How do you justify Pesach programs AND tuition assistance???

amother

Cyan

Thu, May 05 2016, 12:04 am

Daniellast wrote:

In the end of the day it is NOT our business to judge what others do with their money, Everyone has money for what they need, their priorities are their own business.
I deal with tuition and have cases where parents cry to me that they have no bread to put on the table, yet, I see them in summer hotels and the kids go nicely dressed. I won't say anything, that's not my job. I can try cutting a deal at the most.

Except that there can be another family that is not sending their kids to summery day camp because they can't afford it and is not getting the same tuition break, while the family you mentioned is getting a break and going to a summer hotel. Not. Fair. At. All. IMO.

Kfar

Thu, May 05 2016, 12:38 am

I think the bottom line is that the Yeshivas need to be more businesslike before they put themselves out of business. All income should be taken into account when determining aid.

So if grandparents want to spring for a $25k gift vacation for the kids for Pesach that's fine, but that amount should be required to be reported and taken into account in the family's overall income when requesting financial aid.

But would everyone report that even if they were asked? Of course not, let someone else foot the bill, because only schmucks work two jobs, give up vacation and pay full price. After all, with a wink and nod to mommy and daddy, they can get subsidized tuition from the "community" in lieu of a parental contribution AND all the Pesach vacations and other luxuries they want given their not so unique, entitled family dynamics. And if the community includes people struggling to meet their full tuition obligations without a handout and with much less resources then they have, well, that's their problem isn't it, for being so foolish.

Hmmm -- these are religious people??

amother

Firebrick

Thu, May 05 2016, 1:10 am

Does anyone know anyone in real life like this that has a huge house from the parents fully paid for plus hotels for pesach and summer vacations and they ask for tuition discounts.

The people I know like this that live such a high lifestyle would be too embarrassed to ask for a discount. So is this conversation all hypothetical or are we talking about real life people that we personally know? Because someone with pride and class would be too embarrassed to cry poverty?

Happy18

Thu, May 05 2016, 6:55 am

amother wrote:

Yes I do. I know of a few people like this they may live an expensive lifestyle but have no class.

amother

Slategray

Thu, May 05 2016, 10:01 am

I don't want tomatoes thrown at me but what about this hypothetical?
One set of parents aren't frum. Don't understand yeshiva tuition but are so respectful and loving. They won't pay for tuition but want to help their kid buy a house. They can afford where they are living but it is getting cramped. And Not free rent, just given a reduced amount. (Say they become their kids landlord).
Kids need tuition break- will be making more in the future but just graduated or one spouse is still in school.

It isn't a vacation or pesach hotel. But is an upgraded life.

amother

Firebrick

Thu, May 05 2016, 10:31 am

From my experience everyone gets something free in life. Let's say both parents work and grandmother babysits for free so that's s lot of money saved at the end of the month do we expect such a person to go to the school and say I save $2500 a month on child care so I want to pay more tuition to help others.

If someone has a relative that owns a grocery store and they get food for free or cheaper do we expect them to tell this to the school so that their expenses are less?

amother

Apricot

Thu, May 05 2016, 11:04 am

generally people who kvetch about this are in pain and stressed out by life. life isnt fair. when I started hearing myself sound like this I realized I better start planning more carefully so that I dont end up like others I know who feel like victims to their lives.

amother

Cyan

Thu, May 05 2016, 11:05 am

amother wrote:

Can I be your friend? Maybe then you can give me some free stuff, somehow I don't seem to have what you are saying everyone has. My husband and I both work and pay for childcare, groceries, mortgage, etc. Oh yes, AND TUITION. What am I missing?

saw50st8

Thu, May 05 2016, 11:20 am

amother wrote:

No one ever gives you anything free? Your parents or in laws never babysit to help out or buy your kids some clothing? If not, then you are definitely in the extreme minority.

saw50st8

Thu, May 05 2016, 11:24 am

amother wrote:

While I agree with you, tuition is definitely the great equalizer. You make $80,000/year? OK, you pay X amount and you are left with Y amount to live on. You make $200,000/year? OK, you pay X+Z and still have Y left over to live on.

