. It's a necessity? Why?

for me it is a necessaty. everyone has different things they need to stay calm relaxed and sane. for me its a cleaning lady once a month. it helps with my sholom bayis and being a calm mother. to me that is my first priority. not always does something a person feels they need mean they dont need it if the wouldnt die.
what most people mean byut necessity is something necessary to keep them calm and that helps with thier sanity and sholom bayis and overall happiness. to me that is something extremely important and yes everyone has different things they need to do. for some its a cleaning lady, even if its once a week. a person always can live on only food on water. does that mean thats all we should give our kids??

amother

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 11:35 am

I agree that noone has to feel bad or explain why they get the help the need. imo anyone who gets help in order to be more relaxed and a better mom should be PRAISED. there are some people who feel they will do everything on thier own all the time, judge others who dont, and yell at thier kids and husband all the time because of the stress thgier under from managing everything themselves! ill take any help I can get to be able to NOT be that way. I am NOT talking about people who absolty cannot afford anything. I dont have money myself, but I cut in other areas to have help once a week because I see what it does for me and my family.

amother

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 11:48 am

octopus wrote:

Everyone makes choices. I chose to keep my 2 year old home and didn't send to school= much messier house. op, do you ship your kids off to school at 18 mts???

Nope, not at all. Yes, my house might not be spotless, but I get what needs to get done done, once the kids are asleep. I wouldn't dream of paying someone else to clean my mess when I am home, and don't only start cooking supper, etc when I get home from work at 5 or 6 pm...

amother

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 11:55 am

ora_43 wrote:

I don't see OP judging anyone. Let's be dan l'chaf zchut ( Wink

) and assume it was an innocent question.

OP--
I am not quite a SAHM, and I don't have a cleaning lady, but I can totally understand why people would choose to get one. Women who choose to be SAHMs generally want to be home with their kids, not with their mops and toilet scrubbies. The goal is to spend time having fun with/nurturing/ educating children, not to do chores while the kids bash each other on the head or wander around bored and whiny.

I spend most mornings with my kids, and the last thing they want to do most days is sit and play quietly while I clean. They want to go out and play, or go to the library and read books, or play with me, or do playdates, etc. So that's what we do. The mess can (and does) wait..

OP. Maybe I'll make all my posts blue from now on.
I don't know why housework and spending time with your kids are mutually exclusive. I do chore with my kids, like separating laundry, hanging laundry, cooking food. Sure, each thing takes longer, but they have fun and we get it done.
In terms of mess that kids make, even though I'm not a neat person in any way, my kids learned that when they finish playing with something, they put it back away.
An example: This morning my toddler woke up an hour before I did. Playing quietly by herself. When I got up, I saw a few of one type of toy right near the toy shelf. My toddler had played with toys, put them away, took out more, etc. For an hour, playing by herself. With no supervision. And I had no mess to clean.
Another thing my toddler did today was empty out my parve drawer, including rolling pins, garlic press, cake decorating equipment, measuring cups, spoons, etc.... all over my kitchen while my back was turned. While I was groaning to myself that I didnt want to clean it up, toddler put back all the things in their place and I had nothing to clean up.
So no, I'm not cleaning up after my kid's messes all day. We do it together, or they even do it by themselves. We make it a game, and it gets done, and no extra work on my part.

small bean

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 11:58 am

I work full time. have 2 little kids, preg with a 3rd and I think cleaning ladies are a luxury. I don't have a cleaning lady now but I have had at times. I could easily afford a cleaning lady, to me I just feel like why should someone clean up my mess. I think it's a luxury because you can do without it easily. you don't need to have sparkling bathrooms every day, if you do that's a luxury. I think to clean a bathroom twice a week in enough and if you do it twice a week it really takes just a couple of min. but I don't live in a spotless house, my kids make a mess and track food everywhere and it's ok. I don't yell at my kids because my house is a mess and anyone who does I think has other issues....

amother

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 11:58 am

YESHASettler wrote:

If you're not judging, why hide behind amother?.

