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Fox









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:05 pm
I'm probably naive, but I've never understood why this is rocket science.

We need seasonal and low-wage labor that U.S. citizens are unable or unwilling to provide. So why not offer short-term work visas for individuals without significant criminal records?

* Charge a nominal cost for these work visas to cover processing and vetting costs as well as a minimal level of health insurance for guest workers.

* Provide permanent immigration advantages for guest workers who have paid taxes for X number of years; shown a history of employment; demonstrate English proficiency; and/or can show that they hire U.S. citizens.

* Put coyotes and human smugglers out of business by making it easier, cheaper, and more convenient to get a guest worker permit.

* Work with other countries as much as possible to pool information regarding possible criminals. Just as the U.S. doesn't want Mexico's criminals, Mexico doesn't want Guatamala's hoodlums.

In short, follow the digital piracy model: when it's easier and cheaper to do something legally, there is little incentive to do it illegally.

In addition, perhaps we should bring back the model of individual sponsorship. An individual or organized group of individuals would agree to sponsor a refugee/immigrant family for a period of time, including providing support and agreeing to incur civil penalities for criminal acts committed by the immigrants during that period. This would allow people to act compassionately but also ensure that they didn't pass along the costs of their compassion to others.
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marina









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:07 pm
Fox wrote:
I'm probably naive, but I've never understood why this is rocket science.

We need seasonal and low-wage labor that U.S. citizens are unable or unwilling to provide. So why not offer short-term work visas for individuals without significant criminal records?

* Charge a nominal cost for these work visas to cover processing and vetting costs as well as a minimal level of health insurance for guest workers.

* Provide permanent immigration advantages for guest workers who have paid taxes for X number of years; shown a history of employment; demonstrate English proficiency; and/or can show that they hire U.S. citizens.

* Put coyotes and human smugglers out of business by making it easier, cheaper, and more convenient to get a guest worker permit.

* Work with other countries as much as possible to pool information regarding possible criminals. Just as the U.S. doesn't want Mexico's criminals, Mexico doesn't want Guatamala's hoodlums.

In short, follow the digital piracy model: when it's easier and cheaper to do something legally, there is little incentive to do it illegally.

In addition, perhaps we should bring back the model of individual sponsorship. An individual or organized group of individuals would agree to sponsor a refugee/immigrant family for a period of time, including providing support and agreeing to incur civil penalities for criminal acts committed by the immigrants during that period. This would allow people to act compassionately but also ensure that they didn't pass along the costs of their compassion to others.


Wow. And I mean that in a good way. Wow.
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sushilover









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:10 pm
SixOfWands wrote:
Do you?

In Texas, a woman went into court to obtain a restraining order against her abusive boyfriend. She was arrested after court as an undocumented alien. The suspicion is that the abuser turned her in. (She did have a criminal record, but no outstanding warrants.)

You have no sympathy. Too bad she was being used as a punching bag; she shouldn't have been here in the first place.

So, do you have the same disdain for the family above? They're committing welfare fraud. Throw the adults in jail. Put the kids into foster care. Its illegal. No sympathy. And if mom or dad happen to be immigrants, kick them out. Even legal immigrants can be deported due to fraud. Good riddance.


If you are referring to the transgender individual in Texas, then please note that this person was deported 6 times already and has a criminal record for assault, probation violation, domestic violence, and false imprisonment of a minor.

So no pity for this one.

About pity for other illegals- I can have both pity and still know that the law is a fair law and it has to be upheld.
A family committing welfare fraud- If you believe that the welfare fraud laws are just, then yes! anyone who violates them should be punished to the full extent of the law.


Last edited by sushilover on Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Squishy









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:11 pm
SixOfWands wrote:
Do you?

In Texas, a woman went into court to obtain a restraining order against her abusive boyfriend. She was arrested after court as an undocumented alien. The suspicion is that the abuser turned her in. (She did have a criminal record, but no outstanding warrants.)

You have no sympathy. Too bad she was being used as a punching bag; she shouldn't have been here in the first place.

So, do you have the same disdain for the family above? They're committing welfare fraud. Throw the adults in jail. Put the kids into foster care. Its illegal. No sympathy. And if mom or dad happen to be immigrants, kick them out. Even legal immigrants can be deported due to fraud. Good riddance.


