How to avoid invites from hosts we don't care for

mommy3b2c

Sun, Dec 31 2017, 3:32 pm

amother wrote:

If you came to my house for a shabbos meal I probably wouldn't have challah to offer you. I would have some matzah in the pantry.
And I will admit, I have food issues and am socially off.
And despite all of my food issues and social awkwardness I still enjoy having company.
And if I were to call you every week , and you repeatedly declined my invites, and I continued inviting you, that would add another dimension to my existing weirdness.
So, socially weird or not, food issues or not, you dont want to eat there again? And you want her to stop calling you? So find a nice way to make it happen.
One thing is clear to me: when you are invited out you want to be served well. Find a way to make it hapoen. "Thanks for inviting us. I have a big appetite and it works best for me to stay home where I can eat to my heart's content. Nothing personal about you, I just don't expect people to spend all that money to feed me"

If you enjoy having company, wouldn’t it be worth it for you to work on your issues?

Raisin

Sun, Dec 31 2017, 3:32 pm

cm wrote:

IME people from Brooklyn refer to spreads as dips. I have only seen "dips" served as a first course when visiting Brooklyn, although it may be done other places as well (I'm "OOT" and I would serve spreads with challah as a light meal, such as seudah shelishit, or lunch on a weekday).

Its a very Israeli/sefardi thing to serve salatim - chumus, matbucha, cooked vegetable salads, chatzilim and so on as a first course. I have quite a lot of Israeli guests and this is very important to them. (one week someone asked me if I had a certain salad that wasn't on the table. Rolling Eyes

) My family also like it although I could care less.

etky

Sun, Dec 31 2017, 4:00 pm

Raisin wrote:

) My family also like it although I could care less.

Yes. It is an Israeli - especially sefardi thing. Back in Poland people weren't eating matbucha, chumous, tehina and chatzilim. They weren't eating them in the States either when I was growing up. Our 'salatim' were tuna, egg salad and smoked whitefish - maybe guacamole for the more adventurous - and they were consigned to seuda shlishit. Oh, and chopped herring too.
When we have Israeli friends over on Shabbat I do make concessions and serve salatim along with the challah. I also make sure to have a non-sweet, store bought water challah on hand as my own challot are quite sweet and don't go well with the salatim.
When it is just us or when our guests are Anglo we just use my sweet challah. We go right to a plated first course and skip the salatim entirely. No one misses or even expects them.

nachlaot

Sun, Dec 31 2017, 5:31 pm

op here again.

1. woah, it looks like someone above totally missed the point and sent this thread into an odd tailspin about challah. thankfully, this amother gets it:

amother wrote:

Aside, from that - she said that the other courses were on par with theses amounts. Even with those who don't care for much challa - I would imagine that they serve enough other food, which obviously isn't the case here.

that's the point. as I said in my prior post, "that's a representative example of all the courses they're serving."

2. to the folks accusing me of "trashing" these people, I'm not posting just to rant about them. I'm trying to get advice about how to handle the situation of avoiding them and declining their invites.

if I wanted to trash them, I could go on and on with more examples of them having insufficient food. instead, I'll just stick with the challah example as a typical example of all their courses.

3. we don't really know their motives and why they're wanting to have guests over, but I question whether they even should be hosting young people in kiruv-ish situations. if someone thinking about becoming observant / early on the path to becoming observant gets set up at a meal like this, this sort of shabbat meal could be a major turn off.

tichellady

Sun, Dec 31 2017, 5:53 pm

amother wrote:

I think that it’s a universal thing that when people are invited for a meal they want to be served well. Doesn’t need to be fancy or expensive food, but enough that people feel satisfied. I don’t think it’s nice to invite people to a meal and not feed them adequately. Better to invite them Just to visit or play a game, have coffee etc and make it clear that there is no meal

nachlaot

Sun, Dec 31 2017, 7:54 pm

tichellady wrote:

exactly. it doesn't need to be fancy or expensive food -- or even particularly good food.

also, it's not just about filling our stomachs. it's uncomfortable for us -- and all their other guests -- to be at this family's shabbat when they bring out a communal serving dish for 8 people that would be a portion for one person at any other shabbat dinner.

everyone has to awkwardly take a thimble full of food and be embarrassed if they even take that much because the last few people to have the dish will end up with half a thimble full of food.

imho, putting your guests in such an uncomfortable position is rude.

etky

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 12:20 am

nachlaot wrote:

op here again.

1. woah, it looks like someone above totally missed the point and sent this thread into an odd tailspin about challah. thankfully, this amother gets it:

that's the point. as I said in my prior post, "that's a representative example of all the courses they're serving."

2. to the folks accusing me of "trashing" these people, I'm not posting just to rant about them. I'm trying to get advice about how to handle the situation of avoiding them and declining their invites.

if I wanted to trash them, I could go on and on with more examples of them having insufficient food. instead, I'll just stick with the challah example as a typical example of all their courses.

3. we don't really know their motives and why they're wanting to have guests over, but I question whether they even should be hosting young people in kiruv-ish situations. if someone thinking about becoming observant / early on the path to becoming observant gets set up at a meal like this, this sort of shabbat meal could be a major turn off.