Because I knew people would assume I was judging, which I very clearly stated in my original post, and no reason to get everyone to hate me because they think I'm so judgemental.
The purpose of my original post was:
"I don't want to judge. I don't understand why SAHM's need cleaning ladies, seeing as I'm a stay at home mom and don't see the need for a cleaning lady. I want to understand because I don't beleive in judging. I understand there IS another side to the story that I'm not seeing.
Please show me the other side of the story."
And many of you have shown me the other side, and I really understand a lot better now. Thank you so much for showing me and helping me, and other people not be judgemental. For that mere reason, I think it was a good thing I started this thread.

amother

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 12:43 pm

ss321 wrote:

. I honestly dont see any correlation between the two, other than the fact that a household where there is a "WORKING" mom might be bringing in more $ than a household with one parent working, and thus cleaning help might be more affordable to them? but I dont see how being a SAHM automatically makes you a cleaning lady too. everyone deserves a little bit of sanity, and while yes it is a "luxury" (the only things in life that are truly "necessities" are food and shelter, an argument can be made for health care too I guess), I dont think its one that is really out of line at all or unreasonable.

Oh, a cleaning lady is a luxury, for anyone. But I can definitely understand those that work out of the house that really have no time for anything because they get home so late as it is, hiring a cleaning lady, as well as buying takeout more frequently- a) because they are bringing in more money, so can afford a little luxury, and b) because they don't have time for anything else. When I worked full time, I strongly considered getting a cleaning lady because the stress of having to cook supper, clean up from supper, do laundry, etc... was just too much and my place ended up being a disaster zone.
But a cleaning lady generally has a LITTLE more time on her hands, whether its when kids are napping, or after they go to sleep for the night. They're not like working moms who practically are only home after their kids go to sleep for the night and thats the only time they're able to get things done.
But now thanks to the enlightenment I got on this thread, I understand why SAHMs get cleaning ladies. But its still a luxury and shouldnt be something like "ch'v my cleaning lady can't come today--- what am I going to do??!?!?!". Or thinking its a basic necessity like food, etc.

Seraph

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 1:22 pm

Temilia wrote:

I think if you could work it into your budget cleaning help is amazing. Why should anyone have to scrub a toilet? The whole Bas Melech etc, it's great to take care of your home, your children, be a true Akeres Habayis and all that jazz, but honestly find me one person who enjoys scrubbing a toilet.
Trust me, I do it all the time, I only have cleaning help once a or twice every three months, but if I had the money for it, I would hire someone to do that sort of stuff for me in a flash. .

You'll probably laugh, but a friend of mine loves scrubbing toilets, but cant stand cooking. She said she'd gladly scrub anyone's toilets in exchange for cooking...

cassandra

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 1:29 pm

Seraph wrote:

Temilia wrote:

You'll probably laugh, but a friend of mine loves scrubbing toilets, but cant stand cooking. She said she'd gladly scrub anyone's toilets in exchange for cooking...

I love toilets but despise laundry. Toilets are easy to clean and a very gratifying job.

mominisrael2

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 1:33 pm

I'm a WAHM, and get cleaning help once a week partly because I'm lousy at cleaning, but also because it probably is the thing that singlehandedly saves my sanity, not to mention shalom bayis. My cleaning lady has grown to be one of my best friends -- not only does she make my house look perfect, she gives me advice when I'm frustrated with issues having to do with freelancing, parenting or being a new olah; she gives me rides to the grocery since I can't afford a car; her kids watch out for my daughter in school to make sure she's safe; she translates school notices for me...I could go on and on. Our finances are tight, but I do without lots of extras in order to have enough money for this one thing because I honestly would be lost without her in so many ways...

chocolate moose

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 1:41 pm

Mama Bear wrote:

chocolate moose, clean means different things to differnet people.

Yes, of course it does. That doesn't mean that my apt wasn't clean, just b/c I didn't pay someone to clean it.

Mama Bear wrote:

I dont mean this offensively ch'v, but your kids are grown up, your house isnt that messy/dirty probably. when you have little children and youre busy with them all day, and are drained at night, when are you supposed to do the really big cleaning and washing up? Babies get underfoot, it's very stressful. the best thing is having someone else do it for you while you can do other things at the time like organizing a closet or mending pants.

My baby is 19 years old, closer to 20 really. I could probably afford help now if I wanted to, but when I had little kids and worked all day, there was no spending an extra penny that we didn't have to. that's why I worked !!!

amother

Thu, Jun 18 2009, 1:43 pm

Why when one person does something a certain way, do they feel the need for everyone else to feel that is the way it must be by all? I guess its human nature, but come on, every person is different and sees things a different way. For Mrs. A, a cleaning lady might really be a necessity and for Mrs. B it is a luxury. Everyone has different personalities, amount of kids, age of kids, amount of husband helping out, natural cleanliness tendancies. Hashem made some people able to work and work and work and be able to handle it. Some (many) people need to pick and choose what they can do so they will stay relaxed and normal. Each of you knows yourself and whichever way you choose to run your life, thats OK!