Where do you think the line should be drawn? Or do you think we should have no borders and take in the billions of folks that have it worse than us?

What about those abusing the U visas falsely claiming they are victims of crimes. Any one of these people are needy, but there are billions of them.

I am fine with deporting criminals.
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SixOfWands









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:19 pm
Fox wrote:
I'm probably naive, but I've never understood why this is rocket science.

We need seasonal and low-wage labor that U.S. citizens are unable or unwilling to provide. So why not offer short-term work visas for individuals without significant criminal records?

* Charge a nominal cost for these work visas to cover processing and vetting costs as well as a minimal level of health insurance for guest workers.

* Provide permanent immigration advantages for guest workers who have paid taxes for X number of years; shown a history of employment; demonstrate English proficiency; and/or can show that they hire U.S. citizens.

* Put coyotes and human smugglers out of business by making it easier, cheaper, and more convenient to get a guest worker permit.

* Work with other countries as much as possible to pool information regarding possible criminals. Just as the U.S. doesn't want Mexico's criminals, Mexico doesn't want Guatamala's hoodlums.

In short, follow the digital piracy model: when it's easier and cheaper to do something legally, there is little incentive to do it illegally.

In addition, perhaps we should bring back the model of individual sponsorship. An individual or organized group of individuals would agree to sponsor a refugee/immigrant family for a period of time, including providing support and agreeing to incur civil penalities for criminal acts committed by the immigrants during that period. This would allow people to act compassionately but also ensure that they didn't pass along the costs of their compassion to others.


There's an article I wish I could give you to read, but it seems to have disappeared from the internet. It was from a US publication with Mexican ownership, but I can't recall if it was written by a Mexican or a US researcher.

In any case, the article suggested that the US started having a bigger problem with illegal immigration when it shut down the border with Mexico. The article hypothesized that when the border was more porous, seasonal workers came to the US, worked, then went home to their families, where the money was worth more, and where they had better lives. When that was made more difficult, migrant workers stayed. The recommendation was to OPEN the border, to make it more palatable to work temporarily, then go home.

Obviously, its not a complete explanation. But it dovetails somewhat with your post. And I always found it interesting.

The main issue I see with your suggestion is the cost. There are visiting worker visas. But the employers need to demonstrate that they cannot hire in the US, then go through an application process -- costly. Then there is the bureaucracy on the other end, for workers who are doing these jobs in many cases because they don't have the wherewithal to jump through those kinds of hurdles.

But in general, I think you have some good ideas.
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m in Israel









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:25 pm
marina wrote:
If you are homeless, you don't get to break into someone's home and steal stuff. But you do get other help: you get agencies to try and put you on your feet again, you get people who are kind to you and give of themselves to try and make your life better. Because people understand that it was the luck of the draw and that the wheel of fortune turns and one day they may in fact be in your position.

Sure, we need to have immigration rules and borders and whatever. Otherwise, it's just impractical. But that doesn't mean we adopt an ignorant attitude of "I'm so special because I came here legally and why are you cutting the line, must be because you are lazy and entitled." It means we understand that most illegal immigrants come here illegally out of desperation like a homeless man who steals a loaf of bread. And if your attitude towards that man is anger instead of pity, there's something really wrong.


So your problem is not with immigration policy or the idea of enforcing it (I.e. sending back illegal aliens), it is just that you think it should be done with pity and not with anger? In that case I agree completely. I don't have any anger towards individuals who broke the law out of desperation to try to make a better life for themselves -- but I still think that as a society we have every right to enforce the law. Telling me how hard it is to immigrate legally or how terrible life is in so many other countries certainly arouses my pity but doesn't change anything in terms of the practical implementation of policy. I mean, if you want to go that route, why are those who actually made it here illegally any more entitled to be here than those still left behind? None of this is about who is "entitled" to anything but rather what the U.S. should do to maintain the integrity of its borders.
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SixOfWands









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:28 pm
Squishy wrote:
Where do you think the line should be drawn? Or do you think we should have no borders and take in the billions of folks that have it worse than us?

What about those abusing the U visas falsely claiming they are victims of crimes. Any one of these people are needy, but there are billions of them.

