Projecting more or less wealth than reality

amother

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 7:39 am

When we moved house, I went around for weeks before collecting old cardboard boxes that other people had thrown out. For free. That is how I always did it.

DH thought it was brilliant, I thought it was normal, but he made me swear not to tell his parents because they would think we were completely cheap. I don't care if people think I'm cheap, I prefer to spend money on more meaningful things than boxes.

southernbubby

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 9:28 am

Regarding value, my daughter that lives in NY found that if she bought her kids cheap shoes, they get worn out very quickly because here in Detroit, we have lots of grass to run around on but in NY it is all pavement. She found that it was more economical to buy one pair of good shoes that could be worn both on Shabbos and weekdays than it was to buy several cheap pairs.

Junky baby strollers also don't last long in NY but there are loads of mid-priced options that will last for 2 or 3 kids.

amother

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 9:44 am

esther09 wrote:

This. The only people looking are the ones who are trying to project more wealth than they have and/or are jealous of wealth and brand names.

Personally, we live within our means; sometimes we splurge when we can and sometimes we do without. It's all about your values as a family. But I often feel people who are obsessed with brand names are trying to fill some void. I agree with the poster above about going for value. I would rather have a good quality, leather purse that is no brand name than a nylon one with little "LV"s all over it...

Thank you for understanding. I have reached the stage in my life I can afford whatever I want whenever I want. I am constrained only by taste and not budget. I and most other people in the same situation don't worry about silly status symbols and who has which one. It is the have nots and have a little who worry.

amother

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 10:18 am

amother wrote:

When you have money, these status symbol things like Bugaboos are totally meaningless. When you can afford these things without thinking twice about it, why would you look at what someone else is wheeling? A bugaboo is a teensy tiny fraction of a rich person's budget.

Got it. Yes, I absolutely agree.

Barbara

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 10:22 am

esther09 wrote:

Those LV bags will be passed on to your grandchildren, still in good shape. I don't own one, mind you, and don't even like most of them. But they are quality.

I have a friend who spends a lot more on purses than I do. That's because she only buys purses that cost under $30, and goes through four or five while my more expensive purse is still in great shape.

As to strollers, y'all can get an umbrella stroller for under $20. It will work. Now, my son was born in the days before Bugaboos, when a $300 stroller was considered outrageous. And I did indeed have a near-outrageous stroller. We also lived in an area where people do a lot of walking, and probably pushed that thing 15 to 20 miles a week.

amother

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 10:22 am

amother wrote:

Absolutely, but the majority of people are not able to spend whatever they want which is why it most people ARE looking in ny. Perhaps the really wealthy don't care but I find the majority of people do notice. I do think there's a big problem in the way wealth is worshiped in New York. Also I'm very young, living in a young community, so there's probably a level of immaturity to it that I hope we'll all grow out of eventually Wink

zigi

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 10:34 am

amother wrote:

I own a luxury stroller and I wonder if it ever occurred to anyone, but expensive strollers are also a very good quality in comparison to cheap ones. So it is not so much about status, as it is about being able to afford more comfort for yourself and your baby.

I also have a cheap stroller and frankly speaking, they don't compare. The cheaper one is useable, but the difference is obvious.

my stroller is my car. its worth it to have something good and pushes well. I do not own a bugaboo but I got one for free I would use it. if its taken care of it could last for years

Chayalle

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 10:36 am

amother wrote:

I do agree that sometimes it's about comfort and quality, but I have to say, I tried out my neighbor's bugaboo and was about as unimpressed as one could be with a stroller. It was bulky and veered off the path I was wheeling it on. I did not see the point.

There are plenty of expensive enough strollers, that are half the bugaboo price, and do just as good or better in terms of comfort and quality.

I think sometimes we can get good enough quality with something much cheaper, and we convince ourselves that the designer item is worth the money. It's not always better quality.

Notsobusy

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 10:49 am

Barbara wrote:

I also spend between 30 - 50 on a purse. But I don't buy really cheap quality purses, I buy in places like Marshalls and TJMaxx, where I'll find a decent quality purse for less. No, they won't last me 40 years, but mine last at least 2-3 years, and I'm a one purse at a time girl. I wouldn't want to use the same purse for that long anyhow, I would get bored of it.

The people who buy things like bugaboos for the status symbol, and there are lots of people like that, are not going to be happy with it in 3 years. They always need the newest status symbol. So to the claims that it will last longer, first of all my Graco carriage got me through 3 kids, it's still in great shape, but the kids have grown up. Second of all, they will probably not be using it that long, they will trade up to the latest status symbol carriage.

allthingsblue

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 11:04 am

I don't know why people are getting all hung up about having Bugaboos of LV purses.
I don't have a Bugaboo, I have a much cheaper stroller, but I was interested in the Bugaboo because it has a lot of features that the cheaper strollers don't have: the seat is reversible, it comes with a bassinet, and it wheels so smoothly. I ended up getting a different stroller because it was a little bit smaller, convenient for small living space. But anyone who says "Bugaboo is just about the name, not about quality" is just wrong!
And as far as other designer items, my philosophy is "don't break the bank." If you don't have the money for it, you shouldn't buy it. But if you do have the money, and you have stylish/expensive taste, by all means, go for it! I happen to appreciate the beauty of designer clothing, shoes, purses etc- they really are a work of art (most of them, anyway), so while I don't buy them because I don't have the money for it, I completely understand anyone who does buy them because they do have the money.
Although I also understand the value of the middah of modesty/restraint, and spending less than you have, and not being ostentatious. I guess I see both sides of the coin.