I'm sorry. This situation sounds very uncomfortable. What are their kids eating while the adults are being served these miniscule thimble-sized portions?

amother

Royalblue

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 7:21 am

I grew up with an abusive father who had extreme OCD when it came to food. so our meals were really odd and scant when we were younger.
My mother always graved a full shabbos table with guests. She held onto her perceived sense normalcy no matter what.
In addition after years of abuse my mother lost touch with what is considered normal.
so there may have been a time when guests were invited but not enough food was served- And my parents were not lacking money...
Now that the children are older there is more food around.
When thinks seem off, they usually are off.
When bells ring in your head, They are usually ringing for a reason.

amother

Ruby

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 8:10 am

nachlaot wrote:

inviting them over is *even weirder* to me.

they're nice enough people, but we don't really have anything in common with these people. they don't even go to our shul, and we never would otherwise see them unless we happened to pass them by on the street.

we're a young couple w/o kids. we don't host much, but if we do, it's a small thing with other young singles/couple. it's be pretty awkward if the two of us hosted a shabbat meal for a couple 10-15 years older and all of their kids.

again, I don't think they're wanting to be our friends and come over to our place. they host every week, as I understand it. they want to feel like they're doing a chesed project for the young people in the community by inviting a bunch of us to shabbat at their house.

I don't think inviting them to your place would be weird at all, even if they're 10-15 years older and have kids while you don't. Some couples have similar age gaps and larger! Maybe if they came to your place they might get more clued up about what an appropriate/ normal Shabbat meal is like with guests.

You say you don't think they want to come to your house, but you don't know until you ask. Personally, I'd invite them anyway and they can Always turn down the invitation if they don't want to come.

If you simply want to avoid them, just keep refusing their invitation and they'll eventually get the message and stop inviting you. "I'm sorry, we already have plans for that Shabbat." "I'm sorry we can't do that week." "Thanks, but we're having a quiet Shabbat at home this week."

They definitely sounds a bit off. As you said, it was not just the challah that was served in tiny portions, and it was not just one week either. If it's really an issue of money, why don't they host once a month instead of every week?

moonstone

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 8:30 am

DrMom wrote:

I realize this isn't the main focus of this conversation, but I also don't call humus and matbucha, etc. "dips." You don't dip your challah into them, they way you dip a tortilla chip into salsa. I would call them "spreads."

And we don't eat tons of challah. Just a slice or 1/2 slice each for hamotzei.

We have lots of food, just not challah.

I never heard of calling them "dips" (and I agree, they are not dips!) until imamother. Is this a Brooklyn thing? We don't have a dips/spread course, we just go right to the real food. We like... spreads, but we'd rather not fill up on them.

mommy3b2c

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 10:05 am

moonstone wrote:

It’s not it’s own course, it’s served with the fish. Before we make kiddish, I set the table with challah, dips and salads. I also put out a platter of fish-gefilte and salmon. Or I plate the fish individually and put one at each place. Then we we make kiddish and wash. Everyone gets a slice of challah. The rest of the challah is sliced and put in middle of the table. Then people shmooze while eating challah, dips, salads and fish. Then comes the soup. Then the main course and then dessert.

amother

Red

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 10:13 am

mommy3b2c wrote:

This.
Traditionally, the first course is usually a 'fish' course so people often serve dips to go with it. (I personally only like the dips together with fish though some people like it plain with challa.)
I live in England and we call it dips too. All the kosher recipe books call it that way as well.
I might not be the correct term, though that seems to be the way it has evolved.

Dh doesn't like fish so I usually only serve fish and dips when we have guests. Or sometimes he prepares a piece of salmon for me because he knows I like it Very Happy

amother

Ecru

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 4:50 pm

I would go about once a month and always send something before Shabbos. This way you know there'll be something there for you to eat...send something you and DH enjoy and hopefully any other guests at their table. Maybe also something for dessert. The rest of the time tell them you enjoy quality alone time with just you and DH because you need to relax after a stressful week.

amother

Ecru

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 5:03 pm

What people serve for their Shabbat meals does not necessarily reflect on their bank accounts. I had a very well to do neighbor who once came frantically knocking at my door after I had already lit Shabbat candles (I light 15 minutes early) and asked if I had any extra food because she had some unexpected guests who just arrived and she had nothing to serve them. I said like what? Fish, Challah, salad.... She said whatever you have....I gave her challah from my freezer, a container of pareve ice cream, half a loaf of gefilta fish, and alot more. I tend to overbuy and overspend even when there's no company coming, and she prepares exactly for the amount of people in her household...one piece of chicken per person, one serving of fish, etc. etc.
But to the OP I would say what many others above already suggested....go occasionally just to make them feel good and bring something with you or send it beforehand...a home baked cake for dessert, some home baked challos....or a specialty salad for which you tried a new recipe... You will have the mitzvah of feeding the needy, if they really need it, and otherwise you will enjoy having things to eat which you and your husband would enjoy having.

mommy3b2c

Mon, Jan 01 2018, 5:06 pm

amother wrote:

Once a month??

Once every six months should suffice.