I am fine with deporting criminals.


The line is above my pay grade.

In terms of deporting criminals, it depends on what the crime is. Felonies. Hurting other people. Probably. Misdemeanors? Crimes that were committed decades ago? Crimes that relate to their undocumented status? Probably not.

I think we need to deal with the facts on the ground. The DREAM Act was a start, and let's hope the arrest of the DREAM-er was a mistake. Develop a sensible immigration policy that accounts for the needs of the US economy for certain types of workers, and that allows immigration of people who are at risk. Develop of sensible plan for people here that isn't either extreme of "let them all stay" (even if they are criminals) or "kick 'em all out" (even if they arrived as children, have held jobs, and now have children and families of their own).
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L K









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:33 pm
To answer op:

My husband couldn't get his car detailed because there were no workers to do that.
Regular car wash took forever because many workers were absent, and only two domestic guys were in.

A Mexican worker delivered my lunch from pizza shop, kindly ordered by some friends.

ETA: my washing machine finally was fixed today by an American appliance repair guy. Judging from his appearance and name I would venture to guess he was born in the states, just like another repairman that came two weeks ago.
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wondergirl









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:38 pm
SixOfWands wrote:
Ask the president.

Since the election, he's gotten permission to hire 64 foreign guest workers at Mar-a-Lago, and I'm not sure how many more at Trump Winery. In both cases, the businesses had to warrant that they could not get American workers to do the job. And he's been saying that for years.

I respect you for using your name. But will you say this to people here? Tell them that the answer to their financial woes is to stop going upstate for the summer, and start heading out to the fields to pick crops?

The fact is that American workers do not want, and will not take, these jobs. Sadly.

If Trump is hiring illegal aliens then he is absolutely wrong but that is not what you are saying. He is following the laws when he is hiring foreign guest workers legally.

He should absolutely be hiring American citizens even if they are college students who just need jobs temporarily while they are in college. He can also create an internship program where students get credit and a stipend in exchange for a job at the hotel or winery. I hope he starts a program like that for American citizens who can use the assistance and I doubt anyone will turn down an opportunity like that.

That said, do you know which countries he is hiring people from and if they go through a vetting process to come here?
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marina









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 12:51 pm
m in Israel wrote:
So your problem is not with immigration policy or the idea of enforcing it (I.e. sending back illegal aliens), it is just that you think it should be done with pity and not with anger? In that case I agree completely. I don't have any anger towards individuals who broke the law out of desperation to try to make a better life for themselves -- but I still think that as a society we have every right to enforce the law. Telling me how hard it is to immigrate legally or how terrible life is in so many other countries certainly arouses my pity but doesn't change anything in terms of the practical implementation of policy. I mean, if you want to go that route, why are those who actually made it here illegally any more entitled to be here than those still left behind? None of this is about who is "entitled" to anything but rather what the U.S. should do to maintain the integrity of its borders.


If you look at my posts in this thread, you'll see that I'm answering not people who are reasonably discussing policy, but those who are obnoxiously singing their own praises because clearly they worked very hard to be born into families that didn't have to immigrate or do so illegally. Enforce the laws? Yes, enforce the laws. Don't have a holier-than-thou attitude about it though.
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SixOfWands









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 1:07 pm
wondergirl wrote:
If Trump is hiring illegal aliens then he is absolutely wrong but that is not what you are saying. He is following the laws when he is hiring foreign guest workers legally.

He should absolutely be hiring American citizens even if they are college students who just need jobs temporarily while they are in college. He can also create an internship program where students get credit and a stipend in exchange for a job at the hotel or winery. I hope he starts a program like that for American citizens who can use the assistance and I doubt anyone will turn down an opportunity like that.

That said, do you know which countries he is hiring people from and if they go through a vetting process to come here?


In order to hire these guest workers, he has to warrant that he tried to hire Americans, but couldn't.

Is he being truthful? I've no idea. I imagine that some of the jobs at Mar-a-Lago might be easier to fill than he claims. Then again, people don't like scrubbing toilets at high end resorts any better than they do at the Motel 6, so I could be wrong.

The point is simply that your repeated statements that Americans should just take the jobs doesn't make it so. These are jobs that Americans do not want, and do not take. (And what college credits do you think that picking grapes would entitle you to?)

