Need info/ideas re: Rechovot, Nof Ayalon, Carmiel

Tablepoetry

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 4:27 am

If you do decide to leave the 'charedi' label for now and check out strict dati leumi crowds (which is what chardal is) - you've got a lot more options. And again, most chardal or dl people I know don't go around waving flags all the time. It's really not the mindset, unless you choose a very nationalistic yeshuv.

Personally, I'd probably first look for areas near large places of employment. Or for a city with a train station, which gives you a lot of freedom in where to commute.
Do you prefer a large city or small yeshuv? Is having a private home with yard important to you? What is your budget? These are all crucial factors in advising you on options.

amother

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 5:53 am

Tablepoetry wrote:

What are examples of chardal communities besides for Nof Ayalon? In my experience, when we were looking into communities, the only places that were frum enough for us that weren't chareidi, were very zionistic. So you certainly don't have to be waving a flag around all the time, but I found that it was in fact the mindset. For some it may not be a big deal, but for me it was. For us, it came down to the following choices: 1. Pretend to be zionist 2. Be "flexible" on level of frumkeit 3. Try to blend into a tolerant, mixed neighborhood in a large city where we could be as frum as we wanted, plus have a variety of schools to choose from. We chose the third option.

4Sisters

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 6:47 am

Just wanted to say hello! November, I was reading your post and almost started laughing--I think we're twins Smile

. I'll be watching the replies. Although we're not thinking of aliyah for 1-2 years, the info you're getting is really helpful. Maybe we'll end up in the same community!

Hatzlacha in your pilot trip and aliyah!

Tablepoetry

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 8:00 am

amother wrote:

Tablepoetry wrote:

I didn't get the impression op wanted a homogenous community with ONLY charedi or chardal or what not. (But surely Nof Ayalon isn't the only one. Moreshet? Chashmonaim? etc).
In any case, I think your third option is best in this case, and in any case when one doesn't neatly fit any label. It doesn't even have to be a 'large' city. How about Givat Shmuel? There is definitely a lot of chardal (and also a lot of DL lite), very professional, well-educated, and some of them bus to more 'charedi' schools. The only problem is that it's an expensive area.
If op is really uncomfortable with the chardal group, and if she won't change her ways to fit in the charedi schools (and it doesn't stop at socks), she is not left with a lot of options. I know a lot of people in that dilemma who send to Chabad, which in Israel is actually considered charedi, but not sure if that would be relevant for op.

One last comment -- op you mention you would like your kids to have a profession. Please note that many charedi schools in Israel do not offer boys a matriculation (Bagrut), which makes it very difficult or even impossible for them to continue to secondary education. (They need to take courses, take exams, pay tuition just to get a high school diploma).

amother

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 8:28 am

Tablepoetry wrote:

amother wrote:

Tablepoetry wrote:

I don't know what Moreshet is. Chashmonaim is not chardal. It's made up mostly of MO Americans, and the old-timer DL Israelis.

OP, the bolded above is an important issue you should speak to your DH about. You said he wants a more chareidi education, but it may be that he isn't sure what that means here. There are a handful of schools in the country that may fit what he wants, in which case you should research the schools and move to the community after you've looked at the schools. Just an idea. Oh, and don't rely on what's written on a website. I have seen schools mislabeled and mis-described on NBN's site.

amother

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 9:04 am

Quote:

the only places that were frum enough for us that weren't chareidi, were very zionistic. So you certainly don't have to be waving a flag around all the time, but I found that it was in fact the mindset. For some it may not be a big deal, but for me it was.

Unfortunately a typical problem...

amother

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 10:49 am

how acceptable are tvs in nof ayalon? if we dont own a tv, would we be in the minority?

lst

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 11:00 am

amother wrote:

how acceptable are tvs in nof ayalon? if we dont own a tv, would we be in the minority?

I don't think you'd be a minority, but a lot of people do have.