Barbara

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 11:08 am

Chayalle wrote:

Not always.

I have a friend who has a stroller that is not a Bugaboo. I'm the one who took her stroller shopping, so I saw and tried all the choices. Then, when I wasn't there, she found the one she uses. She adores it. Tells everyone that they should get one. Best stroller ever. Yadda yadda.

Once, I told her I'd push the baby. I did, for less than 30 seconds. Good heavens. I've pushed better $10 umbrella strollers. I could not push the thing. Could. Not.

But she genuinely adores it. And its not a well-known brand or status symbol.

Different people like different things. That's why they make different brands, I guess.

Fox

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 12:47 pm

Chayalle wrote:

I think sometimes we can get good enough quality with something much cheaper, and we convince ourselves that the designer item is worth the money. It's not always better quality.

I need a "Like a Million Times" button for this.

This, IMHO, is the slippery slope on which many of us -- including me and mine -- tend to fall.

Too many of us are easily lulled into the believe that there is a direct correlation between price and "quality." Sometimes that's true, but not necessarily.

I recently read a quality comparison of widely-available kitchen cabinets. A very expensive brand came in first, but guess who came in second? Ikea. Quite a few cabinets that are much more expensive actually tested as less durable, etc.

There are really two questions we have to ask ourselves when we play the "quality" card:

a) Have I genuinely checked out the quality or am I making an assumption based on price?

b) Do I actually *need* top quality for the particular role of this item?

No one needs everything to be top quality all the time.

A good leather handbag, though more expensive, might make sense for someone who owns two handbags. For the person who changes handbags almost every day to match different outfits, a handbag that will last for 30 years isn't really necessary.

Ultimately, IMHO, the "all top-quality, all the time" people I know often come off as clueless and nouveau riche in the worst sense of the expression.

MaBelleVie

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 12:58 pm

Slightly OT, but IKEA has a number of different lines for each product that they sell. When we were looking at kitchen cabinets, they had some that were clearly inferior quality and others that were well made. The well made ones were pricey! Out of our budget in fact. Just saying that IKEA != cheap.

Fox

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 1:10 pm

Ruchel wrote:

The old, educated money often goes unspotted.

Another "million likes"!

This is a concept that those of us in the US have trouble understanding. Truly old money spends differently than the rest of us.

I went to college with a handful of "old money" girls, and it probably affected my attitude toward money more than anything else.

You had to really be on your game to notice the details: a limited number of nice clothes that seemed to fit a little better than normal -- tailor-made in Hong Kong, it turns out.

Converse about parents' occupations, and your friend would say, "Oh, my dad works in Manhattan in the financial field." Turns out "working in the financial field" meant managing, with the help of about 30 employees, the family's industrial and real estate holdings.

Ask about summer plans, and you'd get a vague, "Oh, my mom wants to take a family trip to see some relatives." The ennui with which this was stated suggested a sojourn in Toledo, Ohio, or perhaps Omaha. Years later, I learned that the "trip" was to Europe and "some relatives" literally lived in a castle.

Now, granted, these young women were not Jewish, and they had vastly different values and needs. But I must say that I was deeply impressed.

southernbubby

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 1:17 pm

A friend of ours is a young man who wears blue jeans. He has experimented to find the right combination of price and quality. He has found that if he wants 6 months of frequent wear out of a pair of blue jeans, he must purchase them in the $30 to $40 range. Below $30, and they only last a few weeks and over $40 does not lead to wear beyond 6 months and is basically just paying for a snob appeal label.

This could hold true for many things that we buy.

amother

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 1:30 pm

Fox wrote:

Lol, you just made me think of the WASP side of my family! There's been some intermarriage in my family, so I am actually closely related to some real Old Money WASPs, and you described the culture to a T! I would add, these relatives are all Harvard and Yale educated, but never directly say so, just "I studied in Boston/New Haven". Also, "summer" and "weekend" are verbs in that crowd. There is a certain aidelkeit in it that we could learn from.

Fox

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 1:44 pm

amother wrote:

There is a certain aidelkeit in it that we could learn from.

Slightly OT, but anyone who wants a hilarious view of this culture should read "The Anglo Files," by Sarah Lyall, where she describes from an American perspective the attitudes and practices of British aristocracy.

My favorite story was about her "luncheon" with a very wealthy earl and his wife: They offered a picnic on their estate consisting of the least-expensive supermarket bread, a single container of pre-packaged cold cuts, a bottle of generic soft drink for the kids, and a bottle of extremely expensive, good wine for the adults.

skirtznsox

Thu, Dec 11 2014, 2:01 pm

This is actually a thought that's been really coming to a culmination in my head recently. Especially when it comes to clothing. I also wouldn't want a Bugaboo because it would come across as ostentatious to me, and if I got one for free I would certainly use it but feel the need to explain it away almost compulsively. I've been reading Gila Manolson's Outside Inside, and that's making a big difference for me. I also saw an article yesterday about someone spending $160k in one year on clothes, and making over $600k extra because of it. It's about presentation. When you present yourself like you're quality and worth something, you're treated like it. When you present it like Ooooh look at me I got a bugaboo, it's not tznius. But if it's, well, this is an excellent stroller and I was lucky enough to [receive it from a friend, get it at a consignment shop, be able to budget and buy it], and that's how you carry yourself with it, I think it's fine. Whether or not you ever explain how you came into possession of it.