I do have a cleaning person (who happens to be a US citizen), but I suspect that she would like to retire soon. Do you really think that if I give my local black-hat yeshiva a call, the bochurs will be lining up for a chance to make some spare cash by cleaning my bathroom and scrubbing my floors? Because I don't think that's the case. (We don't have a nearby MO yeshiva, but I can pretty much guarantee you they wouldn't want to.)
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Fox









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 1:14 pm
SixOfWands wrote:
In any case, the article suggested that the US started having a bigger problem with illegal immigration when it shut down the border with Mexico. The article hypothesized that when the border was more porous, seasonal workers came to the US, worked, then went home to their families, where the money was worth more, and where they had better lives. When that was made more difficult, migrant workers stayed. The recommendation was to OPEN the border, to make it more palatable to work temporarily, then go home.


I remember that research if not the specific article. Making the employers jump through hoops is crazy. That means they'll only be willing to do so for highly-qualified candidates who can be hired for less than American workers, which is precisely the scenario that we don't want.

I didn't get into the role of money transfers to other countries, but that's a huge element of the U.S. relationship with Mexico, and it's really, really not something we want to disrupt too much. A strong Mexican economy is in everyone's best interests.

There are obviously logistical things I'm unaware of or I'm not taking into account, but it seems like everyone would benefit from a metaphorical "border wall" with a lot of doors that are pretty easy for law-abiding people to walk through.
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Squishy









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 1:33 pm
SixOfWands wrote:
In order to hire these guest workers, he has to warrant that he tried to hire Americans, but couldn't.

Is he being truthful? I've no idea. I imagine that some of the jobs at Mar-a-Lago might be easier to fill than he claims. Then again, people don't like scrubbing toilets at high end resorts any better than they do at the Motel 6, so I could be wrong.

The point is simply that your repeated statements that Americans should just take the jobs doesn't make it so. These are jobs that Americans do not want, and do not take. (And what college credits do you think that picking grapes would entitle you to?)

I do have a cleaning person (who happens to be a US citizen), but I suspect that she would like to retire soon. Do you really think that if I give my local black-hat yeshiva a call, the bochurs will be lining up for a chance to make some spare cash by cleaning my bathroom and scrubbing my floors? Because I don't think that's the case. (We don't have a nearby MO yeshiva, but I can pretty much guarantee you they wouldn't want to.)


There is a big disincentive for Americans to work in the lower income brackets.

Most in certain circles are conditioned to automatically go on programs when they are married young. In many cases they are already on programs when they get married. Earning a paycheck on the books could cost them certain benefits moving forward forever.

The second problem is a lack of skills and a sense of entitlement. DH has been approached several times with young guys wanting to learn his business. They want to come in at management levels but have no blue collar skills. They don't want to learn the business from the bottom up. How can they supervise if they aren't willing to start by doing the job of those they are supervising?

When I got my first masters, I was hired by NYC in management to improve productivity in a large uniformed workforce. I knew nothing about their job, but I can crunch data. It was stupid. The department would have been better served by having someone with real hands on experience.
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SacN









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 1:56 pm
Quote:
And since when are doctors, Ph.D. students, teachers, lawyers, etc "cleaning ladies"?


If by since when, you mean since they became immigrants? Because I know plenty of very well educated immigrants who work (or have worked, while they re-certified, learned english, etc) menial jobs.

I myself am an immigrant (not to the US), and had to make changes to my profession. My husband had to take professional exams in a language he was not educated in--though he had a huge advantage in that he spoke it already. If he hadn't, it would have been extremely difficult to work. He's a lawyer. I was a teacher.

I grew up in the US, and knew plenty of teenagers who did farm labor over the summers, or washed dishes in restaurants, or schlepped boxes for warehouses.

The fact that frum kids are unavailable for these jobs is a product of their society and not reflective of Americans as a whole. I have a local friend who is studying for an advanced agricultural degree--as a wine grape breeder (or whatever that's actually called). Personally, I think that's even more prestigious than many lawyers I know...
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wondergirl









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 2:00 pm
SixOfWands wrote:
In order to hire these guest workers, he has to warrant that he tried to hire Americans, but couldn't.