November

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 11:06 am

OP here: we also have found that you cannot completely rely on the info on the NBN website. That is good advice. I think the person who wrote that my husband might not get what it means to raise your kids chareidi nowadays is on to something. Truth be told, I'm not completely sure I get it myself. Does it necessarily mean that learning secular studies is discouraged for boys, starting either in cheder or in high school? That's hard for us to believe, since we are around so many yeshivaish type of people whose children do go on to become professionals and continue to learn in the evenings/weekends. That's why we are going to look at Nof Ayalon. I have heard that housing is difficult to find there. I just know that my husband is used to seeing a certain percentage of men with black kippot and hats that in our community connotes a certain seriousness/commitment towards halacha and learning. In Israel, however, it's different since there are communities that seem seroius and committed to halacha, but may not look yeshivaish. Are the main differences about profession and Zionism?

Tamiri

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 11:13 am

November wrote:

I just know that my husband is used to seeing a certain percentage of men with black kippot and hats that in our community connotes a certain seriousness/commitment towards halacha and learning. In Israel, however, it's different since there are communities that seem seroius and committed to halacha, but may not look yeshivaish. Are the main differences about profession and Zionism?

Not to belabor a point, but men in hats and suits look like Polish gentry from the 17th century, or well turned out gentlemen the world over. That's not a Yeshivish look. I doubt Rabbi Akiva's students looked like that. If you change your outlook when you get here, you will realize that Yeshivish takes on many different looks, each equally fine in the eyes of Hashem.

shabri

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 11:16 am

amother wrote:

how acceptable are tvs in nof ayalon? if we dont own a tv, would we be in the minority?

Actually I am 98% sure that in Nof Ayalon you have to sign that you WON'T have a tv. I know thats what turned my sister off to it.

Also what abt Moshav Mattityahu?

lst

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 11:22 am

shabri wrote:

amother wrote:

how acceptable are tvs in nof ayalon? if we dont own a tv, would we be in the minority?

Actually I am 98% sure that in Nof Ayalon you have to sign that you WON'T have a tv. I know thats what turned my sister off to it.

Also what abt Moshav Mattityahu?

There are lots of people in Nof Ayalon with TVs.

November

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 11:22 am

Has anyone heard of Mevo Choron? It's a moshav near Modiin.

amother

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 11:40 am

lst wrote:

shabri wrote:

amother wrote:

how acceptable are tvs in nof ayalon? if we dont own a tv, would we be in the minority?

Actually I am 98% sure that in Nof Ayalon you have to sign that you WON'T have a tv. I know thats what turned my sister off to it.

Also what abt Moshav Mattityahu?

There are lots of people in Nof Ayalon with TVs.

Uh, yeah, they filmed an episode of a reality tv show there.

Tamiri

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 11:45 am

November wrote:

Has anyone heard of Mevo Choron? It's a moshav near Modiin.

Yeah. It's there.

November

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 11:57 am

Do you know anythiing about Mevo Choron regarding hashkafa and educational options?

Tamiri

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 12:04 pm

Based on where it is, I'd say Zionistic shtark DL/Torani-Chardal. It's a bit "out there" in terms of the neighboring villages, which aren't Jewish ones, if you get my drift. Gorgeous scenery. Some agriculture. Some people work out of the Yishuv. Good weather - it's a bit hilly.

November

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 12:18 pm

Would you say that there are olim in Mevo Choron, or is it mostly Israeli? And any ideas where they send their kids to school?

Tamiri

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 12:26 pm

I don't know. I am getting some info from the internet. I assume there are some English speakers, but they may be the type who have been here for eons and whose children aren't fluent. The article said that based on the parents' leanings, the children go to school in Modiin, Chashmonaim and elsewhere. The thing is, with a place like that, you pretty much rely on the "municipality" to bus your children to where the magnet schools are, otherwise you have to drive them yourself.

TzipG

Mon, Jun 21 2010, 12:55 pm

We're actually looking into Mevo Choron right now. Mix of vatikim and young families, Israeli, Chardal. Very few english speakers - but there are a handful. Unless you are confident in your hebrew, I'm not so sure that its the best place for olim to land. Most kids go to Nof Ayalon for schools. They just started a school on the yishuv and this year it has 1st and 2nd grades and they plan on adding a new class every year.