S/O copy school | Imamother

amother

Sun, Aug 20 2023, 10:12 am

People on this forum keep mentioning copy school that seems to yield pushy and distasteful ad in magazines.

Since when was copy school a thing?
My great aunt used to write for the NYTimes - she never went to copy school. My grandmother has the same talent and has written in Jewish publications - also no copy school.
I know people in marketing - they make and design ads and choose where to display them - also no copy school.

Why is there copy school but no:
Florist school, party planner school, personal organizer school, sourdough school, and then there’s copy school.
Isn’t writing a Chush just like the other hobbies listed above?

LovesHashem

Sun, Aug 20 2023, 10:50 am

Of course there's courses for all those things!

The world was very different 50 years ago. It was called marketing and people went to marketing school.

In every industry you have those who didn't take a course or go to school.

amother

Sun, Aug 20 2023, 1:34 pm

I heard about copy school on a few different threads here. I can’t remember where.

I find it strange that everyone is taking these courses now.
In my days you either went to real school to learn a trade or you had the talent and picked it yourself and might work with a professional to perfect your skill.
The relative who wrote for The Times went to a real school (she got a masters in something related to writing) and the one who wrote for Jewish publications didn’t but had the talent.

Now a days every young girl takes these “masterclasses” to become makeup artist, shaitle machers or copywriters. Many of them aren’t so good but they call themselves professionals. It’s so strange to me.

amother

Ivory

Sun, Aug 20 2023, 2:19 pm

amother OP wrote:

Not any different than in secular society.
Look up video clips of Batya Ungar-Sargon speaking about this (she's interviewed on Fox news quite a bit)....she wrote a book based on this premise last year. Basically, years ago journalism used to be a blue collar job with most journalists learning on the job/no college degree. Now it's become a job of the elites and you need to have degree from a top college to have a shot at breaking into the field.
So this has just trickled down into the frum world.

zaq

Sun, Aug 20 2023, 7:50 pm

You know, in Abe Lincoln's day, he didn't go to law school. He, like many others, read law books and apprenticed with a practicing lawyer. In theory you don't need to attend law school today, provided you can pass the bar exam without it. Most people wouldn't have what it takes to do this.

vintagebknyc

Sun, Aug 20 2023, 8:27 pm

zaq wrote:

While I am loathe to ever disagree with you, my dear Zaq, this is not fully true. I believe there are only two states where you can take the bar without law school--one is Massachusetts--and at least there you must have worked with attorneys as background.

amother

Cerise

Sun, Aug 20 2023, 8:43 pm

vintagebknyc wrote:

Interesting to me that MA, home of Harvard, is one of the two states.

ora_43

Mon, Aug 21 2023, 2:28 am

Ugh don't get me started...

I think in an ideal world we'd still have these 'schools,' because for some people it's a valuable shortcut. The same way some people learn a new language fine on their own and some do better with a formal class. And while ultimately writing, editing, photography, baking, etc, are all things that you have to learn through practice, and it is possible to just start work and figure out the tricks of the trade as you go along - still, having a good teacher can save you years of trial and error.

BUT.

These days you're expected to go to school for every little freaking thing. I hate it so so so so much. At least copy tribe isn't a full-on academic degree, there are too many jobs to count that require a 4-year degree for literally no reason.

I once interviewed for a job that was, I'd say, the second step up that particular career ladder, and paid around $2,800 a month. At one point the interviewer asked, "I see you don't have a doctorate, why is that?"

I wish I was kidding.

amother

Aconite

Mon, Aug 21 2023, 2:31 am

zaq wrote:

This tempts me so much to do it just to say I did.
Thankfully I don't have time (and don't love law enough either).

amother

Dustypink

Mon, Aug 21 2023, 2:41 am

Writing is a skill that can be polished like any other. Of course some can make it big without any training, just like any other creative field.

Copytribe happens to focus a LOT on building a business and not everyone who graduates the course can write above a second grade level. Speaking from personal experience trying to hire a graduate. I guess because there’s no criteria for acceptance so anyone can join?

ora_43

Mon, Aug 21 2023, 5:10 am

amother Dustypink wrote:

I guess because there’s no criteria for acceptance so anyone can join?

Good point.

I said courses are better than needing a degree but at least degree programs tend to have acceptance standards, and to fail out students in their first semester/year if they aren't up to standard. A lot of these courses will take anyone with money. They don't care if you have no real chance of success no matter what they teach you. As long as your payment goes through it's all good.

amother

Phlox

Mon, Aug 21 2023, 2:24 pm

amother Dustypink wrote:

Really odd. I've taken writing certification courses and you need to pass a written exam to show that your skills are up to their standards.

amother

Chambray

Mon, Aug 21 2023, 2:38 pm

amother OP wrote:

You would be surprised. Some people who took Cope computers years ago are doing quite nicely for themselves without a degree.
What many of these courses like copy or graphics etc offer is coursework focused on the idea, no electives, with ongoing support and Slack groups, and lifetime access to the classes. Someone who is determined can do quite well in some of these fields.

amother

Chambray

Mon, Aug 21 2023, 2:39 pm

amother Phlox wrote:

Really odd. I've taken writing certification courses and you need to pass a written exam to show that your skills are up to their standards.

I heard that there was some screening for the newest cohort.