Is he being truthful? I've no idea. I imagine that some of the jobs at Mar-a-Lago might be easier to fill than he claims. Then again, people don't like scrubbing toilets at high end resorts any better than they do at the Motel 6, so I could be wrong.

The point is simply that your repeated statements that Americans should just take the jobs doesn't make it so. These are jobs that Americans do not want, and do not take. (And what college credits do you think that picking grapes would entitle you to?)

I do have a cleaning person (who happens to be a US citizen), but I suspect that she would like to retire soon. Do you really think that if I give my local black-hat yeshiva a call, the bochurs will be lining up for a chance to make some spare cash by cleaning my bathroom and scrubbing my floors? Because I don't think that's the case. (We don't have a nearby MO yeshiva, but I can pretty much guarantee you they wouldn't want to.)

The hotel/winery hires cooks, waiters and housekeepers and many American citizens are qualified to do the work.

For cooks, he can have an internship arrangement with culinary schools who can have their students intern at the hotel/winery in exchange for credits and a stipend which is very common procedure for students in all fields.

You don't need much skills to be waiters or housekeepers so high school/college students can do that temporarily while they are in school/college.

Of course, if he is looking for older, mature people to do this kind of work then he would need to pay more money bc they presumably need to support themselves and their families as well so it would have to be worth it for them to work there which doesn't seem to be the case. I am guessing that many people need to make more than $10-12 dollars an hour (minus taxes) which may be the reason why he has trouble hiring American citizens so hiring college students would be the best deal for everyone involved.

It shouldn't be too hard to find qualified high school or college aged American citizens to do this kind of work but if the law allows him to legally hire foreigners instead then blame former congress members (or whoever came up with this law) for it , not Trump.

However, this is where you would need to differentiate between immigrants/foreigners who came here legally versus illegal aliens who broke the law by coming here without a sponsor or green card, or overstayed their visas, etc. Trump didn't hire illegal aliens, he got approval from the government to legally hire foreigners.

Do you understand the difference between legal immigrants and illegal aliens and why people are angry that illegal aliens are being protected by some politicians despite the fact that they broke the law?

Do you think that illegal aliens should be penalized for breaking American law? If so how should they be penalized? If not, then why are they above the law?
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m in Israel









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 2:47 pm
marina wrote:
If you look at my posts in this thread, you'll see that I'm answering not people who are reasonably discussing policy, but those who are obnoxiously singing their own praises because clearly they worked very hard to be born into families that didn't have to immigrate or do so illegally. Enforce the laws? Yes, enforce the laws. Don't have a holier-than-thou attitude about it though.


Oh, I thought you were addressing me because you quoted my post.
I agree a holier-than-thou attitude is not appropriate on this topic which is complex and heartbreaking anyway you look at it.

And as I said earlier, I do think the overall immigration policy in the U.S. needs rampant revamping to address all sorts of issues such as the need for workers, as has been addressed a bit in this thread.
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SixOfWands









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 2:56 pm
wondergirl wrote:
The hotel/winery hires cooks, waiters and housekeepers and many American citizens are qualified to do the work.

For cooks, he can have an internship arrangement with culinary schools who can have their students intern at the hotel/winery in exchange for credits and a stipend which is very common procedure for students in all fields.

You don't need much skills to be waiters or housekeepers so high school/college students can do that temporarily while they are in school/college.

Of course, if he is looking for older, mature people to do this kind of work then he would need to pay more money bc they presumably need to support themselves and their families as well so it would have to be worth it for them to work there which doesn't seem to be the case. I am guessing that many people need to make more than $10-12 dollars an hour (minus taxes) which may be the reason why he has trouble hiring American citizens so hiring college students would be the best deal for everyone involved.

It shouldn't be too hard to find qualified high school or college aged American citizens to do this kind of work but if the law allows him to legally hire foreigners instead then blame former congress members (or whoever came up with this law) for it , not Trump.

However, this is where you would need to differentiate between immigrants/foreigners who came here legally versus illegal aliens who broke the law by coming here without a sponsor or green card, or overstayed their visas, etc. Trump didn't hire illegal aliens, he got approval from the government to legally hire foreigners.

