S/o Everyone needs to move to Israel

giftedmom

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:14 pm

amother Bellflower wrote:

I don't care to move. I don't like the way the country is set up to live. Nothing to do with loving EY. This is abt how the govt & current systems are. As soon as we have the money we will buy an apartment there and we will go for yt etc, but I don't want to educate my kids there or to shop there or live there ft as is now.

Yep. Not to mention I don’t want to endanger my family nor do I want my teens drafted.

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:15 pm

joonabug wrote:

im reading the other thread now and im seeing so many people say things like "find me a job", "find me a community", "find my kids schools" etc. I understand its really not so pashut to just pick up with big kids and move to another country, really I get that. but I just think everyone should really reflect for a little and think about how much do they really care to live in EY. obviously now most people cant just pick up and move, but what happened when you were a newlywed? I get that its hard to leave your whole family, and that its a hard transition, and that its hard to find a job, no one said any of this was easy, but its doable, and if it was important you would do it, or at the very least try to make it happen. also, how many people here are encouraging their newlywed children to move to EY? I cant answer these questions for anyone else but I just hate all the excuses. Believe it or not, there are houses, cars, jobs, schools, healthcare and everything else a person needs to live, in EY. ofc its hard, and it might be too late for many of us but its not too late for some of us and not too late for our children.
btw I am living in EY and I moved when I got married and trust me it wasn't easy and I have no family here and I miss them so much but I really feel what I am doing is the most emes and iyH Hashem should help and BezH I will have made this difficult step that will benefit all of my future descendants.

What happened when I was a newlywed? DH didn’t want to go then either. (That’s my reason but everyone has theirs). How does it help to dwell on the past.

I didn’t go then. I’d love to go now but I can’t.

And this is just another thread of exactly the same thing.

Someone who lives there on their high horse hating on us who don’t live there

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:18 pm

joonabug wrote:

yeah I guess you guys are right that if people dont care to move or want to move, then they wont regardless if they could make it work But then just admit it that you just dont care to move and thats it. I hate all the excuses.

Why is there so much hate about this topic?? I don’t feel hate from others in my community who lives their lives differently like ive felt from those who made Aliyah and think they’ve got all the answers.

One thing I know and only one thing, the gedolim have said that it’s hate towards others that destroyed the last Beis Hamikdash

We are all fellow Jews how we choose to keep Mitzvos is between us and Hashem.

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:19 pm

amother Anemone wrote:

People do say that.

I've said on the other threads that I don't want to make aliyah, even giving the reasons why (although I don't owe anyone an explanation) but I'm told in no uncertain terms that I'm 1000% wrong!!

I'm told it's 'just excuses', but they're not, they're valid reasons. Very valid.

Same

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:20 pm

amother Lilac wrote:

Yeah, sometimes when I see excuses like - I would move but I love my mentor here, or - I would move but my kids like to watch clips and wear sneakers…. Etc, I try to picture a polish Jew saying these things in 1938 and it sounds ridiculously laughable. We probably aren’t at a 1938 yet. But by the time we do reach those days, it may very well be too late.

So you propose every Jew should just get up and leave? What about those who can't? What about those who do Kiruv. Hashem put us exactly where we need to be. I’m not still in the USA by mistake

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:21 pm

amother Lilac wrote:

“I see excuses like…” that sounds like a teacher who talks down to a student.

amother

Mayflower

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:27 pm

I will be honest, though I know some won’t like it.

Even when I was a newlywed, it was too late. I was born and raised in America. I speak English. I know the culture here. My DH was used to learning in American yeshivos. I know the education system here. Moving to EY at any stage, though wonderful, is hard.

I have never had a Rov tell me it’s an obligation above all else to move to EY. I admire those who live there. I like to visit. But right now, realistically, it’s still galus. I will gladly move when moshiach comes.

amother

Anemone

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:31 pm

joonabug wrote:

.
in america rn for my BILs wedding

Mazel tov.

I have a relative who lives in ey who won't leave for anything, not even for a bil's wedding.

Wondering how those who feel that yishuv ey is the most important mitzvah which everyone should be doing (not you, you're just wondering about it) would feel if there neighbours in ey would tell them that when they're off to a wedding in chul....

That's they should 'stop being so frum'? Or would they say 'you're right' and cancel their ticket? Or maybe ask their lor?

Just wondering.

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:31 pm

amother Lilac wrote:

So you propose people should move because of safety, not because we love the land and it’s our home?

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:32 pm

amother Olive wrote:

Not leaving elderly parents is an excuse?
If you think so, shame on you.

Not being able to transfer a job or needing to start job search from scratch is an excuse?
If you think so, you have no compassion.

Not being able to find a community that fits is an excuse?
If you think so, I have no words for you.

It’s so sad. I find that those that made Aliyah forget the other mitzvah of judging each person favorably (at least equally as important as yishuv E”Y).

amother

Blonde

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:33 pm

There's a very serious risk in moving w older kids. I don't know if anyone has done a good study on the rate of kids dropping out of Yiddishkeit in US, Israelis in Israel, vs Olim families.

But the people who have gone through it can tell you it's very real.

We know a family whose kids were being bullied, some were molested, things were really bad for them. They spoke to many Rabbonim in EY who all gave them brachos & advised patience.

One day a friend dragged them, protesting all the way, to an American Gadol who was visiting in EY. He told them "leave tomorrow". Without first finding jobs, housing, schools. Because their kids were figuratively dying!

(Please notice I did not say literally, which many seem to do in a similar context. But that's another conversation...)

amother

Burlywood

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:34 pm

amother Lilac wrote:

Our last horrible experience in galus was the Holocaust. All of us are traumatized by it and every time anything happens it triggers us. We jump and automatically say “Poland 1938” . We see in our mind’s eye grainy black and white pictures of Hitler’s rise to power.
In reality we’ve been through a lot in the last 2,000 years. All the horrific massacres had a lot in common but a lot of differences.

We don’t know if we’ll go through yet another Shoah before Mashiach’s arrival or if he comes before the next month starts and takes out of galus with no more pain. If something terrible happens to us we don’t know where or how it will happen.

No one in Israel or anywhere in the world predicted the events of October 7. In hindsight we see there were many warnings that were ignored, but no wise imamothers suggested we stay away from Otef Aza.

We’re not any smarter than the thousands of Eastern European Jews who saw the churban coming and left with their families to Holland and France where Hitler hunted them down and took them to the gas chambers. Our best option is to daven for Hashem to send Mashiach and take us out of galus.

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:39 pm

amother Burlywood wrote:

Exactly. Why didn’t the people in the south see the writing on the wall and get out before it’s too late 😮. They should’ve ran away after all its persecution so it’s like 1938. Oh wait, Hashem wanted them there for whatever reason. It’s hard to comprehend, we cry and hurt but we don’t understand Hashems ways. If puranius is meant to find us it will

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 1:40 pm

Also I asked on the last thread and I’ll ask again.
Many gedolei hadar lived and died in Chutz laaretz. Were their reasons for living here just excuses?? Rav Moshe was giving excuses?? (Chas vshalom)). He was the greatest of the great and he didn’t live there.

And wait not only that, but some of their kevarim are here and when people come from E”Y they daven by them 😮. The outrage. How could they, people who lived in the US?? How can they be tzadikim who we daven by.

amother

Midnight

Fri, May 03 2024, 2:55 pm

amother Midnight wrote:

And still no answer on this. The silence is very telling