Obviously, that's super simplified, but tuition is often the largest expense a family has. My tuition plus childcare is significantly more than my mortgage, which is my next largest bill.

amother

Red

Thu, May 05 2016, 12:27 pm

I didn't read the whole thread but I'd just like to share a personal situation. DH and I work extremely hard and full-time to make ends meet. (or rather not make them meet)
The struggle is endless...........
We don't qualify for any government assistance because we "make too much". Our jobs are with respectable companies, where there is no schtick of getting paid off the books in order to qualify for programs.

We get tuition assistance because after paying all the bills, rent, food, and babysitting since we are not home early enough after work, there is nothing left. I commute aprox. 3 hrs daily.

Now, I haven't seen my parents in about 8 years because they live overseas. This summer they want to buy us tickets so that we can go see them and so that the children can meet and get to know their grandparents and extended family. My youngest kids don't remember them at all since last time they were infants.
Do you think I will accept the offer? You bet!!!!! But to some it may appear like I am going on a lavish European vacation. We will have to be in Hotels because the family doesn't have enough space for us..........

So you get the idea....

momoftwo2

Thu, May 05 2016, 12:55 pm

saw50st8 wrote:

No one ever gives you anything free? Your parents or in laws never babysit to help out or buy your kids some clothing? If not, then you are definitely in the extreme minority.

Never knew I'm from the extreme minority in life. I never got a. Darn. Thing. For free. Not even when we struggled to put bread on the table. But that's life. It's not a free ride at all

amother

Hotpink

Thu, May 05 2016, 1:10 pm

I have parents that pay tuition for my kids, we're in Israel, so it's not a crazy amount, but they won't give us money for "luxeries" like a new couch. When we've been in very difficult financial situations they have helped us with some of our other expenses, but for them helping with the kids tuition and tutoring is their number one priority. They would never dream of spending money on a pesach hotel.

amother

Floralwhite

Thu, May 05 2016, 1:18 pm

I had a friend growing up who had grand parents who were not frum and much wealthier then they were (lived in a different country and didn't help with regular day to day life - my friend lived pretty simply) .

Whenever they would want to give the family a large gift the father asked they apply toward tuition, and later toward supporting his married children who were in kollel.

His reasoning was that if they are supporting torah then they get the schar for the torah, even though they themselves aren't shomer torah and mitzvos.

This went on for years and the father was really happy that his parents were getting so much reward.

amother

Chartreuse

Thu, May 05 2016, 1:27 pm

saw50st8 wrote:

No one ever gives you anything free? Your parents or in laws never babysit to help out or buy your kids some clothing? If not, then you are definitely in the extreme minority.

I guess I'm in the minority too! neither my parents or inlaws live in the same state as us. When we visit them, they are glad to see us but dont give us gifts. I don't feel deprived, why should they give us things for free?
and lest you assume otherwise, yes we are needy, get significant tuition breaks, and are on a super tight budget

saw50st8

Thu, May 05 2016, 2:11 pm

To momoftwo and chartreuse, I find it hard to believe that you never got anything. When you travel to visit them they don't watch your sleeping kids so you can go out for a little while on your own? They never bought you so much as a box of tissues or an article of clothing for your kids? I really do find that hard to believe.

Maybe they set you up in other ways - not requiring their teenage kids to buy their own clothing so they could save up their own money instead? Or helping pay for college? Did they require you to start paying room and board the moment you turned 18 (I know people in that situation)?

If your answer is that neither of your parents ever gave you anything, then yes, you are in the extreme minority.

amother

Cyan

Thu, May 05 2016, 2:14 pm

saw50st8 wrote:

Saw50, the response was to the comments below, you can't compare even a few small gifts or babysitting so a couple can go out for supper to saving on childcare for a working parent or free groceries on an ongoing basis.

"From my experience everyone gets something free in life. Let's say both parents work and grandmother babysits for free so that's s lot of money saved at the end of the month do we expect such a person to go to the school and say I save $2500 a month on child care so I want to pay more tuition to help others.

If someone has a relative that owns a grocery store and they get food for free or cheaper do we expect them to tell this to the school so that their expenses are less?"

tichellady

Thu, May 05 2016, 2:17 pm

amother wrote:

Go and enjoy the trip! Sounds like a wonderful opportunity