Do you understand the difference between legal immigrants and illegal aliens and why people are angry that illegal aliens are being protected by some politicians despite the fact that they broke the law?

Do you think that illegal aliens should be penalized for breaking American law? If so how should they be penalized? If not, then why are they above the law?


Trump got permission because he claimed that no Americans were available to take these jobs.

And that's the case broadly.

You seem to think that by snapping your fingers, you can get Americans to take minimum wage jobs picking crops, or cleaning, or in slaughterhouses, etc. But evidence shows us that you can't.
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MagentaYenta









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 3:20 pm
wondergirl wrote:
The hotel/winery hires cooks, waiters and housekeepers and many American citizens are qualified to do the work.

For cooks, he can have an internship arrangement with culinary schools who can have their students intern at the hotel/winery in exchange for credits and a stipend which is very common procedure for students in all fields.

You don't need much skills to be waiters or housekeepers so high school/college students can do that temporarily while they are in school/college.

Of course, if he is looking for older, mature people to do this kind of work then he would need to pay more money bc they presumably need to support themselves and their families as well so it would have to be worth it for them to work there which doesn't seem to be the case. I am guessing that many people need to make more than $10-12 dollars an hour (minus taxes) which may be the reason why he has trouble hiring American citizens so hiring college students would be the best deal for everyone involved.

It shouldn't be too hard to find qualified high school or college aged American citizens to do this kind of work but if the law allows him to legally hire foreigners instead then blame former congress members (or whoever came up with this law) for it , not Trump....


I don't think that anyone paying the prices they do at the Trump hotels would be happy with some 2nd year student doing their apprenticeship as a full chef. That is not how the world of high end dining works. That legitimate apprenticeship will have the student trimming beans for 12 hours a day.

As to waiters in high end dining, some get a salary + tips, some get a minimum salary +tips and some states mandate tip pooling. The waiter will then use some of their tips to tip his busboy and the expediter. But all an all waitstaff at luxury hotels make bank and have to have years of experience. It's not like a coffee shop where the tips are measured in 25 cent coins.

Reality tells me that those foreign employees at Trumps business are general housekeeping, grounds workers and maintenance. It's likely none are taking the skilled jobs like HVAC, chef, medical staff, or physical plant management.
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wondergirl









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 3:23 pm
SixOfWands wrote:
Trump got permission because he claimed that no Americans were available to take these jobs.

And that's the case broadly.

You seem to think that by snapping your fingers, you can get Americans to take minimum wage jobs picking crops, or cleaning, or in slaughterhouses, etc. But evidence shows us that you can't.

The govt believed his claims and didn't think he was lying so you have to speak to them about it. Oh and it was the Obama administration that approved it for the last 8 years so perhaps Obama had ulterior motives as well...

I don't think I can snap my fingers to get anyone to take a job. But if college students want to qualify for financial aid then they should at least have a part time job to show that they not just taking advantage of tax dollars. How quickly do you think Trump would be able to fill all these positions with American citizens if college students had to prove they are working in order to get financial aid for college?
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SixOfWands









  


Post  Thu, Feb 16 2017, 3:35 pm
wondergirl wrote:
The govt believed his claims and didn't think he was lying so you have to speak to them about it. Oh and it was the Obama administration that approved it for the last 8 years so perhaps Obama had ulterior motives as well...

I don't think I can snap my fingers to get anyone to take a job. But if college students want to qualify for financial aid then they should at least have a part time job to show that they not just taking advantage of tax dollars. How quickly do you think Trump would be able to fill all these positions with American citizens if college students had to prove they are working in order to get financial aid for college?


I didn't suggest that Trump was lying. In fact, I suggested that he was completely honest, in that there are a large number of positions that cannot be filled by American workers. You're the one who thinks that he could quickly fill those positions with Americans.

Students who receive financial aid may also received a work study award, where they are paid for doing certain work. Its usually minimum wage, and a lot of colleges practically survive on work study students and other student workers. About 70% of college students work, in some capacity, while in college. But the government cannot force college students, or anyone else, to accept minimum wage positions. Or any other position, for that matter.

Farm workers usually work 14 hours a day, 6 days a week. They don't offer breaks during they day so you can go to your accounting class.

